5 ms·

Ouch. Automakers were already struggling with chip supply. This is going to shut down production lines.

deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
centimeter 6y ago
It was really difficult for me to buy a new car last year. Customized orders are totally impossible right now. Whatever they might have in stock (or have arriving soon), that's what you can choose from.
yabones 6y ago
Already has... I know some people who work IT for a large automotive facility in Ontario that have been laid off for 3-4 weeks already. It really feels like nobody appreciated just how critical to all aspects of our lives semiconductors have become - tiny little chips have caused heavy industry to grind to a halt in some places.
- jacquesm 6y ago
  Nothing like industry heavyweights offloading their mistakes onto the common folk.
oh_sigh 6y ago
Since cars generally have a large physical space for chips and ample power, why don't automakers just use chips from older fabs?
- baybal2 6y ago
  Redesign, and re-certify a car selling at less than 10% markup. You will be underwater for the car's entire remaining lifetime on the market.
  - oh_sigh 6y ago
    I meant as part of the original design, not as a stop-gap until the fabs are outputting enough chips.
    - baybal2 6y ago
      Car safety regulations in quite a few places will require you to fully recertify a car even if you changed a stereo in it. Some place limitations on safety critical electronics like ABS specifically requiring any modification to it being treated as a new car model for legal purposes. Such laws are predatory, but laws they are But even if they did find cheaper substitutes, it's not the more advanced chips which are in the most acute shortage, but really old ones, which were kept in production for decades specifically because of car industry's requirements.
digikata 6y ago
Not Toyota, but I don't know how large their mitigation buffer was set to. Seems like they took the logistical risk analysis more seriously than other makers. https://www.autoblog.com/2021/03/09/toyota-how-it-avoided-semiconductor-shortage https://www.autoblog.com/2021/03/09/toyota-how-it-avoided-se...
ChuckNorris89 6y ago
>Automakers were already struggling with chip supply TBH, that is their own fault. When the pandemic started a year ago, they chickened out thinking people won't have money to buy anymore cars and halted production, cancelling orders for semiconductors. Then, when the demand for cars exploded, since nobody wanted to be on a subway/bus full of people carrying a contagious virus, they wanted their chips to resume production, but the semiconductor fabs have already allocated the wafer capacity the automakers have just freed up to other industries that were booming. The automakers basically sold both their kidneys to the pawnshop for a quick buck and are now trying to buy them back during a kidney shortage.
- ThrowawayR2 6y ago
  I'm not sure we should be so quick to fault them. The unemployment rate when the pandemic really started building up steam was absolutely staggering so a lot of people quite reasonably expected a severe recession along with severe contraction of consumer demand to follow. That we didn't experience one is a minor miracle (and printing of a ridiculous amount of money).
  - ChuckNorris89 6y ago
    Yes you can, and here's why. The high unemployment rate during the pandemic was(and still is) mostly formed of people working in the service industry, travel, minimum wage earners and people with little to no skills and those people were having a rough time even before the pandemic so they were never on the automakers' radar of customers would buy a new car, not in a million years. Those people can only afford to buy used. On the other hand, the typical new car buyer, the middle classer and above, saw little unemployment, on the contrary, many have seen their best years yet, which is why the demand for new cars (among other things) exploded.
    - tlb 6y ago
      Entirely predictable (in retrospect). The (in mice) of economic predictions.
  - 6y ago

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

It was really difficult for me to buy a new car last year. Customized orders are totally impossible right now. Whatever they might have in stock (or have arriving soon), that's what you can choose from.

yabones 6y ago

Already has... I know some people who work IT for a large automotive facility in Ontario that have been laid off for 3-4 weeks already. It really feels like nobody appreciated just how critical to all aspects of our lives semiconductors have become - tiny little chips have caused heavy industry to grind to a halt in some places.

jacquesm 6y ago
Nothing like industry heavyweights offloading their mistakes onto the common folk.

oh_sigh 6y ago

Since cars generally have a large physical space for chips and ample power, why don't automakers just use chips from older fabs?

baybal2 6y ago
Redesign, and re-certify a car selling at less than 10% markup. You will be underwater for the car's entire remaining lifetime on the market.
- oh_sigh 6y ago
  I meant as part of the original design, not as a stop-gap until the fabs are outputting enough chips.
  - baybal2 6y ago
    Car safety regulations in quite a few places will require you to fully recertify a car even if you changed a stereo in it. Some place limitations on safety critical electronics like ABS specifically requiring any modification to it being treated as a new car model for legal purposes. Such laws are predatory, but laws they are But even if they did find cheaper substitutes, it's not the more advanced chips which are in the most acute shortage, but really old ones, which were kept in production for decades specifically because of car industry's requirements.

digikata 6y ago

Not Toyota, but I don't know how large their mitigation buffer was set to. Seems like they took the logistical risk analysis more seriously than other makers. https://www.autoblog.com/2021/03/09/toyota-how-it-avoided-semiconductor-shortage https://www.autoblog.com/2021/03/09/toyota-how-it-avoided-se...

ChuckNorris89 6y ago

>Automakers were already struggling with chip supply TBH, that is their own fault. When the pandemic started a year ago, they chickened out thinking people won't have money to buy anymore cars and halted production, cancelling orders for semiconductors. Then, when the demand for cars exploded, since nobody wanted to be on a subway/bus full of people carrying a contagious virus, they wanted their chips to resume production, but the semiconductor fabs have already allocated the wafer capacity the automakers have just freed up to other industries that were booming. The automakers basically sold both their kidneys to the pawnshop for a quick buck and are now trying to buy them back during a kidney shortage.

ThrowawayR2 6y ago
I'm not sure we should be so quick to fault them. The unemployment rate when the pandemic really started building up steam was absolutely staggering so a lot of people quite reasonably expected a severe recession along with severe contraction of consumer demand to follow. That we didn't experience one is a minor miracle (and printing of a ridiculous amount of money).
- ChuckNorris89 6y ago
  Yes you can, and here's why. The high unemployment rate during the pandemic was(and still is) mostly formed of people working in the service industry, travel, minimum wage earners and people with little to no skills and those people were having a rough time even before the pandemic so they were never on the automakers' radar of customers would buy a new car, not in a million years. Those people can only afford to buy used. On the other hand, the typical new car buyer, the middle classer and above, saw little unemployment, on the contrary, many have seen their best years yet, which is why the demand for new cars (among other things) exploded.
  - tlb 6y ago
    Entirely predictable (in retrospect). The (in mice) of economic predictions.
- 6y ago