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Can somebody please just make a NUC-type device that I can purchase as a unit with the following included: Rasberry PI 8GB + WiFi + Bluetooth NVMe >= 128gb

Can somebody please just make a NUC-type device that I can purchase as a unit with the following included: Rasberry PI 8GB + WiFi + Bluetooth NVMe >= 128gb Power supply appropriate for PI+NVMe (3.5A perhaps?) Case with appropriate cooling Ubuntu >= 20.04 I would pay up to $200 USD for such a product. Why not an intel NUC? Because I want to leave this on 24/7 and run various cron jobs etc, so I want the low-power ARM chip. Yes I can build it myself, but shopping for, gathering all the parts etc is time consuming and I'd rather be writing my apps etc to run on the device instead... EDIT: formatting

TaylorAlexander 6y ago
Just need a case for the Tofu: https://youtu.be/m-QSQ24_8LY https://youtu.be/m-QSQ24_8LY Idk about Ubuntu though. Raspberry Pi OS is based off of Debian and optimized for the pi. Edit: Ah I was unfamiliar but of course there is an Ubuntu release for the pi. https://ubuntu.com/download/raspberry-pi https://ubuntu.com/download/raspberry-pi Edit2: Ah I jumped straight to the Tofu board but I didn’t see that TFA features another nice board for this purpose.
- gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
  In my experience Rasbian packages are very old, makes certain dev tasks harder.
  - TaylorAlexander 6y ago
    Yep that’s fair. I had that trouble with Debian on my own systems and I tend to use Ubuntu on them now.
gambiting 6y ago
>>Because I want to leave this on 24/7 and run various cron jobs etc, so I want the low-power ARM chip. But the Pi4 can use as much as 15W, it has left the realm of "low powered" devices long time ago. I have a very old(2013) HP workstation that I use as a NAS, with a 2nd gen i5, and when running it uses 20W of power, measured by myself.
- bredren 6y ago
  The author discusses power requirements / power supply considerations of pi 4 + nvme at 6:44: https://youtu.be/4Womn10v71s https://youtu.be/4Womn10v71s
- syntaxing 6y ago
  Hmm that's really really surprising if thats the case. According to the spec sheet [1], its TDP is 95W. RAM itself is 3W each, the cooling fans is easily 5W, the CPU cooling fan should be another 10W-20W. Would love to learn the configuration that gives you 20W power usage total. To put into perspective, my mac M1 uses 20Wish normally for regular usage. [1] https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/52207/intel-core-i5-2400-processor-6m-cache-up-to-3-40-ghz.html https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/52207/i...
  - WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago
    > its TDP is 95W So AMD and Intel measure TDP differently because obviously they do. Intel's TDP is based on the max the CPU can generate while AMD is based on what an average user would encounter.
    - wtallis 6y ago
      Intel's TDP is more based on the max the CPU would draw, when all the various Turbo modes are disabled. Which reflects approximately zero real-world deployments except for the very low-end parts where Intel disables the Turbo modes for product segmentation.
    - reitzensteinm 6y ago
      You've got it the wrong way around there. AMD is much more conservative. https://www.extremetech.com/computing/319402-intels-desktop-tdps-no-longer-useful-to-predict-cpu-power-consumption https://www.extremetech.com/computing/319402-intels-desktop-... "It’s easy to see why Intel hasn’t changed the way it defines or communicates TDP to its customers: It would make the company’s high end look vastly worse compared with AMD. A Core i9-10850K will draw up to 265W. If you want an AMD CPU with that kind of power budget you have to buy a Threadripper."
corebuffer 6y ago
Have you considered recycling a thin client? This website gather specs on them and you can find used ones as low as 20 bucks on eBay. Many will draw 10-20 watts, like a Raspberry. https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t510/ https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t510/
- puzzlingcaptcha 6y ago
  Both my HP t520 and Fujitsu Futro S720 idle at 6W (with the audio codec powered down), measured at the wall.
- blacksmith_tb 6y ago
  Or quite a few Chromeboxes can be wiped and run Linux (though it's worth doing a little homework, some at least need to be popped open to have their dev-mode screw pulled like this[1]). Certainly options for less than $100 on eBay. 1: https://dareneiri.github.io/Asus-Chromebox-With-Full-Linux-Install/ https://dareneiri.github.io/Asus-Chromebox-With-Full-Linux-I...
eli 6y ago
For a similar use case I ended up with a Lenovo "nano" desktop. The IoT models are designed to be run continuously and, uh, it runs Windows too which I guess is a bonus. $300+ on sale.
- sigjuice 6y ago
  These look really cool. Unfortunately, I can't seem to configure one without Windows.
  - offtop5 6y ago
