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This is positioned to be competing product to netlify and vercel. However, it doesn't make sense to host it yourself as core benefit of host a static pages and

This is positioned to be competing product to netlify and vercel. However, it doesn't make sense to host it yourself as core benefit of host a static pages and node js apps on netlify is use their CDN infrastructure. It would actually cost you more to host self host it than using alternatives. Also this is definitely not a PaaS substitute. It is great attempt at a netlify alternative, but fall very short from being a production grade platform. Just an analysis, don't burn me please.

tyingq 6y ago
Couldn't you pair it with, say, Cloudflare? Perhaps something like that is coming functionality within the product, but it's easy enough to do yourself for now.
- debarshri 6y ago
  Why not AWS for that matter. There is difference between IaaS and PaaS. This is more in the realm of PaaS. You cannot compare with infrastructure providers per say, in my opinion.
  - tyingq 6y ago
    I mentioned Cloudflare because the end-to-end setup to CDN front whatever you create in "Coolify" is fairly simple and likely once per site.
andrasbacsai 6y ago
Atm, it's not aiming to be a production-grade system. Indie hackers, hobbyists, probably do not need that to start working on their side project. Also, I'm thinking of provide a hosted version of it, but not know. I want to concentrate on the features now.
- debarshri 6y ago
  Ok, cool. Then it is a great hobby project to have!
- jrochkind1 6y ago
  When I saw it described as a "heroku and netlify alternatives", I assumed it was meant to be a production-grade system, that's what those words mean to me. If those are wrong expectations, you might consider changing your marketing.
  - lgregg 6y ago
    I think it’s more of a you than them problem. I didn’t take this as a production-grade.
    - jrochkind1 6y ago
      If lots of people are having expectations that you didn't meant to give them and don't want to meet, that could get inconvenient for everyone including you, regardless of whether you want to blame it on a "them problem". So it might make sense to adjust the marketing to better set expectations. But that's your call, you can also just deal with it knowing that it's their fault for misunderstanding you.
      - Dayshine 6y ago
        The landing page has no pricing, no support model, says "made for indie hackers", had no company name and credits the page to a single person. How much more obvious can it be?
  - flyingpant 6y ago
    When I saw that, I just think of it as it provides similar functionalities as the heroku and netlify.
  - debarshri 6y ago
    I don't know what up with people these days. There seems to be a trend people are building heroku clones. Heroku is more than buildpack and dynos. Just because you have a github integration does not mean you do not have the right to call yourself a heroku alternative. Whole point of heroku is getting started without any setup. Now, If I have to acquire a VM, setup the infrastructure and then setup one these "alternatives", the onus is on me. I am responsible for 80% of the task heroku does. At that point, I would rather own it 100%. There is lot of stuff that goes on behind the scene goes into Heroku or Netlify. Managed Kubernetes with a PaaS experience comes very close of heroku alternative however, why would you switch to something like that when you are content with Heroku. Kubernetes setup will become a beast in itself. I think heroku's alternative business plan should be suing all the companies/people calling themselves publicly calling themselves heroku alternative or a better heroku and delivering subpar projects.
kderbyma 6y ago
this is exactly what I want. I myself prefer to host my own servers and having this is exact the missing piece I've been missing.
tyingq 6y ago
Worth noting that Netlify's CDN recently had issues. I do think Netlify is nice, but "production grade" sounds like something that might require two providers. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26581027 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26581027 for recent discussion. Also see: https://answers.netlify.com/t/support-guide-minimizing-impact-of-load-balancer-not-working/34888 https://answers.netlify.com/t/support-guide-minimizing-impac... ("To make sure you can minimize the impact of our single-homed loadbalancer being down")
- sofixa 6y ago
  Netlify are on multiple providers, but due to the DNS spec being old ( no CNAMEs at root) many providers respecting it without providing CNAME flattening, in some cases you have to give use a regular old IP as an A record, hence the impact of the GCP load balancer being down. If one was using CNAME flattening, there was zero impact.
- debarshri 6y ago
  Why not 3? It is about how paranoid you want to be about uptime. Uptime and production grade are two different things. There is certain uptime guarantees that a cloud provider will give. Production grade is durability of the product itself.
  - lxpz 6y ago
    Algorithms that tolerate Byzantine failures generally require t<n/3, i.e. at least 4 nodes to tolerate 1 byzantine fault. This is in fact required for primitives as simple as reliable broadcast. Systems that use leader election such as Raft are not Byzantine tolerant. They tolerate t<n/2, meaning that 3 nodes does indeed buy tolerance to 1 crash, but it doesn't support anything else than crashes.
hanniabu 6y ago
Since we're on the topic and I'm about to launch a static site, any thoughts on CDN performance between Github, Netlify, and Firebase?
- Trufa 6y ago
  For frontend deployment nothing has come close to Netlify in my experience. It's a game changer product.
  - daemon001 6y ago
    +1
  - mxschmitt 6y ago
    I personally use Vercel mostly. Didn't do much with Netfliy yet, both options should be fine.
  - dbrereton 6y ago
    I was using Netlify but now prefer Render.
    - anurag 6y ago
      Good to know! What made you switch?
- janee 6y ago
  We had to move off Netlify because of CDN performance for users in Africa. Pretty niche requirement I know, but the TTFB was insane as it was serving traffic from Brazil at that time. This was around June 2020, if I recall so maybe things have changed. Moved to Cloudflare for our CDN
- tnolet 6y ago
  Have a look at this. It lists the performance of many Jamstack / static site providers https://www.jamstackdeploy.com/ https://www.jamstackdeploy.com/
f430 6y ago
What does it take to host this on Cloudfront or Cloudflare? Are they not the same thing as Vercel? What is the difference if I hosted a website on those two former providers vs Vercel?
jamescontrol 6y ago
To be fair, it’s quite often more expensive to self-host software than to use the sass/pass equivalent.
- debarshri 6y ago
  Not true. For hobby projects, using netlify and heroku is often cheaper, agreed. But for serious organization it might be cheaper. Heroku's standard 2x dynos pricing is $50 per month [1]i.e 1GB mem, whereas a droplet in digitalocean is $5 per month for the same resources[2] with 1000GB storage. Lets add loadbalancer to the mix additional $10 per month, domain and SSL certs are negligible prices, max would be $20 per month. It comes at the price of engineering time. [1] https://www.heroku.com/pricing https://www.heroku.com/pricing [2] https://www.digitalocean.com/pricing https://www.digitalocean.com/pricing

