4 ms·

> I'm suspicious of these Norwegians, and their peace prize process. Any particular reason, or just a general suspicion of people from Norway?

by elygre 6y ago

pope_meat 6y ago
Because in 2009 they awarded the nobel peace prize to the president of the united states, a man who was literally ordering drone strikes at that moment on a country the united states had invaded on the evidence of Collin Powell holding up a vile of urine and a CGI rendering of mythical nuclear trucks. But who among us haven't accidentally confused that for peace.
- atonse 6y ago
  Wasn’t Obama’s reaction to waking up to the announcement “for what?” - don’t know if this is true. I doubt even Obama felt he deserved it.
  - gizmo686 6y ago
    His initial public reaction [0]: > This is not how I expected to wake up this morning. > I do not view it as a recognition of my own accomplishment. But rather as an affirmation of American leadership on behalf of aspirations held by people in all nations. To be honest, I do not feel like I deserve to be in the company of so many of the trans formative figures that have been honored by this prize. Looking at his eventual speach[1], it is pretty clear his view didn't change: > And yet I would be remiss if I did not acknowledge the considerable controversy that your generous decision has generated. [humble boilerplate about other people being more deserving] > But perhaps the most profound issue surrounding my receipt of this prize is the fact that I am the Commander-in-Chief of the military of a nation in the midst of two wars. One of these wars is winding down. The other is a conflict that America did not seek; one in which we are joined by 42 other countries -- including Norway -- in an effort to defend ourselves and all nations from further attacks. > Still, we are at war, and I'm responsible for the deployment of thousands of young Americans to battle in a distant land. Some will kill, and some will be killed. And so I come here with an acute sense of the costs of armed conflict -- filled with difficult questions about the relationship between war and peace, and our effort to replace one with the other. He goes on to talk about how war is paradoxically necessary for peace. But even then, he talks about historic examples, not anything in particular he has done. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbOWxc7Wwrg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbOWxc7Wwrg [1] https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/remarks-president-acceptance-nobel-peace-prize https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/remark...
    - bluepoint 6y ago
      I did not know this. Should he have accepted the prize then?
      - boublepop 6y ago
        What would he have accomplished by not accepting it? Created a public statement on behalf of America of “nope, we don’t like peace, we’ll keep waging war!” There is absolutely nothing to gain by not accepting it. It seems like the desire by many Americans to have him decline is just because of personal opinions about him. Would you really respect the man more for tarnishing the name and brand of the entire United nation simply to not accept a symbolic price that you and he both think he did not deserve to receive? He did the right think by making clear his own understanding that he was perhaps not most deserving but accepting none the less.
  - klyrs 6y ago
    Yeah, I've never met a person even casually informed about american politics who thought Obama deserved that, especially after his time in office (but why was it given in his first year?!). But this anti-Norway sentiment is confusing.
    - redis_mlc 6y ago
      > but why was it given in his first year European countries feel collective shame that: 1) the Holocaust happened in their midst 2) after Obama's election, they cannot elect a black person as a leader. You can see their attempt at atonement in their initial acceptance of African migrants over the past decade without normal immigration processes, and their refusal to arrest or even investigate migrant crimes. It took several years before they realized that 1/3 of Africans were headed north.
- pvaldes 6y ago
  Do you know what would really made a difference? having a Nobel prize for WAR. We really need an equivalent to this. Thus, we all could know the faces of the people that tried harder or did more for creating or fueling wars in the current year.
  - pvaldes 6y ago
    mmmh ... I'm thinking that a posthumous award would reinforce the anti-nobel idea and would be easier to grant in fact. Lords of war tend to be nasty and people should celebrate its death. Satirical Journals or humanitarian NGOs... if you read this, feel free to implement it. The 'We all are Alfred' Prize would be a great name.
  - Shorel 6y ago
    Not a Nobel, just as there's no mathematics Nobel prize. But some kind of Darwin award, it can be called the Mars award (for the god of war), or Bellus or Ares or similar.