    It should be a nominal task to install Ubuntu on top of it, worst comes to worse it doesn't work and you send it back to Best buy.
    - sigjuice 6y ago
      I am not concerned about the effort of installing Ubuntu. I prefer to not pay the extra money for Windows, however little it might be. I already have other Windows computers.
      - offtop5 6y ago
        Is this a moral argument, it would cost you more to find a specific Linux laptop in most cases.
    - eli 6y ago
      It definitely works with Ubuntu
systemvoltage 6y ago
You can buy Intel NUC that does way more than wimpy RPI. Remember, RPI is not opensource which is how most people see them as - aka, a feel good company. It is as proprietary as Intel in the critical areas (processor, sdk and bunch of binary blobs). RPI really doesn't belong in this type of a device you're describing.
- mixmastamyk 6y ago
  What would?
  - mPReDiToR 6y ago
    PinePhone. https://pine64.org https://pine64.org New batch due soon.
    - CrazyPyroLinux 6y ago
      Upvote for the interesting idea (fellow PinePhone user), but see my other comment - The RockPro64 (also from Pine64) is probably a better fit since it's a SBC with PCIe and thus the ability to plug in NVMe which the OP was asking for.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
- gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
  In my case being open source is a bonus - what I want is an on-premise modern linux environment that is economical to leave running 24/7, executes reasonably fast (including disk IO), and secure (auto update etc).
  - sgtnoodle 6y ago
    I solved that by buying a passively cooled baytrail nano-ITX motherboard 5 or so years ago, and running Arch linux on it. At the time, pis were way slower at disk IO and encryption/hashing. Maybe the pi 4 is fast enough now, but I suspect the baytrail is still holding up favorably.
stefan_ 6y ago
The joke with the Raspberry Pi is that it is 1) so cheap because its manufactured on an old silicon node but of course that implies 2) it actually uses a ton of power compared to a chip made in 7nm. From what I could find the RPi chips are made in 27nm, and while you can't exactly linearly extrapolate from that, I wouldn't be surprised to find that a 7nm smartphone chip can get you the same performance as the RPi at 1/3rd the power consumption.
- kingosticks 6y ago
  Rpi 4 is 28nm, earlier models are 40nm. https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-4-on-sale-now-from-35/ https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-4-on-sale-now-...
m463 6y ago
Just get a low-end intel box that is not a nuc. It doesn't have to be a nuc, try one of the zotac fanless machines, which is low power because of thermals. I think once AMD spools up with 7nm we'll have machines like this with even lower power.
rasz 6y ago
ask friends/coworkers about laptops with cracked screens
blinkingled 6y ago
My Asus PN50 w/R7-4800U gets me 8C/16T for 10W, NVME SSD and SATA SSD - no noise most of the time, very faint fan noise under load. Even suspends / resumes well under Linux - coupled with Wake on Lan - it's close to Pi level power usage and acoustics.
- zokier 6y ago
  Costs fair bit more than $200 though?
  - blinkingled 6y ago
    You can get a 4C one for $329 w/o memory and disks - not cheap but I was merely trying to point out that x86 can do low power with great performance now a days.
nextos 6y ago
Intel NUCs are IMHO exceptionally nice and fit your requirements, with some little caveats. Besides, it's a much more powerful machine and it will be easier to run till ARM becomes more popular. With some tweaks, in my experience it can use 3-4 W, so it might be able to replace a Pi in some scenarios. You might go slightly over budget with an i3 (unless you shop for a deal). You need to install a NVMe yourself, as well as RAM. The i3 can be run in a silent mode, but there are some third party cases around which let you go fanless. I don't understand why Intel is not selling a fanless NUC with an i3 / m3. There's a lot of potential. Same for AMD.
- artificialLimbs 6y ago
  Make sure and keep some air duster around. After 4 years, we had some schizing out because of intake cake.
randomstring 6y ago
Why doesn't an Argon ONE M.2 Case not fit your requirements? https://www.argon40.com/argon-one-m-2-case-for-raspberry-pi-4.html https://www.argon40.com/argon-one-m-2-case-for-raspberry-pi-... Or is it about having it all pre-built and pre-installed?
- gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
  This case looks awesome! But yeah ideally it would be pre-built and pre-installed, with NVMe installed internally.
znpy 6y ago
Just buy a NUC. I just bought a nuc, 2nd hand off eBay, the CPU supposedly has a 5W TDP... Adding a disk (WD Green?) it's probably going to stay below 10W
- open-paren 6y ago
  I've been looking at NUCs recently, but I can't decide how much compute power I should aim for. What NUC did you buy?
