8 ms·

This is factual wrong on so many levels. Hitchhiking in the sense of getting into a private car that just happens to go the same directions and has no commerci

This is factual wrong on so many levels. Hitchhiking in the sense of getting into a private car that just happens to go the same directions and has no commercial interest is NOT a thing in Cuba, are at least not the norm. Not many people own their own car in Cuba and if they do, they use them mostly commercially. What they are probably referring too are cooperative taxis. Those are cars or smaller buses that are driving a certain route, like a bus. They don't have fixed stops. You just go to a street that is part of their route and wait for them to drive by and hail them. You get on, pay a small fee and tell the driver when you want to stop and go out. Think low tech Uber + ride sharing with strangers. They are super great for getting around comfortably for cheap. Saying the public transport in Cuba is bad makes no sense. Basically nobody owns a car in Cuba and people still get around just fine. Of course because of the economic blockade against Cuba they are forced to be creative on how to use the available resources. As someone that has lived and studied in Cuba, feel free to ask additional questions. The amount of misinformation really grinds my gears.

helloworld11 6y ago
>Of course because of the economic blockade against Cuba they are forced to be creative on how to use the available resources. Yes of course, Cuba's economic woes and abysmal civil/tech infrastructure are entirely due to the economic blockade. several decades of a certain repressive, individuality and development crushing political system and its economic theories have nothing worth mentioning to do with it. This itself is more than a little piece of misinformation, blaming Cuba's problems entirely on the US (though the US and its misguided blockade have their share of faults)
- slumpt_ 6y ago
  Yeah, I’m sure their political system’s success / failure wasn’t impacted at all by US intervention. Oh, HackerNews. I love you.
  - gadders 6y ago
    Yes, because non-blockaded communist countries have been such glowing successes.
    - SerLava 6y ago
      I mean, even the ones that were not just blockaded, but genocidally invaded, still turned from really bad feudal peasant states into modern industrial nations faster than any previous countries.
      - Kbelicius 6y ago
        Which countries would that be?
        SerLava 6y ago
        For instance Russia, China
    - artem247 6y ago
      Well in my country between 1945 and 1990 many good things were done in regards to education, healthcare, science, housing - millions of people got their first urban home for free. Of course it had a fair share of problems but I think it is at least comparable with capitalist states.
      - gadders 6y ago
        Which country was that? Did you live there then or were you born after that date?
      - Google234 6y ago
        The Soviet Union was a pile of rust by 1990. I’m not sure how you can justify the immense suffering and indiscriminate persecution just for that...
- cardanome 6y ago
  You are making up a straw man. The economic blockade by the US has the goal of destroying the political and economic order of Cuba. And just to be clear, this blockade is not just blocking Cuba from trading with the US but is effectively blocking Cuba from a good portion of the world market except for a few small allies. And even those trades with allies can become vastly more costly because of the blockade. There are not many countries that would survive such a blockade not to mention thrive in it. Are there internal problems in Cuba? Sure there are. Does it make my quoted sentence incorrect that said: >Of course because of the economic blockade against Cuba they are forced to be creative on how to use the available resources. No, it does not. It does not state that there might not be also other problems in Cuba. There is lots of internal problems one can talk about and if someone has honest questions, please ask. Just don't use these internal problems to minimize the injustice of the blockade against Cuba. (Not to imply whether this is what my former poster intended to do or not).
  - redis_mlc 6y ago
    > The economic blockade by the US has the goal of destroying the political and economic order of Cuba. Well, Cuba could return the US property that was nationalized, and elect a non-Communist government, you know. Instead they swim for the US. Also, the Cuban missile crisis didn't end when people were told. Half of the Russian nuclear missiles were left behind, and when Russia realized Castro wanted to actually use them against the US, Russia had a nightmare in getting them back. (A Russian diplomat became a hero by pointing out some treaty loophole to the Cubans, who decided to follow the "treaty" and allowed the repo. Had the Russians told Castro he was crazy, likely those missiles would still be there.)