> I'm suspicious of these Norwegians, and their peace prize process. Any particular reason, or just a general suspicion of people from Norway?

by elygre 6y ago

> I'm suspicious of these Norwegians, and their peace prize process. Any particular reason, or just a general suspicion of people from Norway?

pope_meat 6y ago

Because in 2009 they awarded the nobel peace prize to the president of the united states, a man who was literally ordering drone strikes at that moment on a country the united states had invaded on the evidence of Collin Powell holding up a vile of urine and a CGI rendering of mythical nuclear trucks. But who among us haven't accidentally confused that for peace.

atonse 6y ago
Wasn’t Obama’s reaction to waking up to the announcement “for what?” - don’t know if this is true. I doubt even Obama felt he deserved it.
- gizmo686 6y ago
  His initial public reaction [0]: > This is not how I expected to wake up this morning. > I do not view it as a recognition of my own accomplishment. But rather as an affirmation of American leadership on behalf of aspirations held by people in all nations. To be honest, I do not feel like I deserve to be in the company of so many of the trans formative figures that have been honored by this prize. Looking at his eventual speach[1], it is pretty clear his view didn't change: > And yet I would be remiss if I did not acknowledge the considerable controversy that your generous decision has generated. [humble boilerplate about other people being more deserving] > But perhaps the most profound issue surrounding my receipt of this prize is the fact that I am the Commander-in-Chief of the military of a nation in the midst of two wars. One of these wars is winding down. The other is a conflict that America did not seek; one in which we are joined by 42 other countries -- including Norway -- in an effort to defend ourselves and all nations from further attacks. > Still, we are at war, and I'm responsible for the deployment of thousands of young Americans to battle in a distant land. Some will kill, and some will be killed. And so I come here with an acute sense of the costs of armed conflict -- filled with difficult questions about the relationship between war and peace, and our effort to replace one with the other. He goes on to talk about how war is paradoxically necessary for peace. But even then, he talks about historic examples, not anything in particular he has done. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbOWxc7Wwrg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbOWxc7Wwrg [1] https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/remarks-president-acceptance-nobel-peace-prize https://obamawhitehouse.archives.gov/the-press-office/remark...
  - bluepoint 6y ago
    I did not know this. Should he have accepted the prize then?
    - boublepop 6y ago
      What would he have accomplished by not accepting it? Created a public statement on behalf of America of “nope, we don’t like peace, we’ll keep waging war!” There is absolutely nothing to gain by not accepting it. It seems like the desire by many Americans to have him decline is just because of personal opinions about him. Would you really respect the man more for tarnishing the name and brand of the entire United nation simply to not accept a symbolic price that you and he both think he did not deserve to receive? He did the right think by making clear his own understanding that he was perhaps not most deserving but accepting none the less.
- klyrs 6y ago
  Yeah, I've never met a person even casually informed about american politics who thought Obama deserved that, especially after his time in office (but why was it given in his first year?!). But this anti-Norway sentiment is confusing.
  - redis_mlc 6y ago
    > but why was it given in his first year European countries feel collective shame that: 1) the Holocaust happened in their midst 2) after Obama's election, they cannot elect a black person as a leader. You can see their attempt at atonement in their initial acceptance of African migrants over the past decade without normal immigration processes, and their refusal to arrest or even investigate migrant crimes. It took several years before they realized that 1/3 of Africans were headed north.
pvaldes 6y ago
Do you know what would really made a difference? having a Nobel prize for WAR. We really need an equivalent to this. Thus, we all could know the faces of the people that tried harder or did more for creating or fueling wars in the current year.
- pvaldes 6y ago
  mmmh ... I'm thinking that a posthumous award would reinforce the anti-nobel idea and would be easier to grant in fact. Lords of war tend to be nasty and people should celebrate its death. Satirical Journals or humanitarian NGOs... if you read this, feel free to implement it. The 'We all are Alfred' Prize would be a great name.
- Shorel 6y ago
  Not a Nobel, just as there's no mathematics Nobel prize. But some kind of Darwin award, it can be called the Mars award (for the god of war), or Bellus or Ares or similar.