  - Wohlf 6y ago
    I've tested plenty at work and don't really have any complaints with any of them, worst case they will perform as well as an equivalent laptop and usually better due to more thermal headroom. If you're optimizing for price and power consumption get an older SKU with an Atom, if you want more horsepower anything 10th gen with 4 cores will handle just about anything you can throw at it, and the idle power consumption is quite good too.
  - znpy 6y ago
    Intel NUC DE3815TYKE, Atom E3815, for about 50€ shipped. It's got a DDR3 ram slot and can host 8GB ram, along with a sata port and a slot for a 2.5" disk. It also has 4GB of on-board storage that I really don't care about. The processor is a single-core atom that clocks at about 1.4GHz with a TDP of about 5W. I don't really care much about speed for this machine because it will become a home vpn gateway running PFSense. The CPU has AES-NI instruction, and that's what convinced me to get it. My current vpn gateway is a Dell Optiplex FX160 which is still an atom and performs okay-ish, but has got no AES-NI and no internal storage beyond a dumb 2GB disk-on-module, on which pfsense barely fits and consumes about ~17 Watts powered on.
tinco 6y ago
Did you seriously just state that you'd pay $200 for $250 worth of parts? And you want someone to design and integrate them for you on top of that? edit: Ok sorry, apparently I miscalculated and it's actually possible to build this for less than $200.
- hobofan 6y ago
  How do you get to $250? 256GB NVMe runs for about $50 and a PI 8GB + peripherals for ~$100.
- satysin 6y ago
  How did you get to $250 worth of parts? 8GB Pi4 is $75 256GB NVMe M.2 SSD is ~$40 cases with a fan are ~$25 power supply is like $10 but let's say $20 That brings us to $160 give or take. Where is the extra $90 going? I think $200 is doable with a healthy profit margin.
  - tinco 6y ago
    Woops, for some reason my first google result for the SSD was wildly overpriced.
numpad0 6y ago
> low-power > NVMe pick one
- fomine3 6y ago
  But iPhone uses NVMe so theoretically both.
randy408 6y ago
The RPi 400 only has 4GB but the board is integrated into a keyboard with a power button and a big heatsink, if you go for a (m)SATA SSD + USB3 adapter you still have a second USB3 port, those things can easily push 300MB/s with UASP, the official power supply should be enough in this case.
CrazyPyroLinux 6y ago
I've never been very moved by the pi line for "non-maker" "server-type" stuff. Personally, I run a 4GB RockPro64 [0] in the NAS case [1]. Add a heatsink [2] and a beefier 5A power supply [3] just in case I ever want to add spinning drives. But for now I just use an NVMe adapter [4]. That's $148 total. For $15 you can add Bluetooth and Wifi [5] if you really want. Instead I chose to treat myself to $21-$40 worth of eMMC5 storage for the OS [6]. [0] $80 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-4gb-single-board-computer/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-4gb-single-board-comput... [1] $45 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-metal-desktop-nas-casing/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-metal-desktop-nas-casin... [2] $4 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-30mm-tall-profile-heatsink/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-30mm-tall-profile-heats... [3] $13 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-12v-5a-us-power-supply/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-12v-5a-us-power-supply/... [4] $6 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-pci-e-x4-to-m-2-ngff-nvme-ssd-interface-card/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-pci-e-x4-to-m-2-ngff-nv... [5] $15 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-1x1-dual-band-wifi-802-11ac-bluetooth-5-0-module/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-1x1-dual-band-wifi-802-... [6] https://pine64.com/product/16gb-emmc-module/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/16gb-emmc-module/?v=0446c16e2e66
- gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
  Wow this is eye opening. I appreciate the links, I will look into this!
- jjoonathan 6y ago
  > I've never been very moved by the pi line for "non-maker" "server-type" stuff. I love raspberry pis but pi-mania is absolutely out of control. I can't count how many $100+ programmer hours I have seen wasted waiting for a $10 pi to boot, build, or generally stop being slow. I have witnessed the deep shame of a multi-million dollar exhibition center-featuring a RPi kiosk deployed in front of customers that chugs so hard the sales team takes shifts intercepting people before they can poke at it and realize how much of a dog it is. But at least they saved $200 on not using a laptop, right? If you want to dip your toes in the hardware world from the comfort of ubuntu at impulse buy prices, pis are great, but they stop making sense very quickly once you exit that specialized vertical.
