4 ms·

Plenty of people in the Free Software community don't feel represented by RMS. A lot of us were complaining about his behaviors even 15 years ago.

squarefoot 6y ago
And he is still there, which probably shows how hard is to find another leader who would not bend over to the interests of big corporations. The 1st reason behind these attack is to replace him with someone who can be easily controlled. Ask yourself a hundred times if you really want to replace someone who has odd ideas or is unlikable to some, with someone else who would destroy in a short time the work thousands developers did in decades.
- eeZah7Ux 6y ago
  First, I've never meet a FLOSS developer that wants a "leader". A spokeperson would be ok. Second, organizations like Conservancy, EFF, FSFE, and many others don't seem to have any difficulty finding good public speakers. The idea that we have to choose between RMS and some corporate drone is a false dichotomy plain an simple.
  - squarefoot 6y ago
    "First, I've never meet a FLOSS developer that wants a "leader". A spokeperson would be ok." Well, I don't qualify as a developer, but if I was one I would badly want a good leader. When projects grow, be it in distance, time and number of people, you need good leaders (leaders, not dictators, although sometimes we would have some use for them as well). Broadly speaking a leader is someone who prevents UI wars before they happen, someone who will give the best common base to develop different audio servers without having them stomp on each others feet, someone who will prevent useful but not fun parts of a system to rot because all developers want to work on other parts that are more fun, etc. And with regards to the FSF, being a leader means also acting as the worst possible enemy of any entity wanting to violate open licenses by taking open code, closing it and make loads of money from it giving nothing in return, something RMS has been really good at, including teaching about the problem in very small conferences lots of spokespersons wouldn't accept to talk at. It's a shitty job that brings both friends and enemies, with the enemies being often among the most powerful, not something to be regarded as a prize. Being just a spokesperson, and technically speaking RMS is a good one, isn't enough anymore, IMO. "The idea that we have to choose between RMS and some corporate drone is a false dichotomy plain an simple." In a perfect world I would agree; RMS would step down to be replaced by the best possible candidate, and everyone is happy, case closed. Unfortunately smear campaigns orchestrated with the intent of removing someone from a seat, ready to be occupied by some "friend" aren't new. The way this is going seems to suggest that someone, somewhere, is ready to replace him with someone who would work against the Free Software community interests.
    - lupire 6y ago
      FSF is a political organization, not a software project. The people who lead FSF software projects are the mantainers not the board members.
technothrasher 6y ago
15 years? I knew the man was trouble when I met him over 30 years ago. I couldn't understand why people didn't see the man over their excitement for the movement. People seemed to like him simply because he was disruptive.
DocTomoe 6y ago
Have you considered that a lot of people in the Free Software community do not care about other people "feeling represented" and instead want RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time? FLOSS is permanently under attack, from the industry (which recently switched from FUD to embrace and smother), from the legal framework, and from people inside the organisation. NOT going with the flow is exactly what us other people expect RMS to do. Also, if you do not feel represented by an organisation, why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation?
- fao_ 6y ago
  > Also, if you do not feel represented by an organisation, why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation? As of right now, the FSF Europe is no longer joined with the FSF
- eeZah7Ux 6y ago
  > instead want RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time? That's some cheeky phrasing. > FLOSS is permanently under attack, from the industry Sure it is, and having a spokeperson that act very poorly in public does not help a bit. > from the legal framework Huh? > NOT going with the flow is exactly what us other people expect RMS to do. What is "the flow"? Doing very weird things in public? Hitting hard on women at conferences? Pleasing corporations? > why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation? We did: Conservancy, EFF, FSFE are thriving. (Why are you assuming we didn't?)
- kaba0 6y ago
  > RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time I’m sure to a sick mind sexually harassing others feels convenient at the time, so apparently he is not that good at restraining himself...
eeZah7Ux 6y ago
Why the silent downvotes without explanation?
thereddaikon 6y ago
What do you mean by that? Do you mean his ideas on FOSS don't align with yours? He isn't representing your interests as a developer/user etc? Or is it because he is an old white man and you aren't? For the first two perhaps there is an org that better aligns with your goals. Unless you are heavily invested into the FSF and wish to change its direction I think putting your energy into an org that aligns with you is a better way to spend your time. If its the last one please explain to me how that isn't racist/sexist.

