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> you assume that I support all the exaggerated points above (none of them mine) Because you have never admitted censorship of Winnie the Pooh happened on Chin

> you assume that I support all the exaggerated points above (none of them mine) Because you have never admitted censorship of Winnie the Pooh happened on Chinese social media. You kept questioning many of the evidence I provided (“if one can only read english sources it might be a little biased IMHO”, “I can not verify your claim since I don't play Kingdom Hearts”), or dismissing evidence as “trivia”. I don’t know if you agree that censorship of Winnie the Pooh actually happened. So I had to keep Googling for alternative sources for you. You need to point out whether you agree with the key points in the above articles, or provide solid counter evidence (with sources). Until then, there is no way to move the discussion forward. BTW, more censorship news: https://game.udn.com/game/story/12982/5338115 https://game.udn.com/game/story/12982/5338115

dumb1224 6y ago
>Because you have never admitted censorship of Winnie the Pooh happened on Chinese social media. I never said that censorship never happened ever in the above discussion. Maybe it wasn't clear enough for you I apologise. I'm sorry if that's the interpretation in your mind. I encourage you to read the comments again. You would notice I never denied censorship happened in China either, in multiple places. I merely point out the difference between the sensationalised notion of 'Anything related to Winnie are banned' and 'posts been censored at specific time' in China. My nephew's english name is Winnie so you can see how popular Winnie the Pooh is. Indeed I agree there's no way to move the discussion further if the initial points were overlooked and just embarking on a path of assumptions.
- hkmaxpro 6y ago
  I also apologize for my overly confrontational approach. I mistook you as one of the wumaodang (fifty-cent party) who keeps denying and apologizing CCP behavior. (There is one such user with exactly this user name in some of the comments in this post.) I just searched for 小熊维尼 and 小熊维 on bilibili, and got the same findings as this thread: https://old.reddit.com/r/China_irl/comments/m9vziq/%E5%AD%98%E7%96%91%E7%96%91%E4%BC%BC%E7%94%B1%E4%BA%8E%E7%8E%8B%E7%89%8C%E5%BE%A1%E5%8F%B2%E7%AC%AC%E4%BA%8C%E9%9B%86%E5%87%BA%E7%8E%B0%E5%B0%8F%E7%86%8A%E7%BB%B4%E5%B0%BC%E7%94%BB%E9%9D%A2%E7%AC%AC%E4%BA%8C%E9%9B%86%E5%9C%A8%E5%A2%99%E5%86%85%E5%85%A8%E7%BD%91%E4%B8%8B%E6%9E%B6/grrctx4/ https://old.reddit.com/r/China_irl/comments/m9vziq/%E5%AD%98... Winnie-the-Pooh videos are clearly censored when you searched for 小熊维尼 (you only get generic Disney videos), but you can bypass the filter and find a few genuine Winnie-the-Pooh videos if you only search for 小熊维. The censorship is ongoing, even though not universal.
  - dumb1224 6y ago
    I have no doubts that most platforms have censored these keywords for whatever bizarre reason and it's nothing new. I refer it as 'noise' because people may have the wrong impression that all products related to Winnie and the whole thought have been banned. It is a bit different from reality. I don't like the idea of divisive labels such as wumao, gongzhi, fenqing (they are quite dated as well if you are old as me!) it will only reduce conversations to a low quality brawl. My view is as long as debates are open, rational, and logical, progressive thinking is preserved.
    - hkmaxpro 6y ago
      I disagree that incomplete censorship is noise. Any ban is a ban, even if incomplete. Trivializing and rationalizing CCP censorship acts is why it can keep censoring so many for so long. (Case in point: H&M is just censored from all major platforms in China, including Apple Maps [0]. This is totally unacceptable in any free society, hence this article. If people think censorship like this is noise, that’s why you will see more censorship acts in the future.) https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/winnie-the-pooh-china-ban https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/winnie-the-pooh-china-ba... is an honest evaluation of cases where Winnie-the-Pooh is censored, and where it is not. This article still concludes Winnie-the-Pooh is censored (“China’s ban on that lovable fluff ball may indeed tighten”), despite many cases it is allowed. Censorship is not binary. Saying “Winnie-the-Pooh is not censored” is misleading and dishonest, when it is clearly censored today on major video sites. In a Time of Universal Deceit — Telling the Truth Is a Revolutionary Act [0] https://www.theverge.com/2021/3/26/22352357/h-m-western-brands-gone-apple-maps-china-nike-adidas https://www.theverge.com/2021/3/26/22352357/h-m-western-bran...
      - dumb1224 6y ago
        Censorship is bad, no one is doubting that, the majority of chinese people would agree with you (and loathing as before). See the strong backlash from banning yyetss https://www.reuters.com/article/china-video-piracy-idINKBN2A31DV https://www.reuters.com/article/china-video-piracy-idINKBN2A... However it is like you said it's not so binary. I think there are differences between censoring posts and banning a whole commercial theme. No one is doubting the former but anyone who doesn't understand China would think it's a dystopia if they hear the latter (which is clearly not true in my opinion). It is actually quite logical that Winnie won't be banned because of the popularity and a universal ban is not practical. I didn't call it "noise" to play down censorship but in relative terms it is still trivial comparing to other concerning issues which are smothered by the amplification of sensationalism (IMHO). Simply ask any chinese person would they care if keywords of winnie are censored, and in comparison if MS word is banned. Such titles are more eye-catching than say 'the subtle difference in the agenda of the chinese congress' e.g My hope of removing the 'relative noise' is to reveal real issues that affect actual majority of the chinese population and what they really care about. Focusing on sensationalised news just leads to more meaningless us/them argument.