  - 908B64B197 6y ago
    > the US but is effectively blocking Cuba from a good portion of the world market except for a few small allies. It is not. Every country is free to decide if it wants to trade with Cuba or not. > Just don't use these internal problems to minimize the injustice of the blockade against Cuba There is no injustice. Cuban people can end it whenever they want. Their government too.
- sudosysgen 6y ago
  Cuba has a GDP PPP per capita of around 25 000$, which is above the worldwide average. This is despite being prevented from trading with all but a handful of countries. It's by very far the wealthiest country under US embargo, and better to live in than most of the world. Given their current, fairly high standard of living, they would probably economically be a first world country without a US embargo - as it is they're already quite close.
- helloworld11 6y ago
  Those of you making defenses of Cuba here are flatly deluded if you make these claims seriously. Cuba was only able to sustain itself with enormous Soviet backing and this regardless of the economic embargo by the U.S. Once the USSR collapsed, the Cuban government made hurried attempts at introducing partial capital-friendly reforms in certain sectors (especially tourism) which still never really brought major benefit to its people because the rest of the stagnant, suffocating socialist bureaucracy remained in place for most of daily life. I am absolutely no fan of the U.S embargo and think it was a an idiotic disaster in terms of both PR and practical terms, a useful blame point for decades of corrupt, criminally repressive Cuban government propaganda, that allowed that state to conveniently deviate attention away from its own very real failures in trying to stick to ideology in the country. None of this is to even mention the very real dictatorship of one single political party running that country for so long under conditions that simply cannot be compared to those of most democratized countries. To say otherwise of this is a blatant game of whataboutism which normally gets derided on this site but apparently, by what I see in replies to my original comment above, is supported when it comes to Cuba. It's absurd to see so many HNrs, living under largely privileged market friendly conditions and fully enjoying the benefits of the market in their own personal and professional lives, defending the grotesque little experiment in social and economic repression that is Cuba simply because theyre either ideologically fixated on throwing (partially deserved) shit at the US or emotionally sentimental about a country that few of them would want to actually live in as the locals do, for decades on end.
  - artem247 6y ago
    "at country for so long under conditions that simply cannot be compared to those of most democratized countries" Well let's compare Cuba to most democratized countries in the Caribbean. Or in South America. Or to any place that is not US or EU+Switzerland and Norway.
jfoster 6y ago
This model sounds a lot like songthaews in Thailand. Also brings to mind UberPool.
rualca 6y ago
> What they are probably referring too are cooperative taxis. Those are cars or smaller buses that are driving a certain route, like a bus. It's also funny that the ride share concept has been huge throughout the west, with a couple of unicorns profiting from it, but once the same concept is applied to Cuba... Well, suddenly "deteriorating public transport" becomes a key point.
- jhbadger 6y ago
  At least in the US, deteriorating public transit is a major reason for the success of things like Uber. Obviously right now a lot of people are working from home making the issue moot, but over the past decade the NYC subway, Boston T, and Washington Metro have had many, many problems of reliability as decades of minimal maintenance have finally caused major problems in their infrastructure, and many people in big US cities have switched to ride sharing for trips that they used to use public transit for.
Clewza313 6y ago
The article doesn't claim they're private vehicles. The "amarillo" organized hitchhiking system is absolutely a thing, and it relies on government vehicles: https://hitchwiki.org/en/Cuba https://hitchwiki.org/en/Cuba
yoandy 6y ago
