3 ms·

I think good starting points are https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/52587.html https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/52587.html and http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2019/10/15/fsf-rm

by geofft 6y ago

I think good starting points are https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/52587.html https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/52587.html and http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2019/10/15/fsf-rms.html http://ebb.org/bkuhn/blog/2019/10/15/fsf-rms.html (note, particularly, the several links in the sentence starting "In fact," - each word is its own link). Both of those posts are from former FSF board members who have basically spent their entire professional careers working to advance free software.

tsaloop 6y ago
I think people who actually wrote free software have advanced it. Why do Foundations have so much imaginary power?
- geofft 6y ago
  Largely because RMS gave them that power? Like I'm not sure what your argument is. Are you saying one should not take board members of the FSF seriously, and one should ignore people whose contribution to the free software movement is more political than technical? Then you've already made the argument against RMS having a role on the GCC steering committee.
  - tsaloop 6y ago
    The only real power is in the "or any later version" part of the GPL, which IMO is a mistake. I'd delete it like Linus when using the GPL. Yes, I think foundation members' influence is overrated. The Kuhn story looks like any plain vanilla internal power struggle. Why hasn't he spoken up 10 years ago? It is hypocritical to do so when everyone else is piling on. The same applies to old guard RedHat and SuSE people. They have known RMS for decades and suddenly he needs to be removed. Foundations in OSS in general attract the wrong kind of people. RMS, for all his flaws, did pretty well overall compared to others.
- CJefferson 6y ago
  The mailing list post this thread is about is that the people who, for the last 20 years are actually writing free software want rid of RMS, because he hasn't done anything useful, and has done a lot of harm, in those 20 years. RMS did indeed start a lot of great projects, but that doesn't give him the right to continue to rule over them now, after thousands of other people have contributed more lines of codes than him in the last 20 years.

by geofft 6y ago

tsaloop 6y ago

I think people who actually wrote free software have advanced it. Why do Foundations have so much imaginary power?

geofft 6y ago
Largely because RMS gave them that power? Like I'm not sure what your argument is. Are you saying one should not take board members of the FSF seriously, and one should ignore people whose contribution to the free software movement is more political than technical? Then you've already made the argument against RMS having a role on the GCC steering committee.
- tsaloop 6y ago
  The only real power is in the "or any later version" part of the GPL, which IMO is a mistake. I'd delete it like Linus when using the GPL. Yes, I think foundation members' influence is overrated. The Kuhn story looks like any plain vanilla internal power struggle. Why hasn't he spoken up 10 years ago? It is hypocritical to do so when everyone else is piling on. The same applies to old guard RedHat and SuSE people. They have known RMS for decades and suddenly he needs to be removed. Foundations in OSS in general attract the wrong kind of people. RMS, for all his flaws, did pretty well overall compared to others.
CJefferson 6y ago
The mailing list post this thread is about is that the people who, for the last 20 years are actually writing free software want rid of RMS, because he hasn't done anything useful, and has done a lot of harm, in those 20 years. RMS did indeed start a lot of great projects, but that doesn't give him the right to continue to rule over them now, after thousands of other people have contributed more lines of codes than him in the last 20 years.