4 ms·

the sexual harassment was asking women at conferences on dates

Ygg2 6y ago
He's obviously an animal, devoid of all reason./sarcasm
orra 6y ago
You're downplaying it entirely. He has a track record of handing out sexualized 'pleasure cards' at professional conferences. Women at MIT were warned away from him, told to keep plants to ward him off. And one of the most troubling things he has done is psychological manipulation. Many jurisdictions rightly recognise as domestic abuse. In particular, he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. Depressed people should seek treatment. Being depressed doesn't excuse manipulation.
- loveistheanswer 6y ago
  >In particular, he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. >Depressed people should seek treatment. Being depressed doesn't excuse manipulation. I've been on the receiving end of that same situation; and yet, I don't think inciting an internet hate mob to banish that person from their life's work indefinitely is the proper "treatment" I'd recommend to give that person.
  - orra 6y ago
    Again, mental health doesn't excuse domestic abuse.
    - yellowapple 6y ago
      This is not domestic abuse.
    - loveistheanswer 6y ago
      What makes you think I said it did?
- nwah1 6y ago
  Manipulating? The word you are looking for is begging. Get a grip
- vlsmaker 6y ago
  For heavens sake, "business or pleasure?" was the question you were asked at the border before getting a stamp in your passport once upon a time. So a business card turned into a pleasure card, which has nothing to do with sex at all, except for people who want to see things that aren't there. It's one of RMS's quaint re-namings, and people turn it into something sinister. > Women at MIT were warned away from him, told to keep plants to ward him off. That may have been a joke or they didn't want to listen to his preaching. Anecdotal hearsay anyway. > he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. How did he say that? Most likely as a joke, which millions of people have done. But hey, let's focus on Stallman who wasn't even involved with Epstein himself instead of the people that Epstein collected dossiers about. Those would be the interesting ones, but perhaps some corporate or political interests don't allow it.
  - throwawaysea 6y ago
    Thank you for the explanation of the "business or pleasure" connection. That's how I read it as well but with everyone pulling out their torches and scythes for a witch hunt, I was starting to second guess my own opinion and perception of all this. I'm not sure if there's a word for that phenomenon...
    - crtasm 6y ago
      For reference here's one of the cards (I don't know if he made other versions): https://fossforce.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/RMSleisure.jpg https://fossforce.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/RMSleisure....
  - orra 6y ago
    You downplay the sexual harassment of handing out these 'pleasure cards'. But ultimately, real women are upset by it. The unprofessional behavior discourages women from being in tech. Just because you wouldn't mind receiving such a card, doesn't mean it's not harassment. I mean, do you understand (a) the nature of consent, and (b) professional workplace environments?
    - 6y ago

Ygg2 6y ago

He's obviously an animal, devoid of all reason./sarcasm

orra 6y ago

You're downplaying it entirely. He has a track record of handing out sexualized 'pleasure cards' at professional conferences. Women at MIT were warned away from him, told to keep plants to ward him off. And one of the most troubling things he has done is psychological manipulation. Many jurisdictions rightly recognise as domestic abuse. In particular, he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. Depressed people should seek treatment. Being depressed doesn't excuse manipulation.

loveistheanswer 6y ago
>In particular, he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. >Depressed people should seek treatment. Being depressed doesn't excuse manipulation. I've been on the receiving end of that same situation; and yet, I don't think inciting an internet hate mob to banish that person from their life's work indefinitely is the proper "treatment" I'd recommend to give that person.
- orra 6y ago
  Again, mental health doesn't excuse domestic abuse.
  - yellowapple 6y ago
    This is not domestic abuse.
  - loveistheanswer 6y ago
    What makes you think I said it did?
nwah1 6y ago
Manipulating? The word you are looking for is begging. Get a grip
vlsmaker 6y ago
For heavens sake, "business or pleasure?" was the question you were asked at the border before getting a stamp in your passport once upon a time. So a business card turned into a pleasure card, which has nothing to do with sex at all, except for people who want to see things that aren't there. It's one of RMS's quaint re-namings, and people turn it into something sinister. > Women at MIT were warned away from him, told to keep plants to ward him off. That may have been a joke or they didn't want to listen to his preaching. Anecdotal hearsay anyway. > he told one woman he would kill himself if she didn't date him. How did he say that? Most likely as a joke, which millions of people have done. But hey, let's focus on Stallman who wasn't even involved with Epstein himself instead of the people that Epstein collected dossiers about. Those would be the interesting ones, but perhaps some corporate or political interests don't allow it.
- throwawaysea 6y ago
  Thank you for the explanation of the "business or pleasure" connection. That's how I read it as well but with everyone pulling out their torches and scythes for a witch hunt, I was starting to second guess my own opinion and perception of all this. I'm not sure if there's a word for that phenomenon...
  - crtasm 6y ago
    For reference here's one of the cards (I don't know if he made other versions): https://fossforce.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/RMSleisure.jpg https://fossforce.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/RMSleisure....
- orra 6y ago
  You downplay the sexual harassment of handing out these 'pleasure cards'. But ultimately, real women are upset by it. The unprofessional behavior discourages women from being in tech. Just because you wouldn't mind receiving such a card, doesn't mean it's not harassment. I mean, do you understand (a) the nature of consent, and (b) professional workplace environments?
  - 6y ago