tyingq 6y ago

Couldn't you pair it with, say, Cloudflare? Perhaps something like that is coming functionality within the product, but it's easy enough to do yourself for now.

debarshri 6y ago
Why not AWS for that matter. There is difference between IaaS and PaaS. This is more in the realm of PaaS. You cannot compare with infrastructure providers per say, in my opinion.
- tyingq 6y ago
  I mentioned Cloudflare because the end-to-end setup to CDN front whatever you create in "Coolify" is fairly simple and likely once per site.

andrasbacsai 6y ago

Atm, it's not aiming to be a production-grade system. Indie hackers, hobbyists, probably do not need that to start working on their side project. Also, I'm thinking of provide a hosted version of it, but not know. I want to concentrate on the features now.

debarshri 6y ago
Ok, cool. Then it is a great hobby project to have!
jrochkind1 6y ago
When I saw it described as a "heroku and netlify alternatives", I assumed it was meant to be a production-grade system, that's what those words mean to me. If those are wrong expectations, you might consider changing your marketing.
- lgregg 6y ago
  I think it’s more of a you than them problem. I didn’t take this as a production-grade.
  - jrochkind1 6y ago
    If lots of people are having expectations that you didn't meant to give them and don't want to meet, that could get inconvenient for everyone including you, regardless of whether you want to blame it on a "them problem". So it might make sense to adjust the marketing to better set expectations. But that's your call, you can also just deal with it knowing that it's their fault for misunderstanding you.
    - Dayshine 6y ago
      The landing page has no pricing, no support model, says "made for indie hackers", had no company name and credits the page to a single person. How much more obvious can it be?
- flyingpant 6y ago
  When I saw that, I just think of it as it provides similar functionalities as the heroku and netlify.
- debarshri 6y ago
  I don't know what up with people these days. There seems to be a trend people are building heroku clones. Heroku is more than buildpack and dynos. Just because you have a github integration does not mean you do not have the right to call yourself a heroku alternative. Whole point of heroku is getting started without any setup. Now, If I have to acquire a VM, setup the infrastructure and then setup one these "alternatives", the onus is on me. I am responsible for 80% of the task heroku does. At that point, I would rather own it 100%. There is lot of stuff that goes on behind the scene goes into Heroku or Netlify. Managed Kubernetes with a PaaS experience comes very close of heroku alternative however, why would you switch to something like that when you are content with Heroku. Kubernetes setup will become a beast in itself. I think heroku's alternative business plan should be suing all the companies/people calling themselves publicly calling themselves heroku alternative or a better heroku and delivering subpar projects.

