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Don't miss Dustin's (Asana co-founder) response: https://twitter.com/moskov/status/1377007980063809541 https://twitter.com/moskov/status/1377007980063809541

ganafagol 6y ago
This. It sheds some light on how this whole situation actually went down, and in hindsight, this disconnect between perception and reality may well be the root cause of Andrew's failure.
- heterodoxxed 6y ago
  Or, Dustin is lying or remembering himself in the best light. We'll never really know.
  - luckylion 6y ago
    Hey, he works on projects that help humanity thrive. Like facebook, for example.
  - nemothekid 6y ago
    Spending an hour to gloat is cartoonishly villainous. I thought Andrew was spicing up the story there.
- joshmanders 6y ago
  This whole story sounds like another Andrew Wilkinson embellishment story. Between this and claiming Slack's only reason for being worth as much as they were was because his design team work early on. My takeaway from this story isn't nearly what Andrew believes his is. What I see is he was so tunnel visioned on trying to crush Asana and be not only the market leader but only option that he neglected his customers needs and wants until they just bailed on Flow for alternative products. Death by a million papercuts, sure, but mostly from his own errors.
davedx 6y ago
It's all a bit "He says, she says", isn't it? I think it's not really the point of the Tweets anyway
- austhrow743 6y ago
  “He says, she says” generally implies disagreement.
tweetle_beetle 6y ago
> Even OUR OWN Google keywords were plastered with “Asana vs. Flow” paid links. I don't know if this shock is in good faith, but it is very naive for a founder of a SaaS to not be aware of such marketing strategies - brand PPC campaigns are basic. On a side note, I've often wondered how much money Google must make from people paying to fill up the ad slots for keywords which are their company name and they already rank in position 1 for. "If you don't bid for them, then your competitor might - so give us your money".
- dbuder 6y ago
  The real story is how much they charge company A to defend their search terms vs how much they charge company B to usurp company A's search term, ie they are using all their data to extract maximum rent and not running a "fair" auction.
  - austinpena 6y ago
    What do you mean? I’ve run plenty of brand campaigns and the clicks tend to be an order of magnitude cheaper than running keywords on competitors keywords. My experience typically lies with local companies though.
    - canadianwriter 6y ago
      My experience is the same. I've worked with tiny startups as well as giant enterprises and the brand campaign is always super cheap.
      - austinpena 6y ago
        I'm curious, what kind of CTR do you usually see for branded campaigns? I tend to keep call extensions off of branded campaigns (so existing customers scroll down to Location Listings). I see ~30%. And again, this is only for local service businesses.
    - vgeek 6y ago
ggm 6y ago
I'd say that was when he misread the signs, but probably was never going to be topdog in the deal. Maybe ego got in the way.
ReflectedImage 6y ago
Please deal with Harris situation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6cake3bwnY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6cake3bwnY
Topgamer7 6y ago
But does the Bond villain ever know they are the Bond villain? Or are they the protagonist of their own self directed story.

ganafagol 6y ago

This. It sheds some light on how this whole situation actually went down, and in hindsight, this disconnect between perception and reality may well be the root cause of Andrew's failure.

heterodoxxed 6y ago
Or, Dustin is lying or remembering himself in the best light. We'll never really know.
- luckylion 6y ago
  Hey, he works on projects that help humanity thrive. Like facebook, for example.
- nemothekid 6y ago
  Spending an hour to gloat is cartoonishly villainous. I thought Andrew was spicing up the story there.
joshmanders 6y ago
This whole story sounds like another Andrew Wilkinson embellishment story. Between this and claiming Slack's only reason for being worth as much as they were was because his design team work early on. My takeaway from this story isn't nearly what Andrew believes his is. What I see is he was so tunnel visioned on trying to crush Asana and be not only the market leader but only option that he neglected his customers needs and wants until they just bailed on Flow for alternative products. Death by a million papercuts, sure, but mostly from his own errors.

davedx 6y ago

It's all a bit "He says, she says", isn't it? I think it's not really the point of the Tweets anyway

austhrow743 6y ago
“He says, she says” generally implies disagreement.

tweetle_beetle 6y ago

> Even OUR OWN Google keywords were plastered with “Asana vs. Flow” paid links. I don't know if this shock is in good faith, but it is very naive for a founder of a SaaS to not be aware of such marketing strategies - brand PPC campaigns are basic. On a side note, I've often wondered how much money Google must make from people paying to fill up the ad slots for keywords which are their company name and they already rank in position 1 for. "If you don't bid for them, then your competitor might - so give us your money".

dbuder 6y ago
The real story is how much they charge company A to defend their search terms vs how much they charge company B to usurp company A's search term, ie they are using all their data to extract maximum rent and not running a "fair" auction.
- austinpena 6y ago
  What do you mean? I’ve run plenty of brand campaigns and the clicks tend to be an order of magnitude cheaper than running keywords on competitors keywords. My experience typically lies with local companies though.
  - canadianwriter 6y ago
    My experience is the same. I've worked with tiny startups as well as giant enterprises and the brand campaign is always super cheap.
    - austinpena 6y ago
      I'm curious, what kind of CTR do you usually see for branded campaigns? I tend to keep call extensions off of branded campaigns (so existing customers scroll down to Location Listings). I see ~30%. And again, this is only for local service businesses.
  - vgeek 6y ago

ggm 6y ago

I'd say that was when he misread the signs, but probably was never going to be topdog in the deal. Maybe ego got in the way.

ReflectedImage 6y ago

Please deal with Harris situation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6cake3bwnY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U6cake3bwnY

Topgamer7 6y ago

But does the Bond villain ever know they are the Bond villain? Or are they the protagonist of their own self directed story.