> Saying the public transport in Cuba is bad makes no sense. Basically nobody owns a car in Cuba and people still get around just fine what does not make sense is saying that "the public transport in Cuba is bad makes no sense". Both public or private transport is bad in any angle. You can not say people still get around just fine when for instances sometimes you need 4 hours or more to reach a place 80 kilometers far from you. Sometimes you just have to give up and returns home after some hours exposed to the sun on the road. * As someone who is born in Cuba and lived and studied in Cuba, feel free to ask additional questions ;)
- cardanome 6y ago
  > You can not say people still get around just fine when for instances sometimes you need 4 hours or more to reach a place 80 kilometers far from you. If you are a bit unlucky that might be a realistic time for traveling by train here in Germany so I don't really see the horror. They don't have the public transport level of Japan sure but even most of the developed world is much worse. In most parts of the US not owning a car is not even a realistic options. If we are fair and compare Cuba to other underdeveloped countries in South America then they compare very favorable.
  - yoandy 6y ago
    common on! don't troll my comment, in Germany you have to be unlucky enough if you travel by train and it is delayed at all.
htowncu 6y ago
Sorry, but you are mistaken, there is a mandate in Cuba that government vehicles must stop to pick up passengers if an "Amarillo" stops them, failing to do so will have them reported and "perhaps" face some consequence. The Amarillo, named like this because of their uniform, always have a little board where they write down the plates of all the government's cars who didn't stop when they had capacity. People don't get around just fine, your experience was probably heavily skewed as a foreigner. There is no reliable train in Cuba, a 200 miles trip might take 18hrs. Inter provinces traveling is a nightmare, you can go to a bus terminal and wait days to get a ticket to the other side of the country, by wait days I mean on the terminal, sleeping on the floor. I left Cuba around 7 years ago, right after college. My weekly routine was leaving college on Fridays at 5pm and go hitchhike in Alamar for a few hours, some days it was quick, others I could arrive at Alamar at 6pm and still be there at 11pm and finally getting home at 1AM. The travel back was the same until through a friend of mine I was able to get a weekly "leftover" seat in those tourist's bus.
- cardanome 6y ago
  > People don't get around just fine, your experience was probably heavily skewed as a foreigner. I did not use any form of public transport for tourists. That would have been way too expensive in the long run. I was traveling as any Cuban was traveling. And yes that included waiting for hours on bus terminals and the like. Big deal. > There is no reliable train in Cuba, a 200 miles trip might take 18hrs. I could tell you horror stories about the advanced train system in Germany as well but that would be besides the point. Most people don't need to travel 200 miles that often. For the daily necessities of getting to work, shopping and the likes the public transport system works. Sure the buses are crowded to a maximum, there are not reliable schedules but at least people can afford basic mobility which is not true for many parts of the less developed world. > I left Cuba around 7 years ago, right after college. Now you live in the USA. Oh and new account and only posting about Cuba. Funny how it is always the same story with that kind of accounts.
  - htowncu 6y ago
    Let me guess, you lived in Havana, the city in Cuba with the highest population density, the only city where public services are somehow functional. What constitute basic mobility for you? I once had to travel from Matanzas to Havana in an overcrowded bus, standing, and with no ventilation because it was one of those buses that were supposed to have AC. Is that what constitutes basic mobility for you? I'm sure a great way to live your life is to always compare oneself against the poorest countries, that way you are always on top. Did you wait days in a bus terminal? A lot of people must travel to Havana at some point because that's the only place in the country where they can get some kind of paperwork or surgery done. I have multiple accounts, do you know why? I bet you have never had to thought about it? Cuba recently created a law that allows them to give you prison time if you post "anything" on social media that they might interpret as "damaging the image of the Cuban revolution". Is funny how is usually the foreigners preaching the greatness of Cuba.