derefr 6y ago
Aren’t most NASes ARM-based? While they don’t usually support NVMe, they do support SATA SSDs (which would max out at the same speed the Pi’s single-PCIe-lane NVMe gets you.) Usually NASes are thought of as not too power efficient; but that’s because of the HDDs in them. Remove the spinning rust, remove the problem.
- btgeekboy 6y ago
  Agree. Lots of Synology/QNAP devices out there that are designed to be a NAS in form factor but also support things like VMs, containers, and the like. Some of them even do support NVM.
- Wohlf 6y ago
  Depends, most I've seen are low power Intel but the power consumption should be roughly the same.
  - geerlingguy 6y ago
    I've been testing an Asustor (latest gen) vs Pi NAS and all-in they use almost identical power at idle and at full tilt (drives included). Surprised me since the NAS is running an Intel processor.
Black101 6y ago
Those are pretty nice: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-4000-powered-asus-mini-pc-challenges-intels-nuc https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-4000-powered-asu...
rancor 6y ago
Look into Serve The Home's Project TinyMiniMicro: https://www.servethehome.com/introducing-project-tinyminimicro-home-lab-revolution/ https://www.servethehome.com/introducing-project-tinyminimic... If you're not too picky about specs, eBay will give you one of these nodes for around $200, although you might have to supply the NVMe.
_ph_ 6y ago
Considering how oversized the M1 Mac Mini is, I wonder whether Apple could release a M1 based Mac Nano once they moved to the M2 for all their more expensive devices. Considering the low TDP of the M1, it could be considerably shrunken vs. the Mini and quit a bit less expensive. That would make an excellent server for many tasks.
- geerlingguy 6y ago
  I would buy at least one such nano and stash it as a Mac build and media server. I wish apple stuck a 2.5 Gbps port on it though.
paulgerhardt 6y ago
Use the NanoPi family for this. Specifically the M4V2 with heat sink case: https://www.cnx-software.com/2019/09/09/nanopi-m4-sbc-nvme-ssd-metal-case/ https://www.cnx-software.com/2019/09/09/nanopi-m4-sbc-nvme-s...
techrat 6y ago
I know you said it's too time consuming, but it took me less than 15 minutes to get mine up and running with the Argon40 case. Argon40 has a M.2 (SATA B and M keys) to USB 3 addon part as well. So if you have a Pi4 that has already been configured to boot from USB, this is a drop in part. I find that my Pi4 has trouble maxing out the USB3 and SATA M.2 SSD's throughput. NVMe seems like overkill. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WP8WC3V/ https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WP8WC3V/ - Argon ONE V2 Raspberry Pi 4 Case for the RasPi 4 https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MHYWJCP/ https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MHYWJCP/ - Argon ONE M.2 Raspberry Pi SSD Board What I like about this case is that the entire case acts like a heatsink for the CPU and Ram... and the internal daughterboard provides full size HDMI ports. IMNSHO, it's a no brainer if you already have a Pi... but even a NUC isn't a turnkey solution if you're set on Ubuntu. Still need to install that as well.
- gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
  I did not realize the Argon came with an SSD adapter. That is pretty compelling and affordable.
erulabs 6y ago
We're building https://pibox.io/ https://pibox.io/ - currently in testing!
gerdesj 6y ago
Perhaps an Odroid, eg: https://www.odroid.co.uk/ODROID-HC4 https://www.odroid.co.uk/ODROID-HC4
yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago
I'll tack on one more wish, if we're building a NUC-like: Ship with an SD card in it that contains only the Pi boot blobs and a build of the edk2 firmware so that the system boots to UEFI and then acts like a normal computer that can boot standard OS images and not need special images with the Pi's insane boot sequence programmed into them.
axiolite 6y ago
> I want to leave this on 24/7 and run various cron jobs etc, so I want the low-power ARM chip. You can find Atoms and Celerons (e.g. N3060) just as low power (5W). Plenty of such low-power mini PCs are available. Ones with 128GB are well within your price range... here's just one for $158: https://amazon.com/dp/B08T71WXL3 https://amazon.com/dp/B08T71WXL3 Or you can go with one of the few which include M.2 slots... I have a couple, myself. Amazon and Minisforum are good places to start.
rgomez 6y ago
I bought an enclosure and related cards from Geekworm [1] some time ago, it's not using a NVMe, instead a 1TB SSD HD. Works like a charm. [1] https://geekworm.com/collections/raspberry-pi/products/raspberry-pi-4b-x825-matching-metal-case-power-switch-cooling-fan https://geekworm.com/collections/raspberry-pi/products/raspb...
brainzap 6y ago
You also want a RTC so it keeps the time. I guess intel nuc owns this market at the moment.

