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> What we almost need is an NNTP 2.0 that makes it easier for smaller federated groups. We've had that with XMPP and Publish-Subscribe for years: if the projec

by rakoo 6y ago

> What we almost need is an NNTP 2.0 that makes it easier for smaller federated groups. We've had that with XMPP and Publish-Subscribe for years: if the project has a server with this XEP enabled, any authorized user (registered anywhere) can post any type of content.

WorldMaker 6y ago
PubSub alone isn't a great replacement for NNTP. (It's maybe a replacement for SMTP.) The reasons for an NNTP 2.0 (as mentioned above) are more about storage/forwarding, if you want access to the back history as opposed to just live updates. You can build such things on top of a PubSub protocol, as ActivityPub is at heart still a PubSub protocol, but has a lot more storage/forwarding concerns added on top, as an example.
- rakoo 6y ago
  XMPP Core is a replacement for SMTP. XMPP pubsub is much more than just pubsub, take a look at https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html. There is everything about querying and forwarding, in this XEP and in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html. There is precedent for posting content and replying inside XMPP's pubsub as documented in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; the same can be used for general discussions
  - WorldMaker 6y ago
    Fair points. I wasn't aware of any of these tools, but then like the majority of the world I haven't actively used XMPP in years (which is obviously among its largest cons today).
    - rakoo 6y ago
      My intent wasn't to diminish your initial comment, just that a protocol is a technical answer to a problem that is more probably a societal one. It takes time and effort to commit to another communication protocol, especially when it's not the core of what you're doing as a project. Maybe what is needed is not just a protocol but proper tools to make it easy to use (and the bar with the simplicity of email is very high)

by rakoo 6y ago

WorldMaker 6y ago

PubSub alone isn't a great replacement for NNTP. (It's maybe a replacement for SMTP.) The reasons for an NNTP 2.0 (as mentioned above) are more about storage/forwarding, if you want access to the back history as opposed to just live updates. You can build such things on top of a PubSub protocol, as ActivityPub is at heart still a PubSub protocol, but has a lot more storage/forwarding concerns added on top, as an example.

rakoo 6y ago
XMPP Core is a replacement for SMTP. XMPP pubsub is much more than just pubsub, take a look at https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html. There is everything about querying and forwarding, in this XEP and in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html. There is precedent for posting content and replying inside XMPP's pubsub as documented in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; the same can be used for general discussions
- WorldMaker 6y ago
  Fair points. I wasn't aware of any of these tools, but then like the majority of the world I haven't actively used XMPP in years (which is obviously among its largest cons today).
  - rakoo 6y ago
    My intent wasn't to diminish your initial comment, just that a protocol is a technical answer to a problem that is more probably a societal one. It takes time and effort to commit to another communication protocol, especially when it's not the core of what you're doing as a project. Maybe what is needed is not just a protocol but proper tools to make it easy to use (and the bar with the simplicity of email is very high)