kderbyma 6y ago

this is exactly what I want. I myself prefer to host my own servers and having this is exact the missing piece I've been missing.

tyingq 6y ago

Worth noting that Netlify's CDN recently had issues. I do think Netlify is nice, but "production grade" sounds like something that might require two providers. See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26581027 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26581027 for recent discussion. Also see: https://answers.netlify.com/t/support-guide-minimizing-impact-of-load-balancer-not-working/34888 https://answers.netlify.com/t/support-guide-minimizing-impac... ("To make sure you can minimize the impact of our single-homed loadbalancer being down")

sofixa 6y ago
Netlify are on multiple providers, but due to the DNS spec being old ( no CNAMEs at root) many providers respecting it without providing CNAME flattening, in some cases you have to give use a regular old IP as an A record, hence the impact of the GCP load balancer being down. If one was using CNAME flattening, there was zero impact.
debarshri 6y ago
Why not 3? It is about how paranoid you want to be about uptime. Uptime and production grade are two different things. There is certain uptime guarantees that a cloud provider will give. Production grade is durability of the product itself.
- lxpz 6y ago
  Algorithms that tolerate Byzantine failures generally require t<n/3, i.e. at least 4 nodes to tolerate 1 byzantine fault. This is in fact required for primitives as simple as reliable broadcast. Systems that use leader election such as Raft are not Byzantine tolerant. They tolerate t<n/2, meaning that 3 nodes does indeed buy tolerance to 1 crash, but it doesn't support anything else than crashes.

hanniabu 6y ago

Since we're on the topic and I'm about to launch a static site, any thoughts on CDN performance between Github, Netlify, and Firebase?

Trufa 6y ago
For frontend deployment nothing has come close to Netlify in my experience. It's a game changer product.
- daemon001 6y ago
  +1
- mxschmitt 6y ago
  I personally use Vercel mostly. Didn't do much with Netfliy yet, both options should be fine.
- dbrereton 6y ago
  I was using Netlify but now prefer Render.
  - anurag 6y ago
    Good to know! What made you switch?
janee 6y ago
We had to move off Netlify because of CDN performance for users in Africa. Pretty niche requirement I know, but the TTFB was insane as it was serving traffic from Brazil at that time. This was around June 2020, if I recall so maybe things have changed. Moved to Cloudflare for our CDN
tnolet 6y ago
Have a look at this. It lists the performance of many Jamstack / static site providers https://www.jamstackdeploy.com/ https://www.jamstackdeploy.com/

f430 6y ago

What does it take to host this on Cloudfront or Cloudflare? Are they not the same thing as Vercel? What is the difference if I hosted a website on those two former providers vs Vercel?

jamescontrol 6y ago

To be fair, it’s quite often more expensive to self-host software than to use the sass/pass equivalent.

debarshri 6y ago
Not true. For hobby projects, using netlify and heroku is often cheaper, agreed. But for serious organization it might be cheaper. Heroku's standard 2x dynos pricing is $50 per month [1]i.e 1GB mem, whereas a droplet in digitalocean is $5 per month for the same resources[2] with 1000GB storage. Lets add loadbalancer to the mix additional $10 per month, domain and SSL certs are negligible prices, max would be $20 per month. It comes at the price of engineering time. [1] https://www.heroku.com/pricing https://www.heroku.com/pricing [2] https://www.digitalocean.com/pricing https://www.digitalocean.com/pricing