TaylorAlexander 6y ago

Just need a case for the Tofu: https://youtu.be/m-QSQ24_8LY https://youtu.be/m-QSQ24_8LY Idk about Ubuntu though. Raspberry Pi OS is based off of Debian and optimized for the pi. Edit: Ah I was unfamiliar but of course there is an Ubuntu release for the pi. https://ubuntu.com/download/raspberry-pi https://ubuntu.com/download/raspberry-pi Edit2: Ah I jumped straight to the Tofu board but I didn’t see that TFA features another nice board for this purpose.

gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
In my experience Rasbian packages are very old, makes certain dev tasks harder.
- TaylorAlexander 6y ago
  Yep that’s fair. I had that trouble with Debian on my own systems and I tend to use Ubuntu on them now.

gambiting 6y ago

>>Because I want to leave this on 24/7 and run various cron jobs etc, so I want the low-power ARM chip. But the Pi4 can use as much as 15W, it has left the realm of "low powered" devices long time ago. I have a very old(2013) HP workstation that I use as a NAS, with a 2nd gen i5, and when running it uses 20W of power, measured by myself.

bredren 6y ago
The author discusses power requirements / power supply considerations of pi 4 + nvme at 6:44: https://youtu.be/4Womn10v71s https://youtu.be/4Womn10v71s
syntaxing 6y ago
Hmm that's really really surprising if thats the case. According to the spec sheet [1], its TDP is 95W. RAM itself is 3W each, the cooling fans is easily 5W, the CPU cooling fan should be another 10W-20W. Would love to learn the configuration that gives you 20W power usage total. To put into perspective, my mac M1 uses 20Wish normally for regular usage. [1] https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/52207/intel-core-i5-2400-processor-6m-cache-up-to-3-40-ghz.html https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/52207/i...
- WrtCdEvrydy 6y ago
  > its TDP is 95W So AMD and Intel measure TDP differently because obviously they do. Intel's TDP is based on the max the CPU can generate while AMD is based on what an average user would encounter.
  - wtallis 6y ago
    Intel's TDP is more based on the max the CPU would draw, when all the various Turbo modes are disabled. Which reflects approximately zero real-world deployments except for the very low-end parts where Intel disables the Turbo modes for product segmentation.
  - reitzensteinm 6y ago
    You've got it the wrong way around there. AMD is much more conservative. https://www.extremetech.com/computing/319402-intels-desktop-tdps-no-longer-useful-to-predict-cpu-power-consumption https://www.extremetech.com/computing/319402-intels-desktop-... "It’s easy to see why Intel hasn’t changed the way it defines or communicates TDP to its customers: It would make the company’s high end look vastly worse compared with AMD. A Core i9-10850K will draw up to 265W. If you want an AMD CPU with that kind of power budget you have to buy a Threadripper."

corebuffer 6y ago

Have you considered recycling a thin client? This website gather specs on them and you can find used ones as low as 20 bucks on eBay. Many will draw 10-20 watts, like a Raspberry. https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t510/ https://www.parkytowers.me.uk/thin/hp/t510/

puzzlingcaptcha 6y ago
Both my HP t520 and Fujitsu Futro S720 idle at 6W (with the audio codec powered down), measured at the wall.
blacksmith_tb 6y ago
Or quite a few Chromeboxes can be wiped and run Linux (though it's worth doing a little homework, some at least need to be popped open to have their dev-mode screw pulled like this[1]). Certainly options for less than $100 on eBay. 1: https://dareneiri.github.io/Asus-Chromebox-With-Full-Linux-Install/ https://dareneiri.github.io/Asus-Chromebox-With-Full-Linux-I...

eli 6y ago

For a similar use case I ended up with a Lenovo "nano" desktop. The IoT models are designed to be run continuously and, uh, it runs Windows too which I guess is a bonus. $300+ on sale.

