6 ms·

I had two foreign languages at school: English and Russian. English went pretty well because there were the internet, books, films, etc. Russian was like having

I had two foreign languages at school: English and Russian. English went pretty well because there were the internet, books, films, etc. Russian was like having an anchor attached to your body when swimming. It was so painful. I hated it and couldn't see why would I ever need because I know English ( the naivety of the young). A few years after the school, I went abroad and the circumstances brought me and a few Russians with no command of English under one roof. It was even more painful. Even basic things,such as 'this is raw meat' was almost impossible.. Months went by, the vocabulary improved. I could discuss wider topics and eventually it became pretty easy and we used to talk for hours. I learned more in one year than during 6 years at school. Even now, I'd love to learn Spanish,or maybe French but the first thing you get after buying any book is 500 grammar rules before the first word is shown. It's like learning how to drive by reading books on mechanical engineering and oil industry.

bumbada 6y ago
I recommend you the book "fluent forever". I have learned several hard languages since I bought the book and started using anki. Now that I speak several languages is easier and easier to learn a new one. I am native Spanish speaker. You don't learn by reading and understanding anything, you learn by practicing every day until it becomes automatic. For learning Spanish or French you can use Michel Thomas audio lessons and using Anki for learning it. Someone told me there are torrents out there.
- BuckRogers 6y ago
  Thanks for mentioning these things. If I put some effort into it on the side I think I can turn the tide on my long term goal of learning Spanish fluently. While I’d always be interested in learning the native language of any country I may reside in, Spanish is the only language I’m interested in learning regardless of where I live. I studied it in college and the written form is just so regular that it’s really the gold standard for languages. I love how knowing the formal rules that I can accurately spell words I’ve only heard, and do it consistently correctly. It’s under appreciated.
soldehierro 6y ago
People like to rag on teaching grammar rules. While it's certaintly not what makes you fluent - that's an intuitive grasp of grammar, it allows you to start understanding and enjoying native content much faster. Learning a language from a book has another issue, though - I just can't sustain the enthusiam. For me, taking formal classes (so there's something on the line) allows a foundation to be built without me having to delicately balance overenthusiam and underenthusiasm when pacing it.
BlueGh0st 6y ago
I began my Russian journey 10 years ago and I feel extremely ashamed about how little I know. I can barely hold a conversation. My ADHD/anxiety makes reading near impossible and it seems the resources for Russian language are generally old-fashioned or inconvenient (eg RU isn't often supported by these new clever/trendy learning tools that pop up). My goal now is just to get to a Russian speaking country and learn naturally. I have decent pattern recognition so this is the easiest way for me to learn, so it's a pity that there seems to be so few resources that take advantage of this. Chatting with strangers in my target language has been the most beneficial for me so far.
abecedarius 6y ago
> but the first thing you get after buying any book is 500 grammar rules before the first word is shown There's an example of a very different approach: Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata, all in the language to be taught, starting from simple language, using pictures, etc. The most like that that I've seen for Spanish or French was this basic French dictionary: https://www.amazon.com/Mon-premier-dictionnaire-Roger-Pillet/dp/B0007DU07S https://www.amazon.com/Mon-premier-dictionnaire-Roger-Pillet... Anyone know of other books in that spirit?
- toto444 6y ago
  I am creating a static site in that spirit. I have shared the link in an other comment. I use emojis to define simple words and I use these simple words to build sentences and then stories.
- saint_angels 6y ago
  if I understand you correctly, then Rosetta Stone digital courses might be similar. No grammar or words are explicitly defined/translated, everything is taught through context with images and audio
  - Jtsummers 6y ago
    Sort of. I just pulled up that book on Amazon. Check out the "look inside". The first chapter reads as an advanced version of "See Spot. See Spot run. Run Spot run!". Vocabulary is getting introduced slowly and as it builds up there is explanatory text or elaborations (in the prose or in the margins). A description of the language is being presented within the language, which Rosetta Stone doesn't totally get to. Rosetta Stone presents more and more examples with, at times, markings to help illustrate what they're getting at (-ar verbs get conjugated with -o, -as, -a, -amos, -an) but it seems this Latin book (I've exhausted my page views so can't see more sections) actually has a description of Latin in Latin, not just more words/phrases presented individually. (TBF, I never completed a Rosetta Stone course so maybe they get closer to this eventually, but that's not my impression.) https://www.amazon.com/Lingua-Latina-Illustrata-Pars-Familia/dp/1585104205 https://www.amazon.com/Lingua-Latina-Illustrata-Pars-Familia...

