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Most of Europe was much slower to approve vaccines than the US and UK. Because of that, I've assumed since the first approvals in December that Europe would lag

Most of Europe was much slower to approve vaccines than the US and UK. Because of that, I've assumed since the first approvals in December that Europe would lag. Once the US, UK and others said "hey, we're ready to buy all the vaccines, send us what you'e got", what did we expect would happen? I don't know why Europe lagged on the approvals, but it seems obvious that would also lead to a lag in rollout.

dundarious 6y ago
I find the information in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26544947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26544947 credible, and they indicate that approval is not the major issue. Instead, the EU's contracts with the pharma companies cannot be met, because the US and UK legislated/contracted to bind local production to local use, with the UK even specifically requiring/strongly encouraging Oxford to use a UK pharma company (instead of a US one) in order to ensure they could bind local production to local use.
- manmal 6y ago
  Exactly. We in the EU are supply limited. In Austria, the first Pfizer shot was given before Christmas, and we are still at only 4% fully immunized (12% got at least one shot). We are even continuing to vaccinate while other countries have stopped AZ because of the recently reported potential issues - still doesn’t move the needle much.
derriz 6y ago
The FDA has yet to approve AstraZeneca's vaccine while the EU approved it back in January. The US has a stockpile of 40million doses which are not being used until approval arrives while European vaccination rates are limited by vaccine supply. Approval speed has nothing to do with it.
- tabtab 6y ago
  The US should allow AstraZeneca to be used on volunteers in other nations, as long as it's not under coercion. The possible blot-clot issue is small, if any. Thus, volunteers is a decent compromise, rather than let it sit in storage.
  - bobbylarrybobby 6y ago
    The US is currently shipping AZ to Canada and Mexico
  - pkaye 6y ago
    The US trial results just came out and it looks good. They will submit it for review to the FDA soon.
- readittwice 6y ago
  I agree with that. However, Martin Selmayr (Secretary-General of the European Commission) recently explained on TV that the slower approval was the reason that the EU is lagging behind the US in vaccations. Well, obviously that slower approval was for "more safety" according to him. That explanation doesn't make a whole lot of sense since the delay was only a few weeks for Biontech/Pfizer or Moderna. As you mentioned, AZ is not even approved in the US. Europe would need to vaccinate around 50M people in a few weeks. EU politicans know that the EU has failed at procurement. They now try to cover that up by blaming AZ and explaining delays with additional safety measures.
  - pvitz 6y ago
    Selmayr hasn't been the Secretary-General of COM for two years.
    - readittwice 6y ago
      Oh right, that's true. Sorry. He is now still a European civil servant though. In my defense, I quickly googled his name and that's what popped out first. On TV was announced as "spokesperson of the European Commission", so I thought that was his official job title.
mytailorisrich 6y ago
The UK (and the US) used emergency provisions to grant temporary approvals early. The EU pretty much followed the normal procedure but with an accelerated schedule. The EU branded the UK's emergency approval "reckless".
raducu 6y ago
Please, stop with this bullshit. The USA and UK are not exporting any vaccines, the EU is exporting vaccines, the EU is the good guy here, the EU has every right to ban vaccines exports like the USA, but it doesn't do that. That's the bottom line, not some obscure contract bullshit. Contracts don't matter if a soverign entity like the USA ban vaccine exportations. Do you think we're all dumb and can fool us not to recognize a sparrow when we see one? History will judge fat americans rushing to the lifeboats before foreign "women and children", it's disgusting and should be ashamed of yourself.
- kitd 6y ago
  Just FYI, the UK exports components of the Pfizer vaccine to the EU. It's way more nuanced than you paint it.
  - libertine 6y ago
    I don't get this argument. There are countries all over the globe exporting components for vaccines. Canada, all over Europe, it's a global chain.
    - kitd 6y ago
      Exactly. Just pointing the finger at one party misses the point of a global supply chain.
  - manmal 6y ago
    It’s about the end product though, isn’t it? Some things are really simple.
- dang 6y ago
  Ouch, you can't post like this here. Name calling, personal attack, and nationalistic flamewar will get you banned, regardless of how bad a situation is or you feel it is. Please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules from now on.
mahkeiro 6y ago
Really AZ vaccine is not even approved in the USA...