squarefoot 6y ago

And he is still there, which probably shows how hard is to find another leader who would not bend over to the interests of big corporations. The 1st reason behind these attack is to replace him with someone who can be easily controlled. Ask yourself a hundred times if you really want to replace someone who has odd ideas or is unlikable to some, with someone else who would destroy in a short time the work thousands developers did in decades.

eeZah7Ux 6y ago
First, I've never meet a FLOSS developer that wants a "leader". A spokeperson would be ok. Second, organizations like Conservancy, EFF, FSFE, and many others don't seem to have any difficulty finding good public speakers. The idea that we have to choose between RMS and some corporate drone is a false dichotomy plain an simple.
- squarefoot 6y ago
  "First, I've never meet a FLOSS developer that wants a "leader". A spokeperson would be ok." Well, I don't qualify as a developer, but if I was one I would badly want a good leader. When projects grow, be it in distance, time and number of people, you need good leaders (leaders, not dictators, although sometimes we would have some use for them as well). Broadly speaking a leader is someone who prevents UI wars before they happen, someone who will give the best common base to develop different audio servers without having them stomp on each others feet, someone who will prevent useful but not fun parts of a system to rot because all developers want to work on other parts that are more fun, etc. And with regards to the FSF, being a leader means also acting as the worst possible enemy of any entity wanting to violate open licenses by taking open code, closing it and make loads of money from it giving nothing in return, something RMS has been really good at, including teaching about the problem in very small conferences lots of spokespersons wouldn't accept to talk at. It's a shitty job that brings both friends and enemies, with the enemies being often among the most powerful, not something to be regarded as a prize. Being just a spokesperson, and technically speaking RMS is a good one, isn't enough anymore, IMO. "The idea that we have to choose between RMS and some corporate drone is a false dichotomy plain an simple." In a perfect world I would agree; RMS would step down to be replaced by the best possible candidate, and everyone is happy, case closed. Unfortunately smear campaigns orchestrated with the intent of removing someone from a seat, ready to be occupied by some "friend" aren't new. The way this is going seems to suggest that someone, somewhere, is ready to replace him with someone who would work against the Free Software community interests.
  - lupire 6y ago
    FSF is a political organization, not a software project. The people who lead FSF software projects are the mantainers not the board members.

technothrasher 6y ago

15 years? I knew the man was trouble when I met him over 30 years ago. I couldn't understand why people didn't see the man over their excitement for the movement. People seemed to like him simply because he was disruptive.

DocTomoe 6y ago

Have you considered that a lot of people in the Free Software community do not care about other people "feeling represented" and instead want RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time? FLOSS is permanently under attack, from the industry (which recently switched from FUD to embrace and smother), from the legal framework, and from people inside the organisation. NOT going with the flow is exactly what us other people expect RMS to do. Also, if you do not feel represented by an organisation, why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation?

fao_ 6y ago
> Also, if you do not feel represented by an organisation, why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation? As of right now, the FSF Europe is no longer joined with the FSF
eeZah7Ux 6y ago
> instead want RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time? That's some cheeky phrasing. > FLOSS is permanently under attack, from the industry Sure it is, and having a spokeperson that act very poorly in public does not help a bit. > from the legal framework Huh? > NOT going with the flow is exactly what us other people expect RMS to do. What is "the flow"? Doing very weird things in public? Hitting hard on women at conferences? Pleasing corporations? > why not do the OpenSource-thing and fork the organisation? We did: Conservancy, EFF, FSFE are thriving. (Why are you assuming we didn't?)
kaba0 6y ago
> RMS especially because he does not submit to what feels convenient at the time I’m sure to a sick mind sexually harassing others feels convenient at the time, so apparently he is not that good at restraining himself...

eeZah7Ux 6y ago

Why the silent downvotes without explanation?

thereddaikon 6y ago

What do you mean by that? Do you mean his ideas on FOSS don't align with yours? He isn't representing your interests as a developer/user etc? Or is it because he is an old white man and you aren't? For the first two perhaps there is an org that better aligns with your goals. Unless you are heavily invested into the FSF and wish to change its direction I think putting your energy into an org that aligns with you is a better way to spend your time. If its the last one please explain to me how that isn't racist/sexist.