helloworld11 6y ago

>Of course because of the economic blockade against Cuba they are forced to be creative on how to use the available resources. Yes of course, Cuba's economic woes and abysmal civil/tech infrastructure are entirely due to the economic blockade. several decades of a certain repressive, individuality and development crushing political system and its economic theories have nothing worth mentioning to do with it. This itself is more than a little piece of misinformation, blaming Cuba's problems entirely on the US (though the US and its misguided blockade have their share of faults)

slumpt_ 6y ago
Yeah, I’m sure their political system’s success / failure wasn’t impacted at all by US intervention. Oh, HackerNews. I love you.
- gadders 6y ago
  Yes, because non-blockaded communist countries have been such glowing successes.
  - SerLava 6y ago
    I mean, even the ones that were not just blockaded, but genocidally invaded, still turned from really bad feudal peasant states into modern industrial nations faster than any previous countries.
    - Kbelicius 6y ago
      Which countries would that be?
      - SerLava 6y ago
        For instance Russia, China
  - artem247 6y ago
    Well in my country between 1945 and 1990 many good things were done in regards to education, healthcare, science, housing - millions of people got their first urban home for free. Of course it had a fair share of problems but I think it is at least comparable with capitalist states.
    - gadders 6y ago
      Which country was that? Did you live there then or were you born after that date?
    - Google234 6y ago
      The Soviet Union was a pile of rust by 1990. I’m not sure how you can justify the immense suffering and indiscriminate persecution just for that...
cardanome 6y ago
You are making up a straw man. The economic blockade by the US has the goal of destroying the political and economic order of Cuba. And just to be clear, this blockade is not just blocking Cuba from trading with the US but is effectively blocking Cuba from a good portion of the world market except for a few small allies. And even those trades with allies can become vastly more costly because of the blockade. There are not many countries that would survive such a blockade not to mention thrive in it. Are there internal problems in Cuba? Sure there are. Does it make my quoted sentence incorrect that said: >Of course because of the economic blockade against Cuba they are forced to be creative on how to use the available resources. No, it does not. It does not state that there might not be also other problems in Cuba. There is lots of internal problems one can talk about and if someone has honest questions, please ask. Just don't use these internal problems to minimize the injustice of the blockade against Cuba. (Not to imply whether this is what my former poster intended to do or not).
- redis_mlc 6y ago
  > The economic blockade by the US has the goal of destroying the political and economic order of Cuba. Well, Cuba could return the US property that was nationalized, and elect a non-Communist government, you know. Instead they swim for the US. Also, the Cuban missile crisis didn't end when people were told. Half of the Russian nuclear missiles were left behind, and when Russia realized Castro wanted to actually use them against the US, Russia had a nightmare in getting them back. (A Russian diplomat became a hero by pointing out some treaty loophole to the Cubans, who decided to follow the "treaty" and allowed the repo. Had the Russians told Castro he was crazy, likely those missiles would still be there.)
- 908B64B197 6y ago
  > the US but is effectively blocking Cuba from a good portion of the world market except for a few small allies. It is not. Every country is free to decide if it wants to trade with Cuba or not. > Just don't use these internal problems to minimize the injustice of the blockade against Cuba There is no injustice. Cuban people can end it whenever they want. Their government too.
sudosysgen 6y ago
Cuba has a GDP PPP per capita of around 25 000$, which is above the worldwide average. This is despite being prevented from trading with all but a handful of countries. It's by very far the wealthiest country under US embargo, and better to live in than most of the world. Given their current, fairly high standard of living, they would probably economically be a first world country without a US embargo - as it is they're already quite close.
helloworld11 6y ago
Those of you making defenses of Cuba here are flatly deluded if you make these claims seriously. Cuba was only able to sustain itself with enormous Soviet backing and this regardless of the economic embargo by the U.S. Once the USSR collapsed, the Cuban government made hurried attempts at introducing partial capital-friendly reforms in certain sectors (especially tourism) which still never really brought major benefit to its people because the rest of the stagnant, suffocating socialist bureaucracy remained in place for most of daily life. I am absolutely no fan of the U.S embargo and think it was a an idiotic disaster in terms of both PR and practical terms, a useful blame point for decades of corrupt, criminally repressive Cuban government propaganda, that allowed that state to conveniently deviate attention away from its own very real failures in trying to stick to ideology in the country. None of this is to even mention the very real dictatorship of one single political party running that country for so long under conditions that simply cannot be compared to those of most democratized countries. To say otherwise of this is a blatant game of whataboutism which normally gets derided on this site but apparently, by what I see in replies to my original comment above, is supported when it comes to Cuba. It's absurd to see so many HNrs, living under largely privileged market friendly conditions and fully enjoying the benefits of the market in their own personal and professional lives, defending the grotesque little experiment in social and economic repression that is Cuba simply because theyre either ideologically fixated on throwing (partially deserved) shit at the US or emotionally sentimental about a country that few of them would want to actually live in as the locals do, for decades on end.
- artem247 6y ago
  "at country for so long under conditions that simply cannot be compared to those of most democratized countries" Well let's compare Cuba to most democratized countries in the Caribbean. Or in South America. Or to any place that is not US or EU+Switzerland and Norway.

jfoster 6y ago

This model sounds a lot like songthaews in Thailand. Also brings to mind UberPool.

rualca 6y ago

> What they are probably referring too are cooperative taxis. Those are cars or smaller buses that are driving a certain route, like a bus. It's also funny that the ride share concept has been huge throughout the west, with a couple of unicorns profiting from it, but once the same concept is applied to Cuba... Well, suddenly "deteriorating public transport" becomes a key point.

jhbadger 6y ago
At least in the US, deteriorating public transit is a major reason for the success of things like Uber. Obviously right now a lot of people are working from home making the issue moot, but over the past decade the NYC subway, Boston T, and Washington Metro have had many, many problems of reliability as decades of minimal maintenance have finally caused major problems in their infrastructure, and many people in big US cities have switched to ride sharing for trips that they used to use public transit for.

