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A forgotten medieval fruit with a vulgar name
- nkurz 6y agoWow, what a great article! And it links to one of my favorite botany papers every written: "The Medlar (Mespilus germanica, Rosaceae) from Antiquity to Obscurity" by John R. Baird and John W. Thieret, Economic Botany Vol. 43, No. 3 (Jul. - Sep., 1989), pp. 328-372 (45 pages) https://www.jstor.org/stable/4255177 https://www.jstor.org/stable/4255177 https://sci-hub.do/https://www.jstor.org/stable/4255177 https://sci-hub.do/https://www.jstor.org/stable/4255177 I read this by chance when it came out, and for a long while couldn't figure out whether it was a parody or a real scientific article. The whole story seemed so vastly improbable: a vulgar fruit central to Shakespeare that we've mostly forgotten about today, unable to be eaten until it's been rotted in sawdust for a few months --- pull the other one! Anyway, if the BBC article whets your interest in the medlar, you should definitely check out the full article. It's a gem.
- dan-robertson 6y agoTo be clear the ‘bletting’ process isn’t really rotting. There isn’t bacterial or fungal decomposition. Instead it is enzymes within the fruit which slowly react with and transform it. This isn’t wholly dissimilar from normal fruit ripening which can happen after the fruit has been picked.
- Angostura 6y agoMy favourite line from the article: "The process is known as "bletting", a word made-up by a botanist who noticed there wasn't one in 1839."
- fy20 6y agoHow is this different from ripening? Many commercial fruits are picked unripe, then during transportation (it takes bananas up to two weeks to travel from South America to Europe) they ripen off ready for sale.
- detaro 6y agoMaybe I'm getting it wrong, but it sounds like this doesn't happen on the plant if you just let it be, whereas ripening does? (we just pick stuff unripe to gain transportation time)
- scottlamb 6y agoThere are at least a few classes of fruit in terms of ripening. * Non-climacteric fruits will only ripen on the plant. Strawberries are like this. They can turn more red after picking, but it's deceptive. They don't actually get sweeter. * Most climacteric fruits will ripen either on or off the plant. I think bananas and apples are like this. * Some climacteric fruits will only ripen after picking. Avocados are like this for sure. You have to wait until it's large enough to pick it (or it will never ripen) and wait a week or two after picking to eat it. Leaving it on the fruit for an extra week or two is no substitute for waiting after picking. There are probably other such fruits.
- SamBam 6y agoPears, too, only ripen properly several days off the tree. Took me too many years to discover this with my pear tree in the back yard.
- 3np 6y agoMaybe depends on the variety? Used to eat pears straight from the tree as a kid and they were sweet enough.
- SamBam 6y agoI believe it's most/all varieties. See e.g. https://usapears.org/pear-ripening-and-handling https://usapears.org/pear-ripening-and-handling However, I think many people are used to the taste of unripe pear - it's sweet enough, and quite crisp, and some people prefer them that way. As it sits on the counter, though, it becomes softer and sweeter over time.
- michaelcampbell 6y ago> a word made-up by a botanist who noticed there wasn't one Aren't ALL words made up?
- andrewflnr 6y agoProbably not. Certainly the vast majority were not deliberately made up within recorded history.
- ksherlock 6y agoOr dry aging beef.
- whyenot 6y agoYes, it’s not rotting, just ripening, the same as the process (astringent) persimmons. Describing it as “rotten” is being a little overly dramatic.
- pvaldes 6y agoI think that bletting involves frost and defrost also. I could be wrong. The trick does not work so well in Persimmon.
- nkurz 6y agoAmerican Persimmons (Diospyros virginiana) actually respond well to a few freeze-thaw cycles. Despite myth, they don't require it for ripening, but they aren't hurt by it they way that Japanese kaki are.
