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This happened because this time[0] the Media - strangely - kept the responsibles anonymous. This feeds conspiracy theories. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/

This happened because this time[0] the Media - strangely - kept the responsibles anonymous. This feeds conspiracy theories. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francesco_Schettino https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francesco_Schettino

hnbad 6y ago
Do you remember when a subreddit managed to frame someone innocent for the Boston marathon bombing? This kind of thing happens regardless of whether the media correctly identifies the person(s) responsible, especially if the scapegoat people run with fits into preexisting prejudices (e.g. nobody in the country questioned it when the German police blamed the murders of Turkish minority business owners on "probably the Turkish mafia" until it became clear they were part of a terrorism plot of the _National Socialist Underground_, a white nazi group). It's also worth questioning what good identifying "the person" responsible in the media would do. If anyone directly involved faces criminal charges, we'll probably find out once they've been found guilty. But anyone involved in software development should know that saying "this person did it" when doing a post mortem on a catastrophic incident like this is not a productive use of anyone's time unless the goal is just to have someone to sacrifice in order to avoid addressing the underlying problems that led to the incident. Also, while the Canal was blocked for days, the ship did not sustain any critical damage and the cargo seems to have remained safe and secure. The captain of the Costa Concordia on the other hand killed 32 people and sunk his ship. The two incidents are hardly comparable.
- 1cvmask 6y ago
  While you are being downvoted for exposing the obviouness of the subreddits accusing others (something I have no issue with).... But the real guilty parties are the mainstream media when they let storytelling enter their coverage like what we had when white Tim Mcveigh did the Oklahoma bombing and all the large media outlets like CNN, NY Times framed muslims for that. We saw the similar coverage of the German pilot who crashed Germanwings recently by the (white) media and how different it would have been if the pilot was not white. The white media would have covered fascist France run by dictatorial Macron differently if it was say in Russia or China or Bolivia: https://greenwald.substack.com/p/leading-french-civil-liberties-advocate https://greenwald.substack.com/p/leading-french-civil-libert...
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
detaro 6y ago
Cruise ships tend to have the name of the captain widely promoted, so it's trivially findable public information. The same is not true for random freighters. And Schettinos name was widely broadcast because there were clear points to criticize his and the crews specific behavior (which we do not have here), which lead to death of a bunch of people (which we do not have here). It's a really odd point of comparison - there's plenty of nautical accidents where this isn't widely reported because it's not especially interesting and there aren't immediate reports of the captains misbehavior to report on.
simias 6y ago
In the age of online mobs it's probably very commendable for the news outlets not to throw anybody to the lions, especially since in this case the responsibility seems difficult to establish. Is it the fault of the captain? The Egyptian pilot? Some technician that caused directly or indirectly a blackout on the ship? The Egyptian authorities who authorized the ship to cross during bad weather? Etc... It's a very good thing that the media was more cautious IMO. And conspiracy theories don't need anybody feeding them, you have armies of losers online doing nothing but making that stuff up 24/7. I don't think there's anything "strange" going on (a rather conspiratorial wording in and of itself IMO), it's just that it's very hard to place the blame with the information currently available, especially since all the first party sources have a very strong incentive to push a certain narrative. The Costa Concordia on the other hand was much more clear cut and you had the extremely embarrassing recording of the coast guard telling the captain to return to the ship and him cowardly refusing to do so. There's no such thing here as far as I know.
- hashkb 6y ago
  > armies of losers Referring to "them" like this is partially what feeds them. If you are interested.
  - hashkb 6y ago
    And downvoting the guy checking your polarizing virtue signalling is totally how we move towards a better way of communicating. Edit: what about the army of losers on here? Can we try to have some perspective?
  - simias 6y ago
    Again, I don't care to find them excuses. "Somebody called me a loser so I decided to spew bullshit online" is what losers do. I'd much rather empathize with this captain who was targeted solely because she's a woman. That seems like a much better use of my time than caring about keyboard warriors on twitter or 4chan.
    - hashkb 6y ago
danuker 6y ago
Relevant video by Internet Historian: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh9KBwqGxTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh9KBwqGxTI

