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The curious history of NovaMin toothpaste (2018)
- sneak 6y agoIf there are regulatory issues selling it in the US, why can anyone in the US buy it on Amazon direct from the manufacturer?
- dannyw 6y agoProbably because our regulatory agencies are reactive and spend their time on things other than taking down Novamin international toothpaste imports from Amazon, especially when it's probably the only "restricted" toothpaste in the USA.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- Gys 6y agoOn Amazon are many counterfeited products: there is no quality check, it is just a marketplace. An expensive toothpaste sounds perfect to scam: ordinary white toothpaste can be very cheap and just by putting some text on the outside it becomes very valuable. One would need a lab to check if its true.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- Cardiologist2 6y agoNovamin is very different from other toothpastes. I can feel it with my tongue - my teeth become glassy/hard in like 10 min, and the effect persists to the next day. I can’t speak to anyone else’s experience, but I can detect a scam toothpaste pretty quickly & send it back.
- alanbernstein 6y agoI tried the sensodyne version once, after buying from Amazon. That's not how I would describe it, instead the paste had an unusual warmth to it. Does that sound familiar to you? I'm just asking because I'm curious if I got the real stuff or not, no real way to know.
- ValentineC 6y agoI've used retail Sensodyne with NovaMin. I second the feeling of warmth after brushing.
- Cardiologist2 6y agoIt doesn’t, but there might be variation between people? For me the toothpaste (sensodyne novamin) has a slightly crunchy feel, and yeah, the smooth glassy coating. https://www.amazon.com/Sensodyne-Repair-Protect-Whitening-Toothpaste/product-reviews/B008VPSTOA/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_viewopt_kywd?pageNumber=1&filterByKeyword=Smooth https://www.amazon.com/Sensodyne-Repair-Protect-Whitening-To... I also use an electric toothbrush, so that might make a difference.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- smcleod 6y agoThis article covers the older NovaMin which is used in the commonly available Sensodyne toothpaste, NovaMin is an older formula, BioMin is the newer replacement. https://www.biomin.co.uk/science-information/bioactive-glasses/biomintm-vs-novaminr https://www.biomin.co.uk/science-information/bioactive-glass... https://www.biomin.co.uk/professional-information/clinical-studies https://www.biomin.co.uk/professional-information/clinical-s...
- kristofferR 6y ago"First fluoride-containing bioglass toothpaste cleared for sale in the US" - Dec 2020 https://www.dental-tribune.com/news/first-fluoride-containing-bioglass-toothpaste-cleared-for-sale-in-the-u-s/ https://www.dental-tribune.com/news/first-fluoride-containin...
- argonaut 6y agoLast I checked, there isn't clear evidence that Biomin F is superior to Novamin. Some studies show Biomin F is better, but some studies show they have the same effect.
- TheEnder8 6y agoIt looks to be decent at helping sensitive teeth, but not so much for cavities: https://aap.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1902/jop.2010.100056 https://aap.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1902/jop.2010... https://www.karger.com/Article/Abstract/453622 https://www.karger.com/Article/Abstract/453622
- ta54832 6y agoI wonder how it compares to Elmex Gelee which is only sold in pharmacies and also recommended by dentists. It can also remove initial caries.
- slimsag 6y agoThere is also Nano-Hydroxyapatite toothpastes, from Japan. From my naive understanding, it is better than NovaMin and Flouride generally - there has been a lot of research on it.
- danmaz74 6y agoIs that the same as zinc hydroxyapatite? In Italy it's pretty well known under the brand name BioRepair (which is how I discovered about it, and personally I'm very satisfied with it)
- fbn79 6y agoStudy that comparey biorepair and sensodyne https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/sca.21105 https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/sca.21105
- eridan2 6y agoso they tested 2 Biorepair products, but only one was effective
- GistNoesis 6y agoProbably not. Though probably both are somehow effective. In this https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0300571211000832#bib0045 https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S030057121... they study some difference between the Zinc-nano-Hydroxyapatite vs pure nano-Hydroxyapatite. But zinc-hydroxyapatite in BioRepair may not be some Zinc-nano-Hydroxyapatite. They are the same compounds but the size of the crystals are not the same. BioRepair is advertised as "microRepair". The size of the crystals seems to matter : smaller crystals are better as they allow to get inside smaller holes to fill them, but probably also more expensive to produce. Source : https://www.hindawi.com/journals/jnm/2009/746383/ https://www.hindawi.com/journals/jnm/2009/746383/ >"It can be supposed that the application of CHA nanocrystals 20 nm sized allows a better mineralization in the lower surface fissure, because the interprismatic and prismatic enamel structures appear totally hidden. Using an equal time of treatment, the application of CHA nanocrystals 100 nm sized produces the formation of a homogeneous coating which hides interprismatic and prismatic enamel structures when examined with SEM." Toothpaste is kind of a complex mixture that also depends on the PH and the interaction with saliva to work. Therefore probably only specific studies between the full products using a microscope could tell the better products. As a final note, the tooth mineralization is a tug-of-war (dynamic equilibrium) between demineralization and remineralization, this means that using more effective products should be used carefully and not as an excuse to compensate for bad behavior like excessive soda consumption throughout the day.
- teslabox 6y ago'Why do I have a tab with a search about NovaMin open already?' NovaMin was mentioned in a comment by @dannyw two days ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26642987 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26642987 The author of this Medium post mentioned this link in a comment ~10 months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23345716 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23345716 Some comments mentioning NovaMin over the years: https://hn.algolia.com/?dateEnd=1609372800&dateRange=custom&dateStart=985305600&page=0&prefix=false&query=Novamin%20toothpaste&sort=byPopularity&type=comment https://hn.algolia.com/?dateEnd=1609372800&dateRange=custom&...