- mano78 6y agoThese are... nespole. I have a tree in my garden and we, in Italy, commonly eat them. A bit disappointed after the intriguing opening of the article. https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mespilus_germanica https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mespilus_germanica
- ithkuil 6y agoI also have a "nespolo" tree. But honestly I don't know if it's a european or a japonica variant
- greenyoda 6y agoEnglish version: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mespilus_germanica https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mespilus_germanica
- sdoering 6y agoI also have one in my garden. In German it is called "Mispel". I wouldn't call it forgotten although I have to attest that probably only history or plant nerds know of it. As we grow a lot of historic varieties of vegetables a "Mispel" was not so unusual for us.
- usrusr 6y agoAnd living in a region where traditionally all hard liquor is from trees, the Mispel one happens to be my unquestioned favorite, after a good meal at the pub. I'd describe the tiny fruit aroma hint that is usual with fruit liquor as a touch of marzipan that works much better than I'd expect upon hearing this description (I'd definitely not be eager to try something advertised as marzipan liquor). Perhaps it's no coincidence that the article doesn't mention Germany at all, it might ruin the "forgotten" hook. (no you can't walk into a German supermarket and walk out with a bag full of Mispels, it's not that un-forgotten)
- thefourthchime 6y agoFascinating read! I really wanted to try this until I got to this part. A humorous research paper from 1989 gathered together some classic put-downs, including "At best, it is only one degree better than a rotten apple" – from a 19th Century gardening book – and "the medlar is not… worth a turd until it's ripe, and then it tastes like shit" – reportedly the opinion of an anonymous medieval author.
- barathr 6y agoThe same process takes place with astringent persimmons. Persimmons are even weirder because they have four types: pollination constant non-astringent (PCNA), pollination variant non-astringent (PVNA), pollination constant astringent (PCA), pollination variant astringent (PVA). That means that some (very tasty) types of persimmon can be astringent or sweet when hard depending on whether they were pollinated, which is nearly impossible to tell just by looking at the fruit. The most well known categories of persimmons, at least in the US -- Fuyu types (PCNA) and Hachiya (PCA) -- are not pollination variant.
- richk449 6y agoThat explains a lot. I only buy fuyu persimmons now, because when I have tried the other kinds, they have been inedible - very astringent. Do people do anything with the astringent types? Do they get better if I wait?
- barathr 6y agoYou have to wait until they are extremely soft -- then they'll be very very sweet (and juicy). I tend to only buy and grow non-astringent persimmons because it's a hassle. People also dry them -- there's a whole process for this (one link among many): https://www.umami-insider.com/hoshigaki-japanese-dried-persimmon/ https://www.umami-insider.com/hoshigaki-japanese-dried-persi...
- ardit33 6y agoLooks like Albanian muç-molla They are very tasty, and can be eaten like a mini apple or pear. They taste like a combination between a pear and an apple. I used to have one in my home/garden. ...it is the baby of the rose family. This little tree produces small fruits in brown to rust color. These fruits are similar to those of the wild rose, but larger in size. https://www.classlifestyle.com/news/39341/mucmolla-shqiptare-ka-efekte-shendetesore-te-medha-qe-ne-nuk-i-dinim/eng/ https://www.classlifestyle.com/news/39341/mucmolla-shqiptare...
- nkurz 6y agoYour link isn't working for me, but this video confirms that muç-molla is indeed the same fruit as medlar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpgCdAXb-Xo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpgCdAXb-Xo
- adrian_b 6y agoThat is the Turkish name of the medlar. This name is used in many Balkanic countries.
- mda 6y agoIn Turkish, "Musmula suratli" = "Medlar faced" is a common and funny expression to describe someone with an ugly / grumpy /sour face.
- Ericson2314 6y agoFrom the original article > It's still widely grown in Iran, Azerbaijan, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia and Turkey, where it's sold in markets as musmula. Yup, that's the same word. Thanks, Ottomans.
- hcho 6y agoThe word is actually of Greek origin. Who spread it is difficult to tell.
- notorandit 6y agoWe have a similar fruit in southern Italy. It's from the sorbus genus. It used to be consumed (almost) rotten during the months of December and January.
- Turing_Machine 6y agoSorbus trees are usually called "rowan" or "mountain ash" in English. And yep, they also need bletting to be at their best. Mountain ash is a popular landscaping tree here. Birds (particularly waxwings) flock to them in winter when there's little else to eat (and presumably when the fruit has become less bitter, thanks to bletting).
