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One thing I like about the European shows is that they feel 'fresh' and more connected to life here. American shows tend to focus on American themes that feel
by GekkePrutser 6y ago
One thing I like about the European shows is that they feel 'fresh' and more connected to life here.
American shows tend to focus on American themes that feel a little alien to us Europeans. So many military / intelligence team shows, or police shows set in megacities where everyone carries guns.
When I grew up in the 80s/90s, American shows were better than local ones because European actors were very bad at acting. I think this was mainly because they were being trained at schools that still trained for stage plays, with exaggerated pronounciation and gesturing.
But now European shows are also excellent. Thinking of the German DARK, the Spanish casa de papel ("money heist"). It's indeed the translation but also the quality that makes it watchable.
Netflix did indeed boost this partly due to that law mandating the 30% local content but I don't think it's the only reason.
- kuu 6y agoJust a "fun fact" of "Casa de Papel": it was a national series from Atresmedia and later it was bought by Netflix who reedited and redistributed it, making it much more popular
- ivanhoe 6y agoI think it's the case for the most of series coming from European countries, not just on Netflix, but HBO, Amazon, etc. Usually there's a season or too on the national level, and then they're bought by big distributors.
- input_sh 6y agoI mean, Netflix in the Anglosphere isn't much different. A sizable chunk of the "Netflix originals" are just licensed (Snowpiercer, The Good Place) or bought after gaining attention (Black Mirror).
- kzrdude 6y agoI'm happy there is some diversity in which companies are producing these. Watching too many netflix series, they can start to feel a bit too cookie-cutter in how the drama is laid out over an episode or series.
- mrtksn 6y agoI think the whole success of the Hollywood is based on their ability to create films that cut across all the cultures. They tend to be simplistic and yet in a way can actually go very deep, probably because of tapping on the human nature instead of the culture. On the other hand, locally produced films usually tap on the local culture which leads to amazing German/Finnish/Italian/Turkish/French etc. shows making sense only in that culture, thus not gaining traction outside of their locality. At some point we had Brazilian soap operas, now we have Turkish soap operas gaining large traction on TV and probably will be followed why some other ecole. However with Netflix, something different is happening in my opinion. I'm sure that Netflix looks into statistics when doing new shows, EU pushing for a single market on these services could mean that the Netflix shows are indeed optimised for common European consumption instead of local one. Saying that Netflix is the new Eurovision is comedy gold :) I mean, Eurovision is definitely a spectacle but no one(maybe with the exception of Lars Erickssong of Iceland) in EU actually takes it seriously and definitely it's not the cultural event that brings nations together. Eurovision is the show where we accept to be vulnerable for a day, get out there and remember our favourite neighbours by voting for them. If it was a serious thing, the Brits would have won most, sharing it with the Spanish summer hits occasionally. UK is a music and culture powerhouse with extremely poor Eurovision track record.
- SiempreViernes 6y agoIceland is not a EU member. And the UK just don't send very good acts to Eurovision.
- mrtksn 6y agoEurovision is not limited to EU. Even Australia is participating now. Israel, Turkey, Azerbaijan and Georgia are other non-EU members with strong track records in the contest.
- ClumsyPilot 6y ago>"[holywood is] tapping on the human nature instead of the culture" I am wondering what makes you think so, when you are not from US or especially if you are not western a lot of whats going on their looks terribly unnatural. I particularly dislike the way police is portraid in the US shows, in the show I was watching the main character regularly points a gun at random guards and passerbyes and threatens them. They depict torture as mundane business. I mean, even in russian shows we dont portray this as right and proper behaviour.
- koyote 6y agoThis might just be my personal opinion but I feel like a lot of European shows avoid many of the common Hollywood tropes, which is another reason they feel 'fresh'. Most US shows are quite predictable if you've watched similar shows of the same genre and I often find myself guessing the plotline or a plot tool while watching. This did not happen with DARK; in fact, that's how I realised that it avoided many of the tropes because they just did not eventuate when I tried 'guessing'.
- open-source-ux 6y agoWhen the Danish series The Killing was first shown in the UK it was acclaimed by both critics and audiences. Since then, there has been a boom in European dramas shown on UK TV screens, particularly thrillers. (Dramas from Italy, Germany, France, Denmark, Spain, Sweden, Iceland are just some examples.) However, what seems "fresh" at first soon becomes familiar. This is particular true of Scandinanian thrillers. Once you watch a few, you realise they swap one set of familar tropes with their own set. For example, for thrillers: - Many red herrings in the murder case (often not making any sense but carefully planted by the writers to keep audiences guessing). - The death of at least one major (likable) character usually after the audience has warmed to the character. - At most a "bittersweet" ending is provided. A 'happy' ending is never executed: some distress or anxiety must always accompany the main character at the end of a series. Sounds familar?