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- kristofferR 6y agoAnother interesting teeth restoring substance I just discovered: Oligopeptide P11-4 [1] [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligopeptide_P11-4 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligopeptide_P11-4
- nextos 6y agoCame here to post the same thing. This is actually the state of the art [1]. A peptide that helps creating a scaffold to rebuild little enamel cracks. If you apply some P11-4 varnish and you use a regular toothpaste results are quite good. Something to keep in mind is that fluoride might interfere with newer enamel repair technologies, but not with NovaMin. Fluoride is nice, although I have some little concerns about swallowing it and getting some accumulation in soft tissue which alter calcium pathways. The Japanese strongly prefer HPA, which is safer and more effective. It's funny it has not become popular in the West. I have tried basically all different technologies, and the only one that has made (a small) difference has been P11-4 plus a calcium salt toothpaste. [1] https://sci-hub.st/https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00784-019-02901-4 https://sci-hub.st/https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007...
- cy_hauser 6y agoAm I the only one getting a weird conspiracy vibe when reading the article?
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- Laforet 6y agoThere has been a similar story from last year when FDA red tape prevented certain types of pasta from being imported into the US. https://www.grubstreet.com/2020/12/2020-bucatini-shortage-investigation.html https://www.grubstreet.com/2020/12/2020-bucatini-shortage-in... To be fair this is not just limited to the US. In a theoretically free trade world, food safety regulation remains one of the few ways that states could still practice mercantilism. https://www.livescience.com/47032-time-for-us-to-ban-ractopamine.html https://www.livescience.com/47032-time-for-us-to-ban-ractopa... https://www.bigissue.com/latest/the-truth-behind-the-chlorinated-chicken-panic/ https://www.bigissue.com/latest/the-truth-behind-the-chlorin...
- Cthulhu_ 6y agoYeah, but it seems to be mostly because the change has been silent and under the covers. But what I gathered are two basic things: One, GSK bought up the brand name NovaMin, possibly related patents. GSK took competitors (or their own product?) off the market, and pushed their premium and strongest brand Sensodyne to the front. Two, toothpaste is considered a drug in the US and falls under strict rules. They can still use NovaMin / the chemical compound, it's still there, they're just not allowed to advertise with it.
- ykevinator3 6y agoI would have liked this to be a conspiracy for true crime fun but I appreciate the authors post script explaining the reasoning why it's not available.
- williesleg 6y agoHydroxy chloroquine all over again. Forget the science, sit back and watch the sniping.
- BrandoElFollito 6y agoIt appears to be available in France: https://www.sensodyne.fr/produits/dentifrices/repare-et-protege-original.html https://www.sensodyne.fr/produits/dentifrices/repare-et-prot... EDIT: BioMin as well: https://biomin.fr/ https://biomin.fr/
- 0cVlTeIATBs 6y agoBack in 2012-14 I similarly found that Burt's Bee's was the only toothpaste with it locally, and went to eBay for more when it was discontinued. I had a couple chips on my teeth I hoped would improve, but there was no change. After my last tube ran out I realized that Colgate/Crest clean better anyway.
- elliekelly 6y agoOn the toothpaste technology front I’ve been using Livionex[1] for years now and I can’t believe it hasn’t caught a larger following, especially with the HN crowd. You can feel the plaque reduction. Occasionally I’ve had to use traditional paste while traveling and it’s really quite a gross sensation now that I’m accustomed to the gel. I have no affiliation with the company other than being a very satisfied customer. [1]https://getlivfresh.com/how-it-works/ https://getlivfresh.com/how-it-works/
- totalZero 6y agoIf they add some stannous fluoride and make it foamy I'd probably try it. The Verdict: The gel, called Livionex, removed plaque better than Colgate Total—a popular product used as a comparison—in a study at the University of California, Irvine. The results look promising, but longer studies with more subjects are needed, particularly since the new gel doesn’t contain fluoride, dentists say. “Fluoride has 150 years of solid research proving that it does prevent cavities and tooth decay,” says Sally Cram, a Washington, D.C., periodontist and a spokeswoman for the American Dental Association. If you’re thinking about trying the new gel, Dr. Cram suggests talking to your dentist about your risk for tooth decay and considering using fluoride mouthwash along with it. [0] [0]https://www.wsj.com/articles/anti-plaque-dental-gel-excels-1470068313 https://www.wsj.com/articles/anti-plaque-dental-gel-excels-1...
- Logon90 6y agoWow, can't believe they are still pushing the fluoride thing. It's almost as if they cannot handle the cognitive dissonance of people having good dental results without fluoride. Certainly not 150 years of solid research, more like, since WWII, when the goverment got sued by fluoride laborers.
- korm 6y agoI'll wait for more and longer term studies before I try it. Maybe it slowly erodes teeth, or destroys amalgam fillings since it's EDTA.
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- dentalperson 6y agoAnother tooth restorative product that is hard to find in the USA is CPP-ACP (Recaldent). Apparently there are some regulatory issues with this product as well. It's available in the USA as MI Paste, and in other countries as Recaldent gum. I was interested in this for a while as it seems promising and you can feel the anti-plaque slickness effect, but on the other hand, the research tends to be in lesser-known journals, which is suspicious to me.
- nxc18 6y agoRecaldent gum used to be widely available in the US. I was a big fan of the trident gum variety, which had recaldent and was sweetened with xylitol. It was a solid product but it just disappeared one day. And unfortunately the shelf life for that gum was a bit worse than usual, so hoarding isn’t a great strategy. I think last time I was able to get it was around 2010. Edit: something is going wrong in American regulation of dental products. I should not have to illegally buy smuggled toothpaste and gum from Europe and Canada in order to maintain my dental health. I don’t understand how that makes anyone safer and regulators haven’t said why Americans are at risk in a way that Europeans aren’t.