- DonaldFisk 6y agoAnother Sorbus species is the Wild Service Tree, or Sorbus torminalis. The trees grow in England. The fruit is the chequerberry, which also needs bletting before it's edible. The flavour's similar to tamarind.
- pvaldes 6y agoYep, I think that Rowan Atkinson has a very cool first name.
- nkurz 6y agoCould you tell me more about this? What's in called in the local language? Is it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbus_torminalis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorbus_torminalis as someone mentioned below?
- abarachant 6y agoGrowing up in south of france, we had a few of theses tree ("Néflier") scattered around the village. I really loved the fruits as a kid, it was a true delicacy. We had to wait until the first freeze in december, and pick them off the ground after bletting. they are really sweet, with a touch of alcool, and one of the few fruit you can find in the wild during the winter. Now the title is a little bit misleading, they fell out of favor, and not widely available commercially, but definetly not forgotten.
- 11235813213455 6y agoI live in the South-east, and Néfles/Medlars start appearing now actually, tend to be ready in May, when they start turning from yellow to orange. In the summer they're all gone, maybe we're speaking about different species, I think here those Néfliers are 'Japan Medlars', so are not in the same cycle Persimmons are ready between October and December. Agrums (like mandarines, clementines) from January to March.Figs in summer Basically you can have something to pick all year long, if people can stop replacing trees by concrete Edit: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26612839 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26612839 said it all, what I'm talking about are loquats, not medlars, we still call them "néfliers" though
- puzzlingcaptcha 6y agoDo the fruits taste similar?
- nkurz 6y agoNot really. At least, if you hadn't been told in advance that the loquat was also called the "Japanese medlar", you probably wouldn't think they had anything more in common than a pear and a plum, or an apple and an apricot. Loquats have a mild citrus-apricot flavor and a texture close to a somewhat meaty plum or cherry. When immature, they are very tart; when overripe, they are insipid; when just right, they can be great. Medlar are only eaten when "bletted", which means that they've become browned and spoonably soft. They taste of overripe spiced stewed apple/pear/quince, although no spice has been added. When just right, they are "interesting".
- PLenz 6y agoThe equivlent in North America (in terms of being a once popular, now nearly forgotten fruit) is the Pawpaw: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asimina_triloba https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asimina_triloba
- fennecfoxen 6y agoHmm. Some of us have heard of it via the original Disney animated Jungle Book, where it cameos in the song "Bear Necessities" (or is that "Bare Necessities?" Dual meaning and all that, forget which one is the canonical title.) Anyway, Phil Harris sings: "Now when you pick a pawpaw / or a prickly pear / and if you prick a raw paw / well then next time, beware! Don't pick a prickly pear by the paw / when you pick a pear, try to use the claw. But you don't need to use the paw / when you pick a pear from a big pawpaw. Have I given you a clue?" This may have placed me under the erroneous impression it was a tropical fruit.
- atdrummond 6y agoThere are (at least) three fruit known as the pawpaw: 1. Asimina (North American pawpaw) 2. Vasconcellea pubescens (Mountain pawpaw, South America) 3. Carica papaya (Papaya, Africa and Asia)
- goodcanadian 6y agoIndeed. When I see "paw-paw," the first thing I think of is papaya which is indeed a tropical fruit.
- ComputerGuru 6y agoBut I think the song makes it clear that’s not the pawpaw in question, right?
- selimthegrim 6y agoI believe papaya is "rude" itself for other reasons (Spanish slang connotations)
- bitdizzy 6y agoI got a batch of medlars from a farm this last winter! We ate the first few too soon but the rest were amazing, and very late into the winter when we dont really have fruit besides apples. I'd love for these to become mainstream again.
- zeteo 6y agoA few months ago I had a jar of medlar jelly shipped over from the UK via Amazon. It was not cheap but very tasty; the flavor reminded me a bit of quince jelly, another pretty rare item in the US. I'd like to have it again sometime, maybe for a special occasion. The rest of my medieval foods bucket list includes purslane and sorrel. It looks like I'll have to grow both of them from seeds as I have no hope of buying them from a store anytime soon.
