5 ms·

Given gmane's funding crises over the years, it feels hard to recommend relying on such a service long term. (Though I've certainly relied on it over the years

Given gmane's funding crises over the years, it feels hard to recommend relying on such a service long term. (Though I've certainly relied on it over the years for a number of different reasons.) What we almost need is an NNTP 2.0 that makes it easier for smaller federated groups. (Maybe this is a good use for ActivityPub and/or Matrix?) (Public-Inbox is new to me and at first skim seems to cover some interesting bases here. I'm not thrilled at the AGPL licensing though.)

rakoo 6y ago
> What we almost need is an NNTP 2.0 that makes it easier for smaller federated groups. We've had that with XMPP and Publish-Subscribe for years: if the project has a server with this XEP enabled, any authorized user (registered anywhere) can post any type of content.
- WorldMaker 6y ago
  PubSub alone isn't a great replacement for NNTP. (It's maybe a replacement for SMTP.) The reasons for an NNTP 2.0 (as mentioned above) are more about storage/forwarding, if you want access to the back history as opposed to just live updates. You can build such things on top of a PubSub protocol, as ActivityPub is at heart still a PubSub protocol, but has a lot more storage/forwarding concerns added on top, as an example.
  - rakoo 6y ago
    XMPP Core is a replacement for SMTP. XMPP pubsub is much more than just pubsub, take a look at https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html. There is everything about querying and forwarding, in this XEP and in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html. There is precedent for posting content and replying inside XMPP's pubsub as documented in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; the same can be used for general discussions
    - WorldMaker 6y ago
      Fair points. I wasn't aware of any of these tools, but then like the majority of the world I haven't actively used XMPP in years (which is obviously among its largest cons today).
      - rakoo 6y ago
        My intent wasn't to diminish your initial comment, just that a protocol is a technical answer to a problem that is more probably a societal one. It takes time and effort to commit to another communication protocol, especially when it's not the core of what you're doing as a project. Maybe what is needed is not just a protocol but proper tools to make it easy to use (and the bar with the simplicity of email is very high)

rakoo 6y ago

> What we almost need is an NNTP 2.0 that makes it easier for smaller federated groups. We've had that with XMPP and Publish-Subscribe for years: if the project has a server with this XEP enabled, any authorized user (registered anywhere) can post any type of content.

WorldMaker 6y ago
PubSub alone isn't a great replacement for NNTP. (It's maybe a replacement for SMTP.) The reasons for an NNTP 2.0 (as mentioned above) are more about storage/forwarding, if you want access to the back history as opposed to just live updates. You can build such things on top of a PubSub protocol, as ActivityPub is at heart still a PubSub protocol, but has a lot more storage/forwarding concerns added on top, as an example.
- rakoo 6y ago
  XMPP Core is a replacement for SMTP. XMPP pubsub is much more than just pubsub, take a look at https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0060.html. There is everything about querying and forwarding, in this XEP and in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0313.html. There is precedent for posting content and replying inside XMPP's pubsub as documented in https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0277.html; the same can be used for general discussions
  - WorldMaker 6y ago
    Fair points. I wasn't aware of any of these tools, but then like the majority of the world I haven't actively used XMPP in years (which is obviously among its largest cons today).
    - rakoo 6y ago
      My intent wasn't to diminish your initial comment, just that a protocol is a technical answer to a problem that is more probably a societal one. It takes time and effort to commit to another communication protocol, especially when it's not the core of what you're doing as a project. Maybe what is needed is not just a protocol but proper tools to make it easy to use (and the bar with the simplicity of email is very high)