Clewza313 6y ago

The article doesn't claim they're private vehicles. The "amarillo" organized hitchhiking system is absolutely a thing, and it relies on government vehicles: https://hitchwiki.org/en/Cuba https://hitchwiki.org/en/Cuba

yoandy 6y ago

> Saying the public transport in Cuba is bad makes no sense. Basically nobody owns a car in Cuba and people still get around just fine what does not make sense is saying that "the public transport in Cuba is bad makes no sense". Both public or private transport is bad in any angle. You can not say people still get around just fine when for instances sometimes you need 4 hours or more to reach a place 80 kilometers far from you. Sometimes you just have to give up and returns home after some hours exposed to the sun on the road. * As someone who is born in Cuba and lived and studied in Cuba, feel free to ask additional questions ;)

cardanome 6y ago
> You can not say people still get around just fine when for instances sometimes you need 4 hours or more to reach a place 80 kilometers far from you. If you are a bit unlucky that might be a realistic time for traveling by train here in Germany so I don't really see the horror. They don't have the public transport level of Japan sure but even most of the developed world is much worse. In most parts of the US not owning a car is not even a realistic options. If we are fair and compare Cuba to other underdeveloped countries in South America then they compare very favorable.
- yoandy 6y ago
  common on! don't troll my comment, in Germany you have to be unlucky enough if you travel by train and it is delayed at all.

htowncu 6y ago

Sorry, but you are mistaken, there is a mandate in Cuba that government vehicles must stop to pick up passengers if an "Amarillo" stops them, failing to do so will have them reported and "perhaps" face some consequence. The Amarillo, named like this because of their uniform, always have a little board where they write down the plates of all the government's cars who didn't stop when they had capacity. People don't get around just fine, your experience was probably heavily skewed as a foreigner. There is no reliable train in Cuba, a 200 miles trip might take 18hrs. Inter provinces traveling is a nightmare, you can go to a bus terminal and wait days to get a ticket to the other side of the country, by wait days I mean on the terminal, sleeping on the floor. I left Cuba around 7 years ago, right after college. My weekly routine was leaving college on Fridays at 5pm and go hitchhike in Alamar for a few hours, some days it was quick, others I could arrive at Alamar at 6pm and still be there at 11pm and finally getting home at 1AM. The travel back was the same until through a friend of mine I was able to get a weekly "leftover" seat in those tourist's bus.

cardanome 6y ago
> People don't get around just fine, your experience was probably heavily skewed as a foreigner. I did not use any form of public transport for tourists. That would have been way too expensive in the long run. I was traveling as any Cuban was traveling. And yes that included waiting for hours on bus terminals and the like. Big deal. > There is no reliable train in Cuba, a 200 miles trip might take 18hrs. I could tell you horror stories about the advanced train system in Germany as well but that would be besides the point. Most people don't need to travel 200 miles that often. For the daily necessities of getting to work, shopping and the likes the public transport system works. Sure the buses are crowded to a maximum, there are not reliable schedules but at least people can afford basic mobility which is not true for many parts of the less developed world. > I left Cuba around 7 years ago, right after college. Now you live in the USA. Oh and new account and only posting about Cuba. Funny how it is always the same story with that kind of accounts.
- htowncu 6y ago
  Let me guess, you lived in Havana, the city in Cuba with the highest population density, the only city where public services are somehow functional. What constitute basic mobility for you? I once had to travel from Matanzas to Havana in an overcrowded bus, standing, and with no ventilation because it was one of those buses that were supposed to have AC. Is that what constitutes basic mobility for you? I'm sure a great way to live your life is to always compare oneself against the poorest countries, that way you are always on top. Did you wait days in a bus terminal? A lot of people must travel to Havana at some point because that's the only place in the country where they can get some kind of paperwork or surgery done. I have multiple accounts, do you know why? I bet you have never had to thought about it? Cuba recently created a law that allows them to give you prison time if you post "anything" on social media that they might interpret as "damaging the image of the Cuban revolution". Is funny how is usually the foreigners preaching the greatness of Cuba.