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Amazing how the 'almost unreadable' Burton's Thousand Nights continues to sell to this day, even on Kindle. As far as I can gather, there is plenty of sexual im

Amazing how the 'almost unreadable' Burton's Thousand Nights continues to sell to this day, even on Kindle. As far as I can gather, there is plenty of sexual imagery in the original manuscript undoubtedly emphasized by Burton. Suggestions of really gross mis-translation or invention by Burton, seem to be thin on the ground.

idlewords 6y ago
I just referred you to a source for both. Burton is more inspired fanfic than translation. Some people like it!
gjm11 6y ago
The trouble with Burton isn't inaccuracy so much as unreadability, or at least clumsiness, because he translated into an idiosyncratic variety of English never used by anyone else before or since. Here's an example from the introduction to Dawood's translation, which I happen to have handy: "But she rejoined by saying, 'Allah upon you both that ye come down forthright, and if you come not, I will rouse upon you my husband, this Ifrit, and he shall do you to die by the illest of deaths'; and she continued making signals to them." I'm sure that's an accurate enough translation of the relevant bit of the Nights. But it's not good English. "Allah upon you"? "do you to die by the illest of deaths"? Maybe the idea is to give it an exotic flavour, but the stories themselves provide enough of that, and so far as I know the original language wouldn't feel exotic to a native reader.
- almostarockstar 6y ago
  I'm fascinated. It sounds like a pidgin, or literal translation. Can anybody compare the grammar used to that of the original text? Or is it a work of complete imagination?
- GeoAtreides 6y ago
  English is my second language and I find his translation (and the fragment you quoted) clear, interesting and poetic. Reminds of King James Bible translation, which I also greatly enjoy.
  - gjm11 6y ago
    One thing the KJV has in common with Burton's translation is a certain deliberate archaism -- its language was rather old-fashioned when it was published in 1610. There's (obviously) absolutely nothing with liking deliberately archaic, slightly high-flown language. Personally I find it rather annoying in Burton but like it in the KJV, but different people have different tastes. Though ... A lot of people who read the KJV are doing so not so much for the enjoyment of its literary style, but because they believe it to be the Word of God; unfortunately this means that many people are seeking divine enlightenment from a translation that (1) in many cases they don't understand well just because its language is hundreds of years separated from what they're accustomed to speaking and reading, and that (2) is based on now-outdated textual scholarship and therefore does a suboptimal job of reporting what the allegedly divinely inspired writers actually wrote. That seems unfortunate.
- webmobdev 6y ago
  The english translation that you quoted sounds very similar in nature to the english translation of Quranic verses. The Quran is kind of poetic in its language and hence its translation always sounds a bit odd. This makes me wonder whether the original Arabian Nights were also in the nature of a narrative poem?
  - selimthegrim 6y ago
    Because NJ Dawood did a Quran translation as well
    - gjm11 6y ago
      That can't explain any similarity between what I quoted and English translations of the Qur'an -- because while what I quoted came from the intro to Dawood's translation of the Nights, what it is is a sample of Burton's translation (which Dawood quotes as an example of Burton's oddity).
- Wohlf 6y ago
  In fairness I believe Shakespeare also wrote his works in idiosyncratic English.

idlewords 6y ago

I just referred you to a source for both. Burton is more inspired fanfic than translation. Some people like it!

gjm11 6y ago

The trouble with Burton isn't inaccuracy so much as unreadability, or at least clumsiness, because he translated into an idiosyncratic variety of English never used by anyone else before or since. Here's an example from the introduction to Dawood's translation, which I happen to have handy: "But she rejoined by saying, 'Allah upon you both that ye come down forthright, and if you come not, I will rouse upon you my husband, this Ifrit, and he shall do you to die by the illest of deaths'; and she continued making signals to them." I'm sure that's an accurate enough translation of the relevant bit of the Nights. But it's not good English. "Allah upon you"? "do you to die by the illest of deaths"? Maybe the idea is to give it an exotic flavour, but the stories themselves provide enough of that, and so far as I know the original language wouldn't feel exotic to a native reader.

almostarockstar 6y ago
I'm fascinated. It sounds like a pidgin, or literal translation. Can anybody compare the grammar used to that of the original text? Or is it a work of complete imagination?
GeoAtreides 6y ago
English is my second language and I find his translation (and the fragment you quoted) clear, interesting and poetic. Reminds of King James Bible translation, which I also greatly enjoy.
- gjm11 6y ago
  One thing the KJV has in common with Burton's translation is a certain deliberate archaism -- its language was rather old-fashioned when it was published in 1610. There's (obviously) absolutely nothing with liking deliberately archaic, slightly high-flown language. Personally I find it rather annoying in Burton but like it in the KJV, but different people have different tastes. Though ... A lot of people who read the KJV are doing so not so much for the enjoyment of its literary style, but because they believe it to be the Word of God; unfortunately this means that many people are seeking divine enlightenment from a translation that (1) in many cases they don't understand well just because its language is hundreds of years separated from what they're accustomed to speaking and reading, and that (2) is based on now-outdated textual scholarship and therefore does a suboptimal job of reporting what the allegedly divinely inspired writers actually wrote. That seems unfortunate.
webmobdev 6y ago
The english translation that you quoted sounds very similar in nature to the english translation of Quranic verses. The Quran is kind of poetic in its language and hence its translation always sounds a bit odd. This makes me wonder whether the original Arabian Nights were also in the nature of a narrative poem?
- selimthegrim 6y ago
  Because NJ Dawood did a Quran translation as well
  - gjm11 6y ago
    That can't explain any similarity between what I quoted and English translations of the Qur'an -- because while what I quoted came from the intro to Dawood's translation of the Nights, what it is is a sample of Burton's translation (which Dawood quotes as an example of Burton's oddity).
Wohlf 6y ago
In fairness I believe Shakespeare also wrote his works in idiosyncratic English.