- GekkePrutser 6y agoYes very familiar. I watched The Bridge ("Bron Broen") and it had all these. It was still OK, but too much of it won't be. And the later seasons were a bit contrived so I stopped after the second one.
- BugWatch 6y agoSounds "real"(istic-ish?).
- buu700 6y agoThis did not happen with DARK; in fact, that's how I realised that it avoided many of the tropes because they just did not eventuate when I tried 'guessing'. Not to get too off-topic, but if you liked DARK then I'd highly recommend the 12 Monkeys series. If I had to pick one, I'd say 12 Monkeys may be a bit better.
- pjc50 6y agoAnother recommendation: Deutchland 83/86/89, fast-paced spy thriller about the relationship between East and West Germany before the fall of the Berlin Wall.
- GordonS 6y agoAnother recommendation from me - I just finished watching '89, and this was a great series!
- GekkePrutser 6y agoThank you also, this sounds great too! I really like cold war stories.
- odiroot 6y ago> One thing I like about the European shows is that they feel 'fresh' and more connected to life here. That's an interesting insight. I very much prefer US (or UK) shows to the continental ones. The production is just better and they feel less pretentious (to me).
- TrackerFF 6y ago> When I grew up in the 80s/90s, American shows were better than local ones because European actors were very bad at acting. I think this was mainly because they were being trained at schools that still trained for stage plays, with exaggerated pronounciation and gesturing. Tbh, it's still like that in some countries. Norwegian actors (where I'm from) have felt quite stiff/wooden since forever, and they all have the same backgrounds - i.e classical theater schools, play actors before working on TV, etc. I'd say that it's just in the past 10-15 years that we've gotten a somewhat fresh breath of air, from actors that seem to embrace method acting. But you see it in other countries here as well. It's easy to spot a script and dialogue that's been written by "academics", with little to zero exposure to the real world they're trying to depict.
- BlueTemplar 6y agoWhy would stage actors be worse at this?? I would have expected them to be better!
- akiselev 6y agoStage actors are acting for a large audience, screen actors are acting for a camera. It's far harder to communicate subtlety to a bunch of people in the back of a theater than it is to a camera that's right up in the actor's face, so they both necessitate different acting styles. The exaggerated style of stage acting does not translate well to screen.
- BlueTemplar 6y agoWorked pretty well (in fact better than your random tv&movie-only actor) for Patrick Stewart..?
- 8note 6y agoSome hardware developers can also make nice single page apps. That doesn't mean hardware developers generally make better single page apps than anyone else
- danjac 6y ago> When I grew up in the 80s/90s, American shows were better than local ones because European actors were very bad at acting. I think this was mainly because they were being trained at schools that still trained for stage plays, with exaggerated pronounciation and gesturing. So that would include Patrick Stewart, Lawrence Olivier, Helen Mirren, John Gielgud, Ian McKellen, Ian Holm, John Hurt (all European theatre trained actors) ?
- CodeGlitch 6y agoBritish actors, not European. I know that sounds nationalistic but I don't know any British person who has referred to themselves as European.
- BlueTemplar 6y agoHuh, really ? Well, I guess this explains the Brexit... I suppose that Scots might be excluded?
- danjac 6y agoAs well as some 48% of voters in the Brexit vote. They are talking nonsense. Furthermore however much the Brexit fanatics may wish otherwise, the British Isles are still part of the continental landmass of Europe.
- BlueTemplar 6y agoSo is the most populated part of Russia, this doesn't prevent them from "trying to find their own path".
- danjac 6y agoOK, here's one British person who refers to themselves as European. As that's probably not enough for you to win Today's Dumbest Comment on Hacker News, here's one of the above actors who definitely considers herself European: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/helen-mirren-brexit-trump_n_580e6ecce4b02444efa4d5f6 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/helen-mirren-brexit-trump_n_5... and here's another: https://time.com/4354959/patrick-stewart-brexit/ https://time.com/4354959/patrick-stewart-brexit/
- 3v1n0 6y agoNot to mention that who grew up with American shows and eventually visited the US noticed as nothing was real or connected to reality. All pure drama and advertising a non existent American dream society.
