4 ms·

The US Is Real Close to Screwing Up Electric Vehicle Charging Forever

23 points by Umofomia 6y ago

rektide 6y ago
this does seem like an absolute cluster-@#$@# already. and the potential for consumers to get royally jerked around in the future based off the rise & fall of various charging standards seems like an almost certainty. the whole thing feels totally out of control. this is not how vehicles should be competing against one another. this is such bad, immoral behavior, and from a sector that proclaims to be a "better", more moral alternative to what we had. it turns my gut. there shouldn't even have to be a law. this should all be voluntary, based on decency & team-work & the mission. but again, industry just seems unable to function in the most basic, simple, reasonable ways without regulation.
jdpigeon 6y ago
100% this would be a good time for the government to step in mandate a standard.
- theluketaylor 6y ago
  CCS is winning, so unlike Europe the US and Canadian governments don't really have to pick a physical standard. What they need to do is mandate clearly displayed charging rates and open payment methods like credit card swipe and contactless. Using the interstate commerce clause to allow EV chargers to sell power by the kWh would also be a big win since that is highly inconsistent. They should also consider mandating open access to charging infrastructure if the charging company accepts any public money. I own a tesla largely due to the charging network and I think they should be allowed to use their own money to build whatever closed garden they want, but quite often they are getting sweetheart deals on space to put their chargers in exchange for adding some j1772 or CCS at the same time. If they want to build an exclusive network it needs to be with exclusive money. If they accept public money or exchange of favours they should be forced to allow other vehicles to charge and sell access at a reasonable rate.
yosito 6y ago
The same problem exists in Europe. I can relate to the problem of having to carry "a wallet full of RFID cards", which for me is 12 different charging apps on my phone. Some apps work to find a compatible charger, others are necessary to pay. And the rate that I pay varies widely from free to a 35 euro flat rate for a charge (which, yes, is insane). I would think it makes sense to equip all electric cars with a standard charger and integrated software that handles billing for you. Like cell phones. I don't need a different interface for every cell tower I connect to. I pay only one phone company, and they make sure that I can seamlessly connect to cell towers around the globe. Electric vehicle charging networks should work in a similar way.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]
- MaxBarraclough 6y ago
  The wallet-of-RFIDs issue sounds more like an inconvenience than an outright show-stopper though, right? As you say, perhaps there could be a market in providing a unified service, akin to global aviation fuel networks like [0]. I got the impression from this YouTube video [1] that Europe is doing a much better job than the USA at mandating a standard to ensure interoperability and to stop the 'charging format war' from undermining the usefulness of charging infrastructure. [0] https://www.wfscorp.com/en/wfs-segments/aviation https://www.wfscorp.com/en/wfs-segments/aviation [1] https://youtu.be/pLcqJ2DclEg?t=778 https://youtu.be/pLcqJ2DclEg?t=778
Proven 6y ago
So what? Governments rarely do anything correctly anyway. HN readers often claim how profitable and competitive electric powered vehicles are. Why do you need the gubmint to charge your car???
adwi 6y ago
Seems quaint, but contact Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg’s office and let them know as a constituent you’d like to see this problem addressed. https://mobile.twitter.com/SecretaryPete https://mobile.twitter.com/SecretaryPete US Department of Transportation 1200 New Jersey Ave, SE Washington, DC 20590 United States Phone: 1 (202) 366-4000

23 points by Umofomia 6y ago

this does seem like an absolute cluster-@#$@# already. and the potential for consumers to get royally jerked around in the future based off the rise & fall of various charging standards seems like an almost certainty. the whole thing feels totally out of control. this is not how vehicles should be competing against one another. this is such bad, immoral behavior, and from a sector that proclaims to be a "better", more moral alternative to what we had. it turns my gut. there shouldn't even have to be a law. this should all be voluntary, based on decency & team-work & the mission. but again, industry just seems unable to function in the most basic, simple, reasonable ways without regulation.

jdpigeon 6y ago

100% this would be a good time for the government to step in mandate a standard.

theluketaylor 6y ago
CCS is winning, so unlike Europe the US and Canadian governments don't really have to pick a physical standard. What they need to do is mandate clearly displayed charging rates and open payment methods like credit card swipe and contactless. Using the interstate commerce clause to allow EV chargers to sell power by the kWh would also be a big win since that is highly inconsistent. They should also consider mandating open access to charging infrastructure if the charging company accepts any public money. I own a tesla largely due to the charging network and I think they should be allowed to use their own money to build whatever closed garden they want, but quite often they are getting sweetheart deals on space to put their chargers in exchange for adding some j1772 or CCS at the same time. If they want to build an exclusive network it needs to be with exclusive money. If they accept public money or exchange of favours they should be forced to allow other vehicles to charge and sell access at a reasonable rate.

yosito 6y ago

The same problem exists in Europe. I can relate to the problem of having to carry "a wallet full of RFID cards", which for me is 12 different charging apps on my phone. Some apps work to find a compatible charger, others are necessary to pay. And the rate that I pay varies widely from free to a 35 euro flat rate for a charge (which, yes, is insane). I would think it makes sense to equip all electric cars with a standard charger and integrated software that handles billing for you. Like cell phones. I don't need a different interface for every cell tower I connect to. I pay only one phone company, and they make sure that I can seamlessly connect to cell towers around the globe. Electric vehicle charging networks should work in a similar way.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
MaxBarraclough 6y ago
The wallet-of-RFIDs issue sounds more like an inconvenience than an outright show-stopper though, right? As you say, perhaps there could be a market in providing a unified service, akin to global aviation fuel networks like [0]. I got the impression from this YouTube video [1] that Europe is doing a much better job than the USA at mandating a standard to ensure interoperability and to stop the 'charging format war' from undermining the usefulness of charging infrastructure. [0] https://www.wfscorp.com/en/wfs-segments/aviation https://www.wfscorp.com/en/wfs-segments/aviation [1] https://youtu.be/pLcqJ2DclEg?t=778 https://youtu.be/pLcqJ2DclEg?t=778

Proven 6y ago

So what? Governments rarely do anything correctly anyway. HN readers often claim how profitable and competitive electric powered vehicles are. Why do you need the gubmint to charge your car???

adwi 6y ago

Seems quaint, but contact Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg’s office and let them know as a constituent you’d like to see this problem addressed. https://mobile.twitter.com/SecretaryPete https://mobile.twitter.com/SecretaryPete US Department of Transportation 1200 New Jersey Ave, SE Washington, DC 20590 United States Phone: 1 (202) 366-4000