hnbad 6y ago

Do you remember when a subreddit managed to frame someone innocent for the Boston marathon bombing? This kind of thing happens regardless of whether the media correctly identifies the person(s) responsible, especially if the scapegoat people run with fits into preexisting prejudices (e.g. nobody in the country questioned it when the German police blamed the murders of Turkish minority business owners on "probably the Turkish mafia" until it became clear they were part of a terrorism plot of the _National Socialist Underground_, a white nazi group). It's also worth questioning what good identifying "the person" responsible in the media would do. If anyone directly involved faces criminal charges, we'll probably find out once they've been found guilty. But anyone involved in software development should know that saying "this person did it" when doing a post mortem on a catastrophic incident like this is not a productive use of anyone's time unless the goal is just to have someone to sacrifice in order to avoid addressing the underlying problems that led to the incident. Also, while the Canal was blocked for days, the ship did not sustain any critical damage and the cargo seems to have remained safe and secure. The captain of the Costa Concordia on the other hand killed 32 people and sunk his ship. The two incidents are hardly comparable.

1cvmask 6y ago
While you are being downvoted for exposing the obviouness of the subreddits accusing others (something I have no issue with).... But the real guilty parties are the mainstream media when they let storytelling enter their coverage like what we had when white Tim Mcveigh did the Oklahoma bombing and all the large media outlets like CNN, NY Times framed muslims for that. We saw the similar coverage of the German pilot who crashed Germanwings recently by the (white) media and how different it would have been if the pilot was not white. The white media would have covered fascist France run by dictatorial Macron differently if it was say in Russia or China or Bolivia: https://greenwald.substack.com/p/leading-french-civil-liberties-advocate https://greenwald.substack.com/p/leading-french-civil-libert...
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

detaro 6y ago

Cruise ships tend to have the name of the captain widely promoted, so it's trivially findable public information. The same is not true for random freighters. And Schettinos name was widely broadcast because there were clear points to criticize his and the crews specific behavior (which we do not have here), which lead to death of a bunch of people (which we do not have here). It's a really odd point of comparison - there's plenty of nautical accidents where this isn't widely reported because it's not especially interesting and there aren't immediate reports of the captains misbehavior to report on.

simias 6y ago

In the age of online mobs it's probably very commendable for the news outlets not to throw anybody to the lions, especially since in this case the responsibility seems difficult to establish. Is it the fault of the captain? The Egyptian pilot? Some technician that caused directly or indirectly a blackout on the ship? The Egyptian authorities who authorized the ship to cross during bad weather? Etc... It's a very good thing that the media was more cautious IMO. And conspiracy theories don't need anybody feeding them, you have armies of losers online doing nothing but making that stuff up 24/7. I don't think there's anything "strange" going on (a rather conspiratorial wording in and of itself IMO), it's just that it's very hard to place the blame with the information currently available, especially since all the first party sources have a very strong incentive to push a certain narrative. The Costa Concordia on the other hand was much more clear cut and you had the extremely embarrassing recording of the coast guard telling the captain to return to the ship and him cowardly refusing to do so. There's no such thing here as far as I know.

hashkb 6y ago
> armies of losers Referring to "them" like this is partially what feeds them. If you are interested.
- hashkb 6y ago
  And downvoting the guy checking your polarizing virtue signalling is totally how we move towards a better way of communicating. Edit: what about the army of losers on here? Can we try to have some perspective?
- simias 6y ago
  Again, I don't care to find them excuses. "Somebody called me a loser so I decided to spew bullshit online" is what losers do. I'd much rather empathize with this captain who was targeted solely because she's a woman. That seems like a much better use of my time than caring about keyboard warriors on twitter or 4chan.
  - hashkb 6y ago

danuker 6y ago

Relevant video by Internet Historian: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh9KBwqGxTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qh9KBwqGxTI