- yokaze 6y ago> When I grew up in the 80s/90s, American shows were better than local ones because European actors were very bad at acting. What I've heard, the difference in quality is mostly one of budget. In US series, they do much more takes from a scene, while in European (or Japanese) TV they don't have the budget to do so.
- layoutIfNeeded 6y ago>When I grew up in the 80s/90s, American shows were better than local ones because European actors were very bad at acting. I don't know where you grew up, but this is demonstrably untrue. Maybe you're referring to some low-budget domestic "shows", but French, Italian, German, Polish, Scandinavian, etc. cinema was on par with Hollywood in terms of acting talent.
- corty 6y agoI'm not quite sure about most other European countries, but German cinema is famously bad. There is the occasional comedy that is at least watchable to pass the time if nothing else is on. But other than that, formulaic, badly acted drivel that is just produced to grab state film subsidies. The only German production I would call good is "Das Boot", and that is decades old by now. With lots of squinting maybe "Lola rennt". As for German TV shows, there is a bunch of bad soaps and "Krimis", badly acted, formulaic criminal investigation stuff. Usually with the police as universal good guys working through some tough midlife crisis problems, a token dialect actor from the region that episode is supposed to be set and a story that makes your brain bleed. With a raised finger moral point du jour to educate the stupid plebs out there as to how they are misbehaving. You would have to go back to "Raumpatroullie Orion" to even get science fiction, not to mention any other genre that is popular with non-old-people (Yes, Netflix is definitely an improvement there).
- GekkePrutser 6y agoTrue!! We did get some German police shows and I know exactly what you mean. Like Derrick and Der Alte. But maybe it was also the way that there was always this bleakness in it. Whereas US series had the opposite thing, they were more colourful. Thinking of Miami Vice with their neon lights and blue skies at night.
- layoutIfNeeded 6y agoOk, here are some good German movies just from the top of my head: - The Lives of Others - The Tin Drum - Goodbye Lenin! - Downfall - The Edukators - Berlin Calling - Benny’s Video
- thaumasiotes 6y ago> police shows set in megacities where everyone carries guns. This is a weird concept; megacities are easily the most gun-hostile locations in the US.
- j4yav 6y agoI think even the gun-hostile places in America are (in relative terms) way more gun-loving than you’ll find in Europe.
- thaumasiotes 6y agoWhy would you think that?
- GekkePrutser 6y agoProbably because nobody except police carries guns (in particular pistols) here at all. Whether concealed or not. You just can't get a carry permit. There is no such thing. The only way you can get a pistol is for sports shooting and you must carry it in a closed case all the time, and it must be to/from the shooting range. Rifles are easier to get for hunting but of course this is not what people carry regularly in the US. But more generically: In Europe we have nothing like the second amendment. This is what makes even the gun-hostile places in the US less gun-hostile than Europe, because they still have to abide by the constitution.
- thaumasiotes 6y ago> Probably because nobody except police carries guns (in particular pistols) here at all. Whether concealed or not. You just can't get a carry permit. There is no such thing. That is also how US megacities work. > In Europe we have nothing like the second amendment. This is what makes even the gun-hostile places in the US less gun-hostile than Europe, because they still have to abide by the constitution. That depends on jurisdiction. Compare https://reason.com/volokh/2021/04/01/ninth-circuit-holds-there-is-no-right-to-bear-arms/ https://reason.com/volokh/2021/04/01/ninth-circuit-holds-the... : > The en banc Ninth Circuit last week held that the Second Amendment does not extend to open public firearm carriage. The new [decision] in Young v. State of Hawaii complements the Circuit's en banc from five years earlier, Peruta v. San Diego, which held that concealed carry is outside the Second Amendment. > By statute, Hawaii has a restrictive "may issue" carry licensing system. If an applicant proves "sufficient" "urgency or need," then a police chief "may" issue a permit. > In practice, Hawaii is "never issue." Notionally, they are obligated to obey the constitution. But there's no one to make them do it, so they don't. You also find things like New York passing a law which allows possession of a gun outside the home in only two circumstances: if you are bringing it from your home to a firing range, or if you are bringing it from a firing range back to your home. Notably, this "accidentally" banned transporting a gun from the store where you purchased it to your home. The idea that the most gun-hostile places in America are more gun-loving than what you can find in Europe is self-evidently insane; the claim is that a bunch of people who largely define themselves by their opposition to guns are nevertheless more gun-friendly than a bunch of other people who rarely think about guns at all.