4 ms·

The EU has been beyond useless during the whole covid-19 pandemic. I find it pretty disappointing since with quicker action and common rules we could be in a mu

The EU has been beyond useless during the whole covid-19 pandemic. I find it pretty disappointing since with quicker action and common rules we could be in a much better place right now. I think it is silly that EU citizens are dying and/or locked down because of money and/or contracts.

baq 6y ago
It’s been useless because it doesn’t have governance over pandemic response. It’s up to the member states. Member states have been mostly useless, yes.
- thitcanh 6y ago
  With the exception of the newly-departed UK, has there been any EU state(s) that performed consistently better than others? The UK is doing better with vaccines, but yeah, it didn't do any better during the pandemic.
  - ArkanExplorer 6y ago
    Yes, Sweden - which remained basically open for business, with only some closures to senior schools, no masks, no hospital overloading, and no lockdowns. Sweden has a lower per-capita COVID deathtoll than Czechia, Belgium, Slovenia, UK, Hungary, Bosnia, Italy, Bulgaria, Moldova, Macedonia, Slovakia, USA, Portgual, Spain, Croatia, France, Poland. Its 2020 deaths were only 5.75% higher than its 2018 deaths: https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-deaths/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-... And even then can mainly be explained by a weak 2019 flu season (with deaths in 2019 3.6% below 2018) and potentially lower deaths in 2021 due to mortality displacement. By contrast, Germany, with extensive and rolling lockdowns, had deaths 3.2% higher than 2018: https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bevoelkerung/Sterbefaelle-Lebenserwartung/Tabellen/sonderauswertung-sterbefaelle.html?nn=23768 https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bevoel... So a superficial analysis would suggest that society-wide lockdowns could have saved a country like Sweden 2.55% of deaths, or 2,486 people. So you would be locking down 4,115 people in order to save one of them from dying of COVID, beyond what could be achieved from softer or voluntary measures.
    - krzyk 6y ago
      Poland has slightly slower deaths per capita then Sweden, so if that point is not valid I don't know if any other of your points are. And although Sweden didn't do lockdowns, almost every corp sent their workers to WFH, and other people reduced their outgoings. I have a friend in Sweden who has a shop and he complained that he has never seen so few people on streets and in his shop. So Sweden had unofficial lockdowns.
      - ArkanExplorer 6y ago
        https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deat... 1,300 deaths per million in Poland, 1,289 deaths per million in Sweden. The point is that mandatory government lockdowns are unnecessary and destructive, the population will adjust their behavior themselves.
- brundolf 6y ago
  Sounds a lot like the snafu the U.S. had around testing, precautions, etc: everything was left up to the member states. I'm not sure why the vaccine rollout has been different; maybe because the purchasing and at least part of the distribution was centralized?
  - Philadelphia 6y ago
    Because the US doesn’t actually operate like that; it was just Trump being stupid and evil. Now that we have a president who’s not a vindictive moron, we’re functioning properly.

baq 6y ago

It’s been useless because it doesn’t have governance over pandemic response. It’s up to the member states. Member states have been mostly useless, yes.

thitcanh 6y ago
With the exception of the newly-departed UK, has there been any EU state(s) that performed consistently better than others? The UK is doing better with vaccines, but yeah, it didn't do any better during the pandemic.
- ArkanExplorer 6y ago
  Yes, Sweden - which remained basically open for business, with only some closures to senior schools, no masks, no hospital overloading, and no lockdowns. Sweden has a lower per-capita COVID deathtoll than Czechia, Belgium, Slovenia, UK, Hungary, Bosnia, Italy, Bulgaria, Moldova, Macedonia, Slovakia, USA, Portgual, Spain, Croatia, France, Poland. Its 2020 deaths were only 5.75% higher than its 2018 deaths: https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-deaths/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/525353/sweden-number-of-... And even then can mainly be explained by a weak 2019 flu season (with deaths in 2019 3.6% below 2018) and potentially lower deaths in 2021 due to mortality displacement. By contrast, Germany, with extensive and rolling lockdowns, had deaths 3.2% higher than 2018: https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bevoelkerung/Sterbefaelle-Lebenserwartung/Tabellen/sonderauswertung-sterbefaelle.html?nn=23768 https://www.destatis.de/DE/Themen/Gesellschaft-Umwelt/Bevoel... So a superficial analysis would suggest that society-wide lockdowns could have saved a country like Sweden 2.55% of deaths, or 2,486 people. So you would be locking down 4,115 people in order to save one of them from dying of COVID, beyond what could be achieved from softer or voluntary measures.
  - krzyk 6y ago
    Poland has slightly slower deaths per capita then Sweden, so if that point is not valid I don't know if any other of your points are. And although Sweden didn't do lockdowns, almost every corp sent their workers to WFH, and other people reduced their outgoings. I have a friend in Sweden who has a shop and he complained that he has never seen so few people on streets and in his shop. So Sweden had unofficial lockdowns.
    - ArkanExplorer 6y ago
      https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deaths-worldwide-per-million-inhabitants/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1104709/coronavirus-deat... 1,300 deaths per million in Poland, 1,289 deaths per million in Sweden. The point is that mandatory government lockdowns are unnecessary and destructive, the population will adjust their behavior themselves.
brundolf 6y ago
Sounds a lot like the snafu the U.S. had around testing, precautions, etc: everything was left up to the member states. I'm not sure why the vaccine rollout has been different; maybe because the purchasing and at least part of the distribution was centralized?
- Philadelphia 6y ago
  Because the US doesn’t actually operate like that; it was just Trump being stupid and evil. Now that we have a president who’s not a vindictive moron, we’re functioning properly.