4 ms·

anyone else have family/friends working/born and raised in hk and have zero care about the "protests" ? yeah most people go about their lives while the media br

anyone else have family/friends working/born and raised in hk and have zero care about the "protests" ? yeah most people go about their lives while the media bread and circus blasted this to western audiences when it was trendy. extremely amusing to watch internet nobodies absolutely nuke reddit with hk posts when chances are they have no idea how to locate hk on a map

SiempreViernes 6y ago
Well, it's hardly surprising that media reports about the integration of a fairly liberal city into a very repressive dictatorship. Honestly, how do you feel about anything that isn't local news? Most of national news will be reporting about people you will never meet and don't know too.
- rado 6y ago
  Liberal yes. But they insist on "democracy" which is ridiculous, as it didn't happen under the British. They "almost" instated it shortly before the handover, but didn't succeed for some reason. Extremely amusing indeed. And HK people's lives were almost unbearable under the tycoons' feudalism, which has nothing to do with Beijing.
  - bordercases 6y ago
    This comparison presumes a false choice between either close governance by China, or governance that resembles the old British order ("tycoon feudalism"). Why can't it be something else entirely?
    - rado 6y ago
      Sure it can. But that's not the protesters' rhetoric.
  - Context_free 6y ago
    In 1967 under the British, dozens of Chinese protesting against British rule and for representation were killed in Hong Kong.
    - hker 6y ago
      > In 1967 under the British, dozens of Chinese protesting against British rule and for representation were killed in Hong Kong. This comment is context free: missing critical historical contexts (if not outright misleading). 1967 was at the height of the Cultural Revolution in China, when it was spreading to Hong Kong [1], Macau [2], and elsewhere. Notably, the local communists (CCP supporters) planted roadside bombs during the 1967 Riots [1], causing 15 deaths and 800+ injuries in Hong Kong. The Wikipedia articles [1][2] have more details. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_Hong_Kong_riots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_Hong_Kong_riots [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-3_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-3_incident
  - Galanwe 6y ago
    > But they insist on "democracy" which is ridiculous, as it didn't happen under the British. What is your argument here? They did not had democracy before so they should not complain to not have it now? How twisted is that. Also, I don't think claiming your constitutional right to democracy can be tagged as "ridiculous". Universal suffrage and democratic election are parts of the "Basic law", the equivalent of the constitution, that the PRC signed as part of the handover "deal".
    - rado 6y ago
      Democracy has never existed (except on paper) and never will. How twisted is the US system whose main goal is to separate people and control them more easily?
  - jbay808 6y ago
    > They "almost" instated it shortly before the handover, but didn't succeed for some reason. Extremely amusing indeed. Perhaps because China declared that they'd invade if HK was allowed to self-govern? https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-push-against-hong-kong-elections-in-50s.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-pu... "documents recently released by the National Archives in Britain suggest that beginning in the 1950s, the colonial governors who ran Hong Kong repeatedly sought to introduce popular elections but abandoned those efforts in the face of pressure by Communist Party leaders in Beijing. "The documents, part of a batch of typewritten diplomatic dispatches requested by reporters from two Hong Kong newspapers, reveal that Chinese leaders were so opposed to the prospect of a democratic Hong Kong that they threatened to invade should London attempt to change the status quo."
    - powerapple 6y ago
      Grantham convinced London to scrap all plans for political reform on the basis that it did not "interest the British electorate". Later, when confronted by the Hong Kong public, he blamed London.[12] All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision. In October 1952, the British Colonial Secretary Oliver Lyttelton announced that the time was "inopportune for...constitutional changes of a major character".[16] Of course, British has its own interests, while China also has its own interests. In the end, HK is part of China, and it should be returned to China fully. If British consider Hong Kong's freedom is more important, maybe they should went to war with China instead.
      - jbay808 6y ago
        Those numbers in brackets look like citations.[12, 16] What are you citing?
        hker 6y ago
        The phrase "All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision." does not lead to any credible source, only some mentions on a small number of websites or Reddit. Compare the Google searches: - "the colonial governors who ran Hong Kong repeatedly sought to introduce popular elections but abandoned those efforts in the face of pressure by Communist Party leaders in Beijing." [1] leads to the New York Times article, which I can follow its references. - "All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision." [2] does not lead to any credible source. In fact, some of the sites appear to be disinformation campaigns (don’t take my words, judge for yourself). [1]: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22the+colonial+governors+who+ran+Hong+Kong+repeatedly+sought+to+introduce+popular+elections+but+abandoned+those+efforts+in+the+face+of+pressure+by+Communist+Party+leaders+in+Beijing.%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=%22the+colonial+governors+wh... [2]: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22All+major+democratic+reforms+for+Hong+Kong+were+dropped+by+British+Cabinet+decision.%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=%22All+major+democratic+refo...
laumars 6y ago
I do have family/friends in HK and they very much did care. There has also been large numbers of people moving from HK because “[they] don’t want to be stuck in HK after mainland China has taken control”.
- sweezyjeezy 6y ago
  Yeah I'm interested to know if OP actually has any first-hand experience of this, because when I was there it was not difficult to find people who were despondent about the situation, even though none of them were directly involved with the protests anymore. My impression was the general populace can't see a way out of this. That's pretty far from not caring though.
tannhauser23 6y ago
My friends in Hong Kong care a lot. They were born and raised there. They're all making plans to leave because they don't want their children to grow up in a CCP-dominated Hong Kong.
delta-v21 6y ago
Even people who are pro-CCP care as the protest affects them.
curryslapper 6y ago
Good luck not getting your comment reported. Any comment that is contrary to 'CCP dogs/propaganda' etc just gets downvoted/reported.