- Turing_Machine 6y agoPurslane, at least, is extremely easy to grow. It can actually become a weed in some circumstances. Quite tasty. I haven't grown it for a few years, but it's on my seed list now. Thanks for the reminder!
- bserge 6y agoOh, you reminded me of quince jam. That used to be my favorite. I haven't seen any for over a decade, quince trees used to be common in my home country, but they fell out of favour for some reason and very few people grow them anymore. Quince jam and quince juice were great.
- haroldp 6y agoQuince are naturally very high in pectin, so they were often grown to be added to other fruit as a thickener in jams. These days people just buy commercially produced pectin, or more likely, don't make jam at all.
- selimthegrim 6y agoI've seen it at upscale grocery stores, usually next to the fancy cheese section.
- twic 6y agoI haven't had sorrel in ages, but it's amazing. Intensely sharp, lemony flavour. A classic thing to do is to stuff it inside a mackerel and grill it.
- deleted 6y ago[deleted]
- twic 6y agoI knew it would be the medlar before i clicked! Perhaps i spend too much time reading about rude fruit. Anyway, it's a great little fruit, makes superb jelly and cheese (ie jelly with pulp, like a very thick jam). Somewhere between plum and date in flavour, perhaps. I have a jar of my father's medlar cheese in the fridge, might go and pop a bit on some cheese ...
- pierrec 6y agoAll these quotes form Jane Steward and they never link to her website. It's nice, makes the fruit look a bit more appetizing: https://eastgatelarder.co.uk/ https://eastgatelarder.co.uk/
- PuddleOfSausage 6y ago> one 18th Century doctor and botanist said that they cause diarrhoea I thought this would have been a prime contributor to its vulgar name!
- Agentlien 6y agoMy wife grew up in Belgium and has often mentioned medlar as a wonderful and absurd delicacy. I never had it and she seemed to find it strange that I didn't know of it. A few days ago she excitedly sent me this article. Yesterday we found out her parents have just planted medlar in their garden.
- modeless 6y agoWeird Fruit Explorer just did an episode on these if you want to see what they're like: https://youtu.be/IKZsMNfRiRE https://youtu.be/IKZsMNfRiRE The whole channel is fascinating. Probably my favorite niche YouTube channel. I had no idea just how many edible fruits are out there and how strange many of them are. Makes me want to quit my job and travel around the world finding thousands of weird fruits to eat.
- dukeofdoom 6y agoI was actually surprised by Dragon Fruit, recently. Not sure if you had it before. But the plant, is a cactus like vine. I went into a park in Hawaii. And saw it strangling a huge tree. No idea that it could grow like that.
- rahimiali 6y agoThe article says the medlar is "musmula" in Persian. Maybe, but if you're Iranian, you'll more likely know it as "marmala". Reading this, this sounds oddly like "marmalade", which according to Wikipedia, comes from the Portuguese. But unlike the English version of marmalade, which is made from citrus, the original Portuguese is made from quince, an Asian fruit. My guess is this was actually initially made from marmala, and quince as only a variant. What a wonderful etymological chase through the name of a fruit.
- riffraff 6y agothe italian word is "nespola" and the latin is "mespilus", so probably there's some shared indo-european root with "musmula".
- yellowapple 6y agoThat both fruits are in the Malinae subtribe and both typically need bletted before they're edible lends credence to this hypothesis.
- sokols 6y agoIn Kosovo we call them “mushmulla”, they are quite common. As a kid used to eat a lot and I preferred them in their “unrotten” form since they were freely growing in the hills surrounding my town.
- gzimhelshani 6y agoOh man, i was wondering what this mysterious fruit was until I saw its mushmulla they are talking about. It's pretty common here in Kosovo and it can be found accross supermarkets.
- smnrchrds 6y ago> if you're Iranian, you'll more likely know it as "marmala" Are you sure? It looks like azgil (ازگیل).