dumb1224 6y ago

>Because you have never admitted censorship of Winnie the Pooh happened on Chinese social media. I never said that censorship never happened ever in the above discussion. Maybe it wasn't clear enough for you I apologise. I'm sorry if that's the interpretation in your mind. I encourage you to read the comments again. You would notice I never denied censorship happened in China either, in multiple places. I merely point out the difference between the sensationalised notion of 'Anything related to Winnie are banned' and 'posts been censored at specific time' in China. My nephew's english name is Winnie so you can see how popular Winnie the Pooh is. Indeed I agree there's no way to move the discussion further if the initial points were overlooked and just embarking on a path of assumptions.

hkmaxpro 6y ago
I also apologize for my overly confrontational approach. I mistook you as one of the wumaodang (fifty-cent party) who keeps denying and apologizing CCP behavior. (There is one such user with exactly this user name in some of the comments in this post.) I just searched for 小熊维尼 and 小熊维 on bilibili, and got the same findings as this thread: https://old.reddit.com/r/China_irl/comments/m9vziq/%E5%AD%98%E7%96%91%E7%96%91%E4%BC%BC%E7%94%B1%E4%BA%8E%E7%8E%8B%E7%89%8C%E5%BE%A1%E5%8F%B2%E7%AC%AC%E4%BA%8C%E9%9B%86%E5%87%BA%E7%8E%B0%E5%B0%8F%E7%86%8A%E7%BB%B4%E5%B0%BC%E7%94%BB%E9%9D%A2%E7%AC%AC%E4%BA%8C%E9%9B%86%E5%9C%A8%E5%A2%99%E5%86%85%E5%85%A8%E7%BD%91%E4%B8%8B%E6%9E%B6/grrctx4/ https://old.reddit.com/r/China_irl/comments/m9vziq/%E5%AD%98... Winnie-the-Pooh videos are clearly censored when you searched for 小熊维尼 (you only get generic Disney videos), but you can bypass the filter and find a few genuine Winnie-the-Pooh videos if you only search for 小熊维. The censorship is ongoing, even though not universal.
- dumb1224 6y ago
  I have no doubts that most platforms have censored these keywords for whatever bizarre reason and it's nothing new. I refer it as 'noise' because people may have the wrong impression that all products related to Winnie and the whole thought have been banned. It is a bit different from reality. I don't like the idea of divisive labels such as wumao, gongzhi, fenqing (they are quite dated as well if you are old as me!) it will only reduce conversations to a low quality brawl. My view is as long as debates are open, rational, and logical, progressive thinking is preserved.
  - hkmaxpro 6y ago
    I disagree that incomplete censorship is noise. Any ban is a ban, even if incomplete. Trivializing and rationalizing CCP censorship acts is why it can keep censoring so many for so long. (Case in point: H&M is just censored from all major platforms in China, including Apple Maps [0]. This is totally unacceptable in any free society, hence this article. If people think censorship like this is noise, that’s why you will see more censorship acts in the future.) https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/winnie-the-pooh-china-ban https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/winnie-the-pooh-china-ba... is an honest evaluation of cases where Winnie-the-Pooh is censored, and where it is not. This article still concludes Winnie-the-Pooh is censored (“China’s ban on that lovable fluff ball may indeed tighten”), despite many cases it is allowed. Censorship is not binary. Saying “Winnie-the-Pooh is not censored” is misleading and dishonest, when it is clearly censored today on major video sites. In a Time of Universal Deceit — Telling the Truth Is a Revolutionary Act [0] https://www.theverge.com/2021/3/26/22352357/h-m-western-brands-gone-apple-maps-china-nike-adidas https://www.theverge.com/2021/3/26/22352357/h-m-western-bran...
    - dumb1224 6y ago
      Censorship is bad, no one is doubting that, the majority of chinese people would agree with you (and loathing as before). See the strong backlash from banning yyetss https://www.reuters.com/article/china-video-piracy-idINKBN2A31DV https://www.reuters.com/article/china-video-piracy-idINKBN2A... However it is like you said it's not so binary. I think there are differences between censoring posts and banning a whole commercial theme. No one is doubting the former but anyone who doesn't understand China would think it's a dystopia if they hear the latter (which is clearly not true in my opinion). It is actually quite logical that Winnie won't be banned because of the popularity and a universal ban is not practical. I didn't call it "noise" to play down censorship but in relative terms it is still trivial comparing to other concerning issues which are smothered by the amplification of sensationalism (IMHO). Simply ask any chinese person would they care if keywords of winnie are censored, and in comparison if MS word is banned. Such titles are more eye-catching than say 'the subtle difference in the agenda of the chinese congress' e.g My hope of removing the 'relative noise' is to reveal real issues that affect actual majority of the chinese population and what they really care about. Focusing on sensationalised news just leads to more meaningless us/them argument.