SiempreViernes 6y ago

Well, it's hardly surprising that media reports about the integration of a fairly liberal city into a very repressive dictatorship. Honestly, how do you feel about anything that isn't local news? Most of national news will be reporting about people you will never meet and don't know too.

rado 6y ago
Liberal yes. But they insist on "democracy" which is ridiculous, as it didn't happen under the British. They "almost" instated it shortly before the handover, but didn't succeed for some reason. Extremely amusing indeed. And HK people's lives were almost unbearable under the tycoons' feudalism, which has nothing to do with Beijing.
- bordercases 6y ago
  This comparison presumes a false choice between either close governance by China, or governance that resembles the old British order ("tycoon feudalism"). Why can't it be something else entirely?
  - rado 6y ago
    Sure it can. But that's not the protesters' rhetoric.
- Context_free 6y ago
  In 1967 under the British, dozens of Chinese protesting against British rule and for representation were killed in Hong Kong.
  - hker 6y ago
    > In 1967 under the British, dozens of Chinese protesting against British rule and for representation were killed in Hong Kong. This comment is context free: missing critical historical contexts (if not outright misleading). 1967 was at the height of the Cultural Revolution in China, when it was spreading to Hong Kong [1], Macau [2], and elsewhere. Notably, the local communists (CCP supporters) planted roadside bombs during the 1967 Riots [1], causing 15 deaths and 800+ injuries in Hong Kong. The Wikipedia articles [1][2] have more details. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_Hong_Kong_riots https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1967_Hong_Kong_riots [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-3_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12-3_incident
- Galanwe 6y ago
  > But they insist on "democracy" which is ridiculous, as it didn't happen under the British. What is your argument here? They did not had democracy before so they should not complain to not have it now? How twisted is that. Also, I don't think claiming your constitutional right to democracy can be tagged as "ridiculous". Universal suffrage and democratic election are parts of the "Basic law", the equivalent of the constitution, that the PRC signed as part of the handover "deal".
  - rado 6y ago
    Democracy has never existed (except on paper) and never will. How twisted is the US system whose main goal is to separate people and control them more easily?
- jbay808 6y ago
  > They "almost" instated it shortly before the handover, but didn't succeed for some reason. Extremely amusing indeed. Perhaps because China declared that they'd invade if HK was allowed to self-govern? https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-push-against-hong-kong-elections-in-50s.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-pu... "documents recently released by the National Archives in Britain suggest that beginning in the 1950s, the colonial governors who ran Hong Kong repeatedly sought to introduce popular elections but abandoned those efforts in the face of pressure by Communist Party leaders in Beijing. "The documents, part of a batch of typewritten diplomatic dispatches requested by reporters from two Hong Kong newspapers, reveal that Chinese leaders were so opposed to the prospect of a democratic Hong Kong that they threatened to invade should London attempt to change the status quo."
  - powerapple 6y ago
    Grantham convinced London to scrap all plans for political reform on the basis that it did not "interest the British electorate". Later, when confronted by the Hong Kong public, he blamed London.[12] All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision. In October 1952, the British Colonial Secretary Oliver Lyttelton announced that the time was "inopportune for...constitutional changes of a major character".[16] Of course, British has its own interests, while China also has its own interests. In the end, HK is part of China, and it should be returned to China fully. If British consider Hong Kong's freedom is more important, maybe they should went to war with China instead.
    - jbay808 6y ago
      Those numbers in brackets look like citations.[12, 16] What are you citing?
      - hker 6y ago
        The phrase "All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision." does not lead to any credible source, only some mentions on a small number of websites or Reddit. Compare the Google searches: - "the colonial governors who ran Hong Kong repeatedly sought to introduce popular elections but abandoned those efforts in the face of pressure by Communist Party leaders in Beijing." [1] leads to the New York Times article, which I can follow its references. - "All major democratic reforms for Hong Kong were dropped by British Cabinet decision." [2] does not lead to any credible source. In fact, some of the sites appear to be disinformation campaigns (don’t take my words, judge for yourself). [1]: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22the+colonial+governors+who+ran+Hong+Kong+repeatedly+sought+to+introduce+popular+elections+but+abandoned+those+efforts+in+the+face+of+pressure+by+Communist+Party+leaders+in+Beijing.%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=%22the+colonial+governors+wh... [2]: https://www.google.com/search?q=%22All+major+democratic+reforms+for+Hong+Kong+were+dropped+by+British+Cabinet+decision.%22 https://www.google.com/search?q=%22All+major+democratic+refo...

laumars 6y ago

I do have family/friends in HK and they very much did care. There has also been large numbers of people moving from HK because “[they] don’t want to be stuck in HK after mainland China has taken control”.

sweezyjeezy 6y ago
Yeah I'm interested to know if OP actually has any first-hand experience of this, because when I was there it was not difficult to find people who were despondent about the situation, even though none of them were directly involved with the protests anymore. My impression was the general populace can't see a way out of this. That's pretty far from not caring though.

tannhauser23 6y ago

My friends in Hong Kong care a lot. They were born and raised there. They're all making plans to leave because they don't want their children to grow up in a CCP-dominated Hong Kong.

delta-v21 6y ago

Even people who are pro-CCP care as the protest affects them.

curryslapper 6y ago

Good luck not getting your comment reported. Any comment that is contrary to 'CCP dogs/propaganda' etc just gets downvoted/reported.