sigjuice 6y ago
These look really cool. Unfortunately, I can't seem to configure one without Windows.
- offtop5 6y ago
  It should be a nominal task to install Ubuntu on top of it, worst comes to worse it doesn't work and you send it back to Best buy.
  - sigjuice 6y ago
    I am not concerned about the effort of installing Ubuntu. I prefer to not pay the extra money for Windows, however little it might be. I already have other Windows computers.
    - offtop5 6y ago
      Is this a moral argument, it would cost you more to find a specific Linux laptop in most cases.
  - eli 6y ago
    It definitely works with Ubuntu

systemvoltage 6y ago

You can buy Intel NUC that does way more than wimpy RPI. Remember, RPI is not opensource which is how most people see them as - aka, a feel good company. It is as proprietary as Intel in the critical areas (processor, sdk and bunch of binary blobs). RPI really doesn't belong in this type of a device you're describing.

mixmastamyk 6y ago
What would?
- mPReDiToR 6y ago
  PinePhone. https://pine64.org https://pine64.org New batch due soon.
  - CrazyPyroLinux 6y ago
    Upvote for the interesting idea (fellow PinePhone user), but see my other comment - The RockPro64 (also from Pine64) is probably a better fit since it's a SBC with PCIe and thus the ability to plug in NVMe which the OP was asking for.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
In my case being open source is a bonus - what I want is an on-premise modern linux environment that is economical to leave running 24/7, executes reasonably fast (including disk IO), and secure (auto update etc).
- sgtnoodle 6y ago
  I solved that by buying a passively cooled baytrail nano-ITX motherboard 5 or so years ago, and running Arch linux on it. At the time, pis were way slower at disk IO and encryption/hashing. Maybe the pi 4 is fast enough now, but I suspect the baytrail is still holding up favorably.

stefan_ 6y ago

The joke with the Raspberry Pi is that it is 1) so cheap because its manufactured on an old silicon node but of course that implies 2) it actually uses a ton of power compared to a chip made in 7nm. From what I could find the RPi chips are made in 27nm, and while you can't exactly linearly extrapolate from that, I wouldn't be surprised to find that a 7nm smartphone chip can get you the same performance as the RPi at 1/3rd the power consumption.

kingosticks 6y ago
Rpi 4 is 28nm, earlier models are 40nm. https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-4-on-sale-now-from-35/ https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-4-on-sale-now-...

m463 6y ago

Just get a low-end intel box that is not a nuc. It doesn't have to be a nuc, try one of the zotac fanless machines, which is low power because of thermals. I think once AMD spools up with 7nm we'll have machines like this with even lower power.

rasz 6y ago

ask friends/coworkers about laptops with cracked screens

blinkingled 6y ago

My Asus PN50 w/R7-4800U gets me 8C/16T for 10W, NVME SSD and SATA SSD - no noise most of the time, very faint fan noise under load. Even suspends / resumes well under Linux - coupled with Wake on Lan - it's close to Pi level power usage and acoustics.

zokier 6y ago
Costs fair bit more than $200 though?
- blinkingled 6y ago
  You can get a 4C one for $329 w/o memory and disks - not cheap but I was merely trying to point out that x86 can do low power with great performance now a days.

nextos 6y ago

Intel NUCs are IMHO exceptionally nice and fit your requirements, with some little caveats. Besides, it's a much more powerful machine and it will be easier to run till ARM becomes more popular. With some tweaks, in my experience it can use 3-4 W, so it might be able to replace a Pi in some scenarios. You might go slightly over budget with an i3 (unless you shop for a deal). You need to install a NVMe yourself, as well as RAM. The i3 can be run in a silent mode, but there are some third party cases around which let you go fanless. I don't understand why Intel is not selling a fanless NUC with an i3 / m3. There's a lot of potential. Same for AMD.

artificialLimbs 6y ago
Make sure and keep some air duster around. After 4 years, we had some schizing out because of intake cake.

randomstring 6y ago

Why doesn't an Argon ONE M.2 Case not fit your requirements? https://www.argon40.com/argon-one-m-2-case-for-raspberry-pi-4.html https://www.argon40.com/argon-one-m-2-case-for-raspberry-pi-... Or is it about having it all pre-built and pre-installed?

gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
This case looks awesome! But yeah ideally it would be pre-built and pre-installed, with NVMe installed internally.