- rahimiali 6y ago
- darkhorn 6y agoI know them as muşmula. I didn't know that they were forgotten. I'm sad that they are not being sold in cities.
- Giorgi 6y agomusmala is completly different plant and fruit.
- mda 6y agoMusmula is this fruit. Mentioned in the article as well.
- darkhorn 6y agoFrom the article: "It's still widely grown in Iran, Azerbaijan, Kyrgyzstan, Georgia and Turkey, where it's sold in markets as musmula".
- Giorgi 6y agoI know. I am from Eastern Europe, Musmula is Loquat, article has it wrong. I know what is sold in markets personally.
- darkhorn 6y agohttps://tr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mu%C5%9Fmula https://tr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mu%C5%9Fmula https://tr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malta_eri%C4%9Fi https://tr.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malta_eri%C4%9Fi
- Giorgi 6y agoI see, it is called musmula in Turkish, and japanese musmula in other places https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanska_mu%C5%A1mula https://sh.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanska_mu%C5%A1mula
- raarts 6y agoIn Dutch there's an expression 'zo rot als een mispel' (as rotten as a medlar). These days this means 'rotten to the core', so I was surprised to learn it originated from a fruit that supposedly tastes wonderful in this state. Although from the Dutch Wikipedia I gather it's more fermenting than rotting that's involved.
- kefabean 6y agoFunnily enough I stumbled upon such a tree while out for a walk in Surrey (UK) last November. Amazed to see a tree laden with fruit in winter, I loaded my rucksack thinking they were some kind of strange quince or something. It was only after a bit of internet research I discovered they were this weird medieval fruit called a Medlar. Out of curiosity I duly ‘bletted’ them and 4 or so weeks later turned them in to medlar-crumble slice. Would certainly agree they taste “like over-ripe dates mingled with lemons”. A lot of faff, but very delicious!
- ycombinete 6y agoOne of my favourite DH Lawrence poems is about these [0]! I’ve always wanted to taste one since I first read it. Perhaps as someone who has tasted them you’ll appreciate it. I love you, rotten, Delicious rottenness. I love to suck you out from your skins So brown and soft and coming suave, So morbid, as the Italians say. The rest of it is in the link. [0] https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/148468/medlars-and-sorb-apples https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/148468/medlars-and-so...
- slim 6y ago"morbido" in italian means soft. which is strange, now that I think about it
- ycombinete 6y agoI had a look, in English and Italian they both come from the Latin for “diseased”
- matthewfelgate 6y agoI live in Surrey, UK too. Where was it you saw the tree? I would like to go see one! I'm thinking of buying some Medlar jam too because I'm curious about it now.
- everyone 6y agoTheres a medlar tree growing in Waterford city (near the Bishops palace) I know an old guy who picks the fruit from it and makes jam. Out of curiosity we picked a couple once, left them for a long time and tried them. They were ok.
- londons_explore 6y agoPears are similar. Straight off the tree they are hard and barely edible. Pick them from the tree and wait a week and they become soft and juicy.
- mprovost 6y agoThere are a couple of these trees in my local park in London. I collect windfall fruit in the autumn. Nobody else seems to notice all the free fruit! I put them in a box in a closet for a month or so and then make jelly. It goes a really deep red colour and has a nice, unique flavour.
- Giorgi 6y agoI don't know, we have it everywhere in Eastern Europe. Maybe US did forget it.
- Symbiote 6y agoI think it's more likely that one BBC journalist and their friends hadn't heard of it, because they don't sell it in Waitrose. They can make a whole series of articles, as they "discover" damsons, greengage, quince, mulberries, gooseberries, etc. (Between my parents, grandparents, and places like the car park at the back of my mum's office, we picked all of these in England.) There are plenty of results on British websites for medlar trees (for gardeners) and recipes for the fruit.
- pjsg 6y agoMedlar trees are not that hard to come by in the US -- I have a couple in my orchard -- one is really prolific and we make a fair amount of medlar jelly each year. I hadn't realized that medlars were not that well known!
- gumby 6y agoMedlar are also gown in the US; I have a friend growing it in Vermont, for instance. It's OK.
