5 ms·

In all fairness, this same rhetorical technique was commonly used in the faith that I was raised in. We were often taught that one could violate the Jewish/Chri

In all fairness, this same rhetorical technique was commonly used in the faith that I was raised in. We were often taught that one could violate the Jewish/Christian commandment to "have no other gods before me" by placing more importance on material goods or hobbies (your car, your boat, sports, etc.) than worshiping God.

krapp 6y ago
Judaism was a monotheistic religion surrounded by polytheists, their concern was maintaining their cultural integrity and identity. Other commandments (though shalt not covet, etc) are concerned with materialism and greed. "Though Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me" is pretty clearly about precisely what it says on the tin.
- ARandomerDude 6y ago
  Not necessarily. "Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things." - Philippians 3:19
  - aljarry 6y ago
    Letter to Philippians is much younger history, though. I don't recall Old Testament ever mixing meaning of "gods" and hedonism.
    - crgwbr 6y ago
      One example would be Matthew 6:24b: “You cannot slave for God and for Riches” Riches is capitalized because it’s being personified as a competing god.
      - aljarry 6y ago
        It's also New Testament, but the "Riches" is capitalized in specific translation you're using, it's not capitalized in New King James, and neither in New International Version. I'd wager it's relatively modern addition. To see if that point is actually in the sources, you would need to go into Greek, or look for a good historic analysis of Gospel of Matthews. [edit] Ten commandments come from oral tradition, but most probably were written down at least a few hundreds years earlier (500 or 600BC)
- 8note 6y ago
  Especially keeping Seleucid influence down when they tried to hellenize Israel
- constGard 6y ago
  Of course; I'm just pointing out that the conflation has both precedent and cultural roots.
incompatible 6y ago
Does this apply to husbands and wives as well as cars?
- throw0101a 6y ago
  Yes. Would you lie in court for your spouse? Is telling the truth more or less important than whatever consequences they would face from your honest testimony? Luke 14:26: > If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple. * https://biblehub.com/luke/14-26.htm https://biblehub.com/luke/14-26.htm This is hyperbole, which Jesus uses relatively often. It is also more subtle in the original Greek: while we often use the word "hate", the original has more of a connotation of (IIRC) separate-yourself-from. See also: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:29 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:29 * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:30 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:30 It is not that one's parents, spouse, siblings are bad in themselves, but that one has to be mindful that the source of being tempted to not act morally and doing the right thing can come from anywhere—even people that we would otherwise cherish.
Pokepokalypse 6y ago
That's very common. And so intellectually insulting, that it's probably responsible for a non-trivial slice of that 50% drop in church attendance.

krapp 6y ago

Judaism was a monotheistic religion surrounded by polytheists, their concern was maintaining their cultural integrity and identity. Other commandments (though shalt not covet, etc) are concerned with materialism and greed. "Though Shalt Have No Other Gods Before Me" is pretty clearly about precisely what it says on the tin.

ARandomerDude 6y ago
Not necessarily. "Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things." - Philippians 3:19
- aljarry 6y ago
  Letter to Philippians is much younger history, though. I don't recall Old Testament ever mixing meaning of "gods" and hedonism.
  - crgwbr 6y ago
    One example would be Matthew 6:24b: “You cannot slave for God and for Riches” Riches is capitalized because it’s being personified as a competing god.
    - aljarry 6y ago
      It's also New Testament, but the "Riches" is capitalized in specific translation you're using, it's not capitalized in New King James, and neither in New International Version. I'd wager it's relatively modern addition. To see if that point is actually in the sources, you would need to go into Greek, or look for a good historic analysis of Gospel of Matthews. [edit] Ten commandments come from oral tradition, but most probably were written down at least a few hundreds years earlier (500 or 600BC)
8note 6y ago
Especially keeping Seleucid influence down when they tried to hellenize Israel
constGard 6y ago
Of course; I'm just pointing out that the conflation has both precedent and cultural roots.

incompatible 6y ago

Does this apply to husbands and wives as well as cars?

throw0101a 6y ago
Yes. Would you lie in court for your spouse? Is telling the truth more or less important than whatever consequences they would face from your honest testimony? Luke 14:26: > If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life--such a person cannot be my disciple. * https://biblehub.com/luke/14-26.htm https://biblehub.com/luke/14-26.htm This is hyperbole, which Jesus uses relatively often. It is also more subtle in the original Greek: while we often use the word "hate", the original has more of a connotation of (IIRC) separate-yourself-from. See also: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:29 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:29 * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:30 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_5:30 It is not that one's parents, spouse, siblings are bad in themselves, but that one has to be mindful that the source of being tempted to not act morally and doing the right thing can come from anywhere—even people that we would otherwise cherish.

Pokepokalypse 6y ago

That's very common. And so intellectually insulting, that it's probably responsible for a non-trivial slice of that 50% drop in church attendance.