znpy 6y ago

Just buy a NUC. I just bought a nuc, 2nd hand off eBay, the CPU supposedly has a 5W TDP... Adding a disk (WD Green?) it's probably going to stay below 10W

open-paren 6y ago
I've been looking at NUCs recently, but I can't decide how much compute power I should aim for. What NUC did you buy?
- Wohlf 6y ago
  I've tested plenty at work and don't really have any complaints with any of them, worst case they will perform as well as an equivalent laptop and usually better due to more thermal headroom. If you're optimizing for price and power consumption get an older SKU with an Atom, if you want more horsepower anything 10th gen with 4 cores will handle just about anything you can throw at it, and the idle power consumption is quite good too.
- znpy 6y ago
  Intel NUC DE3815TYKE, Atom E3815, for about 50€ shipped. It's got a DDR3 ram slot and can host 8GB ram, along with a sata port and a slot for a 2.5" disk. It also has 4GB of on-board storage that I really don't care about. The processor is a single-core atom that clocks at about 1.4GHz with a TDP of about 5W. I don't really care much about speed for this machine because it will become a home vpn gateway running PFSense. The CPU has AES-NI instruction, and that's what convinced me to get it. My current vpn gateway is a Dell Optiplex FX160 which is still an atom and performs okay-ish, but has got no AES-NI and no internal storage beyond a dumb 2GB disk-on-module, on which pfsense barely fits and consumes about ~17 Watts powered on.

tinco 6y ago

Did you seriously just state that you'd pay $200 for $250 worth of parts? And you want someone to design and integrate them for you on top of that? edit: Ok sorry, apparently I miscalculated and it's actually possible to build this for less than $200.

hobofan 6y ago
How do you get to $250? 256GB NVMe runs for about $50 and a PI 8GB + peripherals for ~$100.
satysin 6y ago
How did you get to $250 worth of parts? 8GB Pi4 is $75 256GB NVMe M.2 SSD is ~$40 cases with a fan are ~$25 power supply is like $10 but let's say $20 That brings us to $160 give or take. Where is the extra $90 going? I think $200 is doable with a healthy profit margin.
- tinco 6y ago
  Woops, for some reason my first google result for the SSD was wildly overpriced.

numpad0 6y ago

> low-power > NVMe pick one

fomine3 6y ago
But iPhone uses NVMe so theoretically both.

randy408 6y ago

The RPi 400 only has 4GB but the board is integrated into a keyboard with a power button and a big heatsink, if you go for a (m)SATA SSD + USB3 adapter you still have a second USB3 port, those things can easily push 300MB/s with UASP, the official power supply should be enough in this case.

CrazyPyroLinux 6y ago

I've never been very moved by the pi line for "non-maker" "server-type" stuff. Personally, I run a 4GB RockPro64 [0] in the NAS case [1]. Add a heatsink [2] and a beefier 5A power supply [3] just in case I ever want to add spinning drives. But for now I just use an NVMe adapter [4]. That's $148 total. For $15 you can add Bluetooth and Wifi [5] if you really want. Instead I chose to treat myself to $21-$40 worth of eMMC5 storage for the OS [6]. [0] $80 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-4gb-single-board-computer/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-4gb-single-board-comput... [1] $45 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-metal-desktop-nas-casing/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-metal-desktop-nas-casin... [2] $4 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-30mm-tall-profile-heatsink/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-30mm-tall-profile-heats... [3] $13 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-12v-5a-us-power-supply/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-12v-5a-us-power-supply/... [4] $6 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-pci-e-x4-to-m-2-ngff-nvme-ssd-interface-card/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-pci-e-x4-to-m-2-ngff-nv... [5] $15 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-1x1-dual-band-wifi-802-11ac-bluetooth-5-0-module/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/rockpro64-1x1-dual-band-wifi-802-... [6] https://pine64.com/product/16gb-emmc-module/?v=0446c16e2e66 https://pine64.com/product/16gb-emmc-module/?v=0446c16e2e66

gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
Wow this is eye opening. I appreciate the links, I will look into this!
jjoonathan 6y ago
> I've never been very moved by the pi line for "non-maker" "server-type" stuff. I love raspberry pis but pi-mania is absolutely out of control. I can't count how many $100+ programmer hours I have seen wasted waiting for a $10 pi to boot, build, or generally stop being slow. I have witnessed the deep shame of a multi-million dollar exhibition center-featuring a RPi kiosk deployed in front of customers that chugs so hard the sales team takes shifts intercepting people before they can poke at it and realize how much of a dog it is. But at least they saved $200 on not using a laptop, right? If you want to dip your toes in the hardware world from the comfort of ubuntu at impulse buy prices, pis are great, but they stop making sense very quickly once you exit that specialized vertical.

derefr 6y ago

Aren’t most NASes ARM-based? While they don’t usually support NVMe, they do support SATA SSDs (which would max out at the same speed the Pi’s single-PCIe-lane NVMe gets you.) Usually NASes are thought of as not too power efficient; but that’s because of the HDDs in them. Remove the spinning rust, remove the problem.

btgeekboy 6y ago
Agree. Lots of Synology/QNAP devices out there that are designed to be a NAS in form factor but also support things like VMs, containers, and the like. Some of them even do support NVM.
Wohlf 6y ago
Depends, most I've seen are low power Intel but the power consumption should be roughly the same.
- geerlingguy 6y ago
  I've been testing an Asustor (latest gen) vs Pi NAS and all-in they use almost identical power at idle and at full tilt (drives included). Surprised me since the NAS is running an Intel processor.