- thitcanh 6y agoReminds me of a fruit I know as Chico Zapote: Inedible when unripe (feels like green bananas and not sweet), then edible for a day, then too sugary for its enjoyment a day later. When ripe/rotten is good in small quantities, but it feels so much like eating sugar that I can’t handle more than half of it.
- ppezaris 6y agoWe have a couple of black sapote trees in our yard; sounds similar.
- thitcanh 6y agoAhh I love black sapote too. Indeed you eat it when it feels rotten, except black sapote isn’t particularly sweet, at least the very few ones I tried in Oaxaca. Did you know… black sapotes are of the same family of persimmons? If you focus, you’ll notice that they taste very similar.
- pvaldes 6y ago> of the same family Is an american cousin, Persimmons are Diospyros kaki and Black sapotes are Diospyros nigra, so technically is a black persimmon. In US there are other obscure native persimmons also like Diospyros texana
- nmstoker 6y agoI was surprised to see that Google Photos is pretty good at searching for medlar photos I've taken. I knew I'd seen one recently(ish) but couldn't think how I'd figure out where. So I did a search and it found two sets of photos: 1. the recent ones (presumably recognised directly from the fruit which are in close up, as there's no other indication of what they are) and 2. an earlier set I had forgotten about from six years ago in South Africa - it's hard to tell with that whether it recognised the whole tree (the fruit themselves are not that obvious) or it has read the tiny hand written label on the ground which says "medlar" (sideways for bonus points!)
- pvaldes 6y agoLet me guess by the title, Mespilus germanica?
- cmrdporcupine 6y agoOdd to call it forgotten; I've known about it for sometime, and it isn't just the fruit-nerd circles I run in. There was even an older tree growing in the yard of an immigrant Greek family in my old neighbourhood in Toronto, they made preserves from them. There's all sorts of neat things in the same tribe as apples ("Maleae"); one of my favourites is the Amelanchier genus... Known as Saskatoons, Juneberries, Service berries, Shadbush, depending on where you are and which species you're looking at (though they're all very similar in flavour.) Make the best pie. EDIT: this breakdown process described for medlars is also similar to some varieties of pears, which aren't really ripe "off the tree" but require chilling hours and then re-warming in order for the sugars to transform into something more edible.
- julianz 6y agoI always enjoyed that bit of Romeo and Juliet in high school... If love be blind, love cannot hit the mark. Now will he sit under a medlar tree And wish his mistress were that kind of fruit As maids call medlars when they laugh alone.— O Romeo, that she were! Oh, that she were An open arse, and thou a poperin pear.
- SamBam 6y agoIt's good to remember that some of Shakespeare is just a more poetic version of texting a peach emoji and eggplant emoji.
- reactspa 6y agoIn this pic, it looks very similar to India's "Cheeku" (remove the crown and it's an exact match): https://ychef.files.bbci.co.uk/1600x900/p09bty8x.webp https://ychef.files.bbci.co.uk/1600x900/p09bty8x.webp
- zem 6y agoi was thinking that too, especially when the flesh was described as sweet and grainy
- fractallyte 6y agoIf you're in the UK/south-east, you can see a mature medlar tree in a corner of the tudor garden at Cressing Temple barns. Note that this is a working garden, so be careful about picking fruits! There was once a beautiful medlar at the end of the driveway to a very popular farm shop in Brentwood. I used to ask permission to gather fruits, because no one in the shop knew what it was. One year I came there, and the tree was gone - cut down. Really sad. Medlars make amazing jam!
- matt_morgan 6y agoThey have medlars at the Cloisters in NYC--at least, a few years ago ... https://blog.metmuseum.org/cloistersgardens/2008/11/14/rotten-ripe-the-medlar-goes-soft/ https://blog.metmuseum.org/cloistersgardens/2008/11/14/rotte...
- brzihr 6y agoI have 3 of these in my backyard in Croatia, but we call them "Mušmula". Never realised they went out of fashion elsewhere.
- xyzzy21 6y agoWell, like the old SNL skit: "With a name like that, you KNOW it must be good."