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The cheat creators are benefitting from breaking the game and selling their cheats to 1. normal consumers 2. esports professionals. Because of the cheats, the

The cheat creators are benefitting from breaking the game and selling their cheats to 1. normal consumers 2. esports professionals. Because of the cheats, the game creators need to patch them out, create detection tools and generally invest more resources into the game, which obviously costs and drops profits. If they don't, the game is dead. The cheat creators are basically holding a gun to the game developers' head.

andreareina 6y ago
> The cheat creators are basically holding a gun to the game developers' head. This is hyperbole. Every other sport has its cheaters and they manage the problem without getting the cops involved.
- flohofwoe 6y ago
  At least in case of the German doping scandals, police was very heavily involved, e.g.: https://www.welt.de/sport/article189528515/Doping-Beben-Dieser-deutsche-Arzt-soll-der-Drahtzieher-sein.html https://www.welt.de/sport/article189528515/Doping-Beben-Dies... (related English article, not a translation of the first link: https://www.dw.com/en/doping-probe-of-german-doctor-leads-to-21-athletes-from-8-countries/a-47993421 https://www.dw.com/en/doping-probe-of-german-doctor-leads-to...)
  - cturner 6y ago
    The matter you have linked to is a criminal matter that relates to the practice of medicine. It is important to differentiate between criminal and civil matters. Police should only be involved in criminal matters, and should never be act as the agent of a party in civil disputes. The matter of video cheating appears to be a civil matter. On this forum of all places, we must be wary of legislative creep towards vague wording such as "the misapplication of computer systems from their intended purpose". At that point, the police will be deployed at the behest of well-connected interests. In practice, it will mean that the system will be used to beat up hackers at the direction of bigco, even for petty matters when it serves to make an example. We have already seen this play out in the Swartz and Aleynikov trials: matters that were civil disputes by any reasonable reading, but which were executed as criminal matters (in one case, even after the plaintiff had withdrawn).
    - flohofwoe 6y ago
      See my other comment above. The "organization" in question is (most likely) an illegal business which didn't pay taxes. This is almost certainly a "criminal matter" in most countries, police get involved all the time when it comes to illegal business practices, at the least the police is doing searches and arrests. This isn't the old type of harmless "crackers and warez groups" scene, but first and foremost about making money. PS: I wonder if commenters here think that Tencent is sending police after the people using those cheats? It's clearly about the organization producing and selling the cheats. The players will at most get a simple ban.
      - cturner 6y ago
        Both this comment and your earlier comment appear to be speculation. Above you said they did not pay taxes, but now you seem less sure. Why? What is your evidence?
        flohofwoe 6y ago
        It's my speculation in this specific case, but that's how such "companies" usually work, they are highly professional in every aspect except for being an actually registered company - because then they could be "legally dealt with", depending on the country they operate from of course (I've been on the other side for the last 10 years working on an MMO, and having to deal with professional-quality commercial bots is unfortunately a constant "background distraction" for us).
        cturner 6y ago
        Thanks for the context regarding your experience in a related domain. Still, in your comments you have been presenting speculation as fact. Please don't do that.

andreareina 6y ago

> The cheat creators are basically holding a gun to the game developers' head. This is hyperbole. Every other sport has its cheaters and they manage the problem without getting the cops involved.

flohofwoe 6y ago
At least in case of the German doping scandals, police was very heavily involved, e.g.: https://www.welt.de/sport/article189528515/Doping-Beben-Dieser-deutsche-Arzt-soll-der-Drahtzieher-sein.html https://www.welt.de/sport/article189528515/Doping-Beben-Dies... (related English article, not a translation of the first link: https://www.dw.com/en/doping-probe-of-german-doctor-leads-to-21-athletes-from-8-countries/a-47993421 https://www.dw.com/en/doping-probe-of-german-doctor-leads-to...)
- cturner 6y ago
  The matter you have linked to is a criminal matter that relates to the practice of medicine. It is important to differentiate between criminal and civil matters. Police should only be involved in criminal matters, and should never be act as the agent of a party in civil disputes. The matter of video cheating appears to be a civil matter. On this forum of all places, we must be wary of legislative creep towards vague wording such as "the misapplication of computer systems from their intended purpose". At that point, the police will be deployed at the behest of well-connected interests. In practice, it will mean that the system will be used to beat up hackers at the direction of bigco, even for petty matters when it serves to make an example. We have already seen this play out in the Swartz and Aleynikov trials: matters that were civil disputes by any reasonable reading, but which were executed as criminal matters (in one case, even after the plaintiff had withdrawn).
  - flohofwoe 6y ago
    See my other comment above. The "organization" in question is (most likely) an illegal business which didn't pay taxes. This is almost certainly a "criminal matter" in most countries, police get involved all the time when it comes to illegal business practices, at the least the police is doing searches and arrests. This isn't the old type of harmless "crackers and warez groups" scene, but first and foremost about making money. PS: I wonder if commenters here think that Tencent is sending police after the people using those cheats? It's clearly about the organization producing and selling the cheats. The players will at most get a simple ban.
    - cturner 6y ago
      Both this comment and your earlier comment appear to be speculation. Above you said they did not pay taxes, but now you seem less sure. Why? What is your evidence?
      - flohofwoe 6y ago
        It's my speculation in this specific case, but that's how such "companies" usually work, they are highly professional in every aspect except for being an actually registered company - because then they could be "legally dealt with", depending on the country they operate from of course (I've been on the other side for the last 10 years working on an MMO, and having to deal with professional-quality commercial bots is unfortunately a constant "background distraction" for us).
        cturner 6y ago
        Thanks for the context regarding your experience in a related domain. Still, in your comments you have been presenting speculation as fact. Please don't do that.