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React, Redux, Jest, and it’s ilk always came off to me as a way for Facebook to remain relevant through tech-debt and lock-in.

acemarke 6y ago
FWIW, Redux has _never_ been a Facebook project. Yes, both of the creators now work on the React team (Dan Abramov and Andrew Clark), but it's always been an independent OSS project, and is currently maintained by myself and Tim Dorr. As far as I know, FB barely even uses Redux at all internally, and that only in isolated particular teams that chose it themselves. My understanding is that they mostly use Relay for the new FB.com, and still have a lot of old-school Flux in there as well.
- acoard 6y ago
  >Yes, both of the creators now work on the React team (Dan Abramov and Andrew Clark), but it's always been an independent OSS project, and is currently maintained by myself and Tim Dorr. The source I have says that Dan Abramov created Redux while working at Facebook on React[0]. So while Redux has never been under the official governance of FB, it was created by FB employees for a FB project (React) while in parallel working on that project. [0] https://golden.com/wiki/Dan_Abramov_(software_engineer)-99B8RJM https://golden.com/wiki/Dan_Abramov_(software_engineer)-99B8...
  - acemarke 6y ago
    That's wrong. Dan created Redux while he was actually unemployed. I'd have to check the exact timeline, but I believe he left Stampsy in late 2014 or early 2015, and was actually getting some funding from an OSS collective-type thing while he developed Redux in preparation for React Europe. Redux was developed in June/July 2015, and demoed at React Europe on July 5, 2015 [0]. Redux 1.0 was released on Aug 14, 2015 [1]. Per the tweet linked from that page [2], Dan didn't join Facebook until November 2015, well after Redux had been released. So, he most definitely was _not_ working at FB when he developed Redux. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsSnOQynTHs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsSnOQynTHs [1] https://github.com/reduxjs/redux/releases/tag/v1.0.0 https://github.com/reduxjs/redux/releases/tag/v1.0.0 [2] https://twitter.com/dan_abramov/status/671135846830075904 https://twitter.com/dan_abramov/status/671135846830075904
- yepthatsreality 6y ago
  My bad, I didn't mean to include Redux then. My commentary is more directed at React and Jest (as I try to steer away from that ecosystem, even though it's ideas aren't all bad): - As GP indicates, React has had multiple API implementations to solve similar problems, feature bloat, leading to opinionated and differing best practices, mixed in with Junior devs can be a nightmare - With Jest, I find the entire thing as a very aggressive wrapper and very tied to React itself, features like unit test `snapshots` are developer slack-off bait and have the benefit of further entrenching itself into the repository, arguably an e2e test would validate the same thing
nsonha 6y ago
Doesn't make sense, there is nothing that benefits facebook by "dominating" a tech niche. They dont profit off of development platforms (android and .NET) like google and microsoft
- yepthatsreality 6y ago
  See my other reply in this thread for clarity.

acemarke 6y ago

FWIW, Redux has _never_ been a Facebook project. Yes, both of the creators now work on the React team (Dan Abramov and Andrew Clark), but it's always been an independent OSS project, and is currently maintained by myself and Tim Dorr. As far as I know, FB barely even uses Redux at all internally, and that only in isolated particular teams that chose it themselves. My understanding is that they mostly use Relay for the new FB.com, and still have a lot of old-school Flux in there as well.

acoard 6y ago
>Yes, both of the creators now work on the React team (Dan Abramov and Andrew Clark), but it's always been an independent OSS project, and is currently maintained by myself and Tim Dorr. The source I have says that Dan Abramov created Redux while working at Facebook on React[0]. So while Redux has never been under the official governance of FB, it was created by FB employees for a FB project (React) while in parallel working on that project. [0] https://golden.com/wiki/Dan_Abramov_(software_engineer)-99B8RJM https://golden.com/wiki/Dan_Abramov_(software_engineer)-99B8...
- acemarke 6y ago
  That's wrong. Dan created Redux while he was actually unemployed. I'd have to check the exact timeline, but I believe he left Stampsy in late 2014 or early 2015, and was actually getting some funding from an OSS collective-type thing while he developed Redux in preparation for React Europe. Redux was developed in June/July 2015, and demoed at React Europe on July 5, 2015 [0]. Redux 1.0 was released on Aug 14, 2015 [1]. Per the tweet linked from that page [2], Dan didn't join Facebook until November 2015, well after Redux had been released. So, he most definitely was _not_ working at FB when he developed Redux. [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsSnOQynTHs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsSnOQynTHs [1] https://github.com/reduxjs/redux/releases/tag/v1.0.0 https://github.com/reduxjs/redux/releases/tag/v1.0.0 [2] https://twitter.com/dan_abramov/status/671135846830075904 https://twitter.com/dan_abramov/status/671135846830075904
yepthatsreality 6y ago
My bad, I didn't mean to include Redux then. My commentary is more directed at React and Jest (as I try to steer away from that ecosystem, even though it's ideas aren't all bad): - As GP indicates, React has had multiple API implementations to solve similar problems, feature bloat, leading to opinionated and differing best practices, mixed in with Junior devs can be a nightmare - With Jest, I find the entire thing as a very aggressive wrapper and very tied to React itself, features like unit test `snapshots` are developer slack-off bait and have the benefit of further entrenching itself into the repository, arguably an e2e test would validate the same thing

nsonha 6y ago

Doesn't make sense, there is nothing that benefits facebook by "dominating" a tech niche. They dont profit off of development platforms (android and .NET) like google and microsoft

yepthatsreality 6y ago
See my other reply in this thread for clarity.