The irony when people use these "gotchas" whenever anyone talks about women entering jobs they've been previously denied or actively removed from (e.g. programm

The irony when people use these "gotchas" whenever anyone talks about women entering jobs they've been previously denied or actively removed from (e.g. programming?) is that you're literally complaining about the same thing as feminists, just from the other end. Yes, we should encourage women to take on ultra dangerous[0] jobs they're underrepresented in. We should also stop thinking the problem is a lack of encouragement. Women are harassed out of male dominated fields and men ae harassed out of female dominated fields (e.g. nurses, teachers, etc). Most of this harassment comes from men, but the harassment is bad regardless of who does it. Men are more likely to commit suicide, yes, but also more likely to use more effective (and "manly") means and thus "succeed", so the difference vanishes once you look at attempts. Men are also far more reluctant to seek mental health care or even simply go to the doctor, which drastically shortens their lifespan. This is what feminists[1] mean when they talk about toxic masculinity: shaming men for not being "manly" enough is part of it and it's literally killing men AND women. The "patriarchy" isn't a secret club men have access to, it's a cultural order that treats men as disposable and women as property while serving only a very small elite[2]. I fully acknowledge this comment is off-topic, but so is at least the comment it is replying to and all of its siblings. I just think if you can dunk on people looking for equal rights with a quick zinger, I can at least provide a retort. [0] For a fun time look into the severe injury risk of cheerleading compared to football. Apparently there are already ultra dangerous jobs and past-times women dominate but that we _for some reason_ don't view as dangerous or "serious". That said, yes, definitely more female deep sea welders and lumberjacks. But maybe we could also spend some time making jobs safer across the board because there's nothing manly (or womanly?) about losing your limbs or life doing a job nobody wants for mediocre pay. [1] While you're looking up things, it's worth trying to understand the difference between feminist theory and "feminism" as seen on TV or Buzzfeed. If you've ever complained about a piece of media you like being ruined by a greedy corporation that doesn't understand any of the source material and just wants to make a quick buck, you got this. No, Buzzfeed complaining about manspreading isn't furthering the feminist agenda, it's just generating outrage because it drives engagement and thus increases ad impressions. Feminism has remarkably little to do with individual misdoings or what is in your pants and more with historical power structures built on these things that still impact us today. [2] And before you come to any wrong conclusions: even that tiny elite is ultimately limited by the hierarchy it exists within, so literally nobody is truly benefiting from patriarchy, yet we propagate it because we prefer the familiar confines over the uncertainty of abandoning this order.