bumbada 6y ago

I recommend you the book "fluent forever". I have learned several hard languages since I bought the book and started using anki. Now that I speak several languages is easier and easier to learn a new one. I am native Spanish speaker. You don't learn by reading and understanding anything, you learn by practicing every day until it becomes automatic. For learning Spanish or French you can use Michel Thomas audio lessons and using Anki for learning it. Someone told me there are torrents out there.

BuckRogers 6y ago
Thanks for mentioning these things. If I put some effort into it on the side I think I can turn the tide on my long term goal of learning Spanish fluently. While I’d always be interested in learning the native language of any country I may reside in, Spanish is the only language I’m interested in learning regardless of where I live. I studied it in college and the written form is just so regular that it’s really the gold standard for languages. I love how knowing the formal rules that I can accurately spell words I’ve only heard, and do it consistently correctly. It’s under appreciated.

soldehierro 6y ago

People like to rag on teaching grammar rules. While it's certaintly not what makes you fluent - that's an intuitive grasp of grammar, it allows you to start understanding and enjoying native content much faster. Learning a language from a book has another issue, though - I just can't sustain the enthusiam. For me, taking formal classes (so there's something on the line) allows a foundation to be built without me having to delicately balance overenthusiam and underenthusiasm when pacing it.

BlueGh0st 6y ago

I began my Russian journey 10 years ago and I feel extremely ashamed about how little I know. I can barely hold a conversation. My ADHD/anxiety makes reading near impossible and it seems the resources for Russian language are generally old-fashioned or inconvenient (eg RU isn't often supported by these new clever/trendy learning tools that pop up). My goal now is just to get to a Russian speaking country and learn naturally. I have decent pattern recognition so this is the easiest way for me to learn, so it's a pity that there seems to be so few resources that take advantage of this. Chatting with strangers in my target language has been the most beneficial for me so far.

abecedarius 6y ago

> but the first thing you get after buying any book is 500 grammar rules before the first word is shown There's an example of a very different approach: Lingua Latina Per Se Illustrata, all in the language to be taught, starting from simple language, using pictures, etc. The most like that that I've seen for Spanish or French was this basic French dictionary: https://www.amazon.com/Mon-premier-dictionnaire-Roger-Pillet/dp/B0007DU07S https://www.amazon.com/Mon-premier-dictionnaire-Roger-Pillet... Anyone know of other books in that spirit?

toto444 6y ago
I am creating a static site in that spirit. I have shared the link in an other comment. I use emojis to define simple words and I use these simple words to build sentences and then stories.
saint_angels 6y ago
if I understand you correctly, then Rosetta Stone digital courses might be similar. No grammar or words are explicitly defined/translated, everything is taught through context with images and audio
- Jtsummers 6y ago
  Sort of. I just pulled up that book on Amazon. Check out the "look inside". The first chapter reads as an advanced version of "See Spot. See Spot run. Run Spot run!". Vocabulary is getting introduced slowly and as it builds up there is explanatory text or elaborations (in the prose or in the margins). A description of the language is being presented within the language, which Rosetta Stone doesn't totally get to. Rosetta Stone presents more and more examples with, at times, markings to help illustrate what they're getting at (-ar verbs get conjugated with -o, -as, -a, -amos, -an) but it seems this Latin book (I've exhausted my page views so can't see more sections) actually has a description of Latin in Latin, not just more words/phrases presented individually. (TBF, I never completed a Rosetta Stone course so maybe they get closer to this eventually, but that's not my impression.) https://www.amazon.com/Lingua-Latina-Illustrata-Pars-Familia/dp/1585104205 https://www.amazon.com/Lingua-Latina-Illustrata-Pars-Familia...