Black101 6y ago

Those are pretty nice: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-4000-powered-asus-mini-pc-challenges-intels-nuc https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-4000-powered-asu...

rancor 6y ago

Look into Serve The Home's Project TinyMiniMicro: https://www.servethehome.com/introducing-project-tinyminimicro-home-lab-revolution/ https://www.servethehome.com/introducing-project-tinyminimic... If you're not too picky about specs, eBay will give you one of these nodes for around $200, although you might have to supply the NVMe.

_ph_ 6y ago

Considering how oversized the M1 Mac Mini is, I wonder whether Apple could release a M1 based Mac Nano once they moved to the M2 for all their more expensive devices. Considering the low TDP of the M1, it could be considerably shrunken vs. the Mini and quit a bit less expensive. That would make an excellent server for many tasks.

geerlingguy 6y ago
I would buy at least one such nano and stash it as a Mac build and media server. I wish apple stuck a 2.5 Gbps port on it though.

paulgerhardt 6y ago

Use the NanoPi family for this. Specifically the M4V2 with heat sink case: https://www.cnx-software.com/2019/09/09/nanopi-m4-sbc-nvme-ssd-metal-case/ https://www.cnx-software.com/2019/09/09/nanopi-m4-sbc-nvme-s...

techrat 6y ago

I know you said it's too time consuming, but it took me less than 15 minutes to get mine up and running with the Argon40 case. Argon40 has a M.2 (SATA B and M keys) to USB 3 addon part as well. So if you have a Pi4 that has already been configured to boot from USB, this is a drop in part. I find that my Pi4 has trouble maxing out the USB3 and SATA M.2 SSD's throughput. NVMe seems like overkill. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WP8WC3V/ https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07WP8WC3V/ - Argon ONE V2 Raspberry Pi 4 Case for the RasPi 4 https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MHYWJCP/ https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B08MHYWJCP/ - Argon ONE M.2 Raspberry Pi SSD Board What I like about this case is that the entire case acts like a heatsink for the CPU and Ram... and the internal daughterboard provides full size HDMI ports. IMNSHO, it's a no brainer if you already have a Pi... but even a NUC isn't a turnkey solution if you're set on Ubuntu. Still need to install that as well.

gkfasdfasdf 6y ago
I did not realize the Argon came with an SSD adapter. That is pretty compelling and affordable.

erulabs 6y ago

We're building https://pibox.io/ https://pibox.io/ - currently in testing!

gerdesj 6y ago

Perhaps an Odroid, eg: https://www.odroid.co.uk/ODROID-HC4 https://www.odroid.co.uk/ODROID-HC4

yjftsjthsd-h 6y ago

I'll tack on one more wish, if we're building a NUC-like: Ship with an SD card in it that contains only the Pi boot blobs and a build of the edk2 firmware so that the system boots to UEFI and then acts like a normal computer that can boot standard OS images and not need special images with the Pi's insane boot sequence programmed into them.

axiolite 6y ago

> I want to leave this on 24/7 and run various cron jobs etc, so I want the low-power ARM chip. You can find Atoms and Celerons (e.g. N3060) just as low power (5W). Plenty of such low-power mini PCs are available. Ones with 128GB are well within your price range... here's just one for $158: https://amazon.com/dp/B08T71WXL3 https://amazon.com/dp/B08T71WXL3 Or you can go with one of the few which include M.2 slots... I have a couple, myself. Amazon and Minisforum are good places to start.

rgomez 6y ago

I bought an enclosure and related cards from Geekworm [1] some time ago, it's not using a NVMe, instead a 1TB SSD HD. Works like a charm. [1] https://geekworm.com/collections/raspberry-pi/products/raspberry-pi-4b-x825-matching-metal-case-power-switch-cooling-fan https://geekworm.com/collections/raspberry-pi/products/raspb...

brainzap 6y ago

You also want a RTC so it keeps the time. I guess intel nuc owns this market at the moment.