dundarious 6y ago

I find the information in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26544947 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26544947 credible, and they indicate that approval is not the major issue. Instead, the EU's contracts with the pharma companies cannot be met, because the US and UK legislated/contracted to bind local production to local use, with the UK even specifically requiring/strongly encouraging Oxford to use a UK pharma company (instead of a US one) in order to ensure they could bind local production to local use.

manmal 6y ago
Exactly. We in the EU are supply limited. In Austria, the first Pfizer shot was given before Christmas, and we are still at only 4% fully immunized (12% got at least one shot). We are even continuing to vaccinate while other countries have stopped AZ because of the recently reported potential issues - still doesn’t move the needle much.

derriz 6y ago

The FDA has yet to approve AstraZeneca's vaccine while the EU approved it back in January. The US has a stockpile of 40million doses which are not being used until approval arrives while European vaccination rates are limited by vaccine supply. Approval speed has nothing to do with it.

tabtab 6y ago
The US should allow AstraZeneca to be used on volunteers in other nations, as long as it's not under coercion. The possible blot-clot issue is small, if any. Thus, volunteers is a decent compromise, rather than let it sit in storage.
- bobbylarrybobby 6y ago
  The US is currently shipping AZ to Canada and Mexico
- pkaye 6y ago
  The US trial results just came out and it looks good. They will submit it for review to the FDA soon.
readittwice 6y ago
I agree with that. However, Martin Selmayr (Secretary-General of the European Commission) recently explained on TV that the slower approval was the reason that the EU is lagging behind the US in vaccations. Well, obviously that slower approval was for "more safety" according to him. That explanation doesn't make a whole lot of sense since the delay was only a few weeks for Biontech/Pfizer or Moderna. As you mentioned, AZ is not even approved in the US. Europe would need to vaccinate around 50M people in a few weeks. EU politicans know that the EU has failed at procurement. They now try to cover that up by blaming AZ and explaining delays with additional safety measures.
- pvitz 6y ago
  Selmayr hasn't been the Secretary-General of COM for two years.
  - readittwice 6y ago
    Oh right, that's true. Sorry. He is now still a European civil servant though. In my defense, I quickly googled his name and that's what popped out first. On TV was announced as "spokesperson of the European Commission", so I thought that was his official job title.

mytailorisrich 6y ago

The UK (and the US) used emergency provisions to grant temporary approvals early. The EU pretty much followed the normal procedure but with an accelerated schedule. The EU branded the UK's emergency approval "reckless".

raducu 6y ago

Please, stop with this bullshit. The USA and UK are not exporting any vaccines, the EU is exporting vaccines, the EU is the good guy here, the EU has every right to ban vaccines exports like the USA, but it doesn't do that. That's the bottom line, not some obscure contract bullshit. Contracts don't matter if a soverign entity like the USA ban vaccine exportations. Do you think we're all dumb and can fool us not to recognize a sparrow when we see one? History will judge fat americans rushing to the lifeboats before foreign "women and children", it's disgusting and should be ashamed of yourself.

kitd 6y ago
Just FYI, the UK exports components of the Pfizer vaccine to the EU. It's way more nuanced than you paint it.
- libertine 6y ago
  I don't get this argument. There are countries all over the globe exporting components for vaccines. Canada, all over Europe, it's a global chain.
  - kitd 6y ago
    Exactly. Just pointing the finger at one party misses the point of a global supply chain.
- manmal 6y ago
  It’s about the end product though, isn’t it? Some things are really simple.
dang 6y ago
Ouch, you can't post like this here. Name calling, personal attack, and nationalistic flamewar will get you banned, regardless of how bad a situation is or you feel it is. Please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules from now on.

mahkeiro 6y ago

Really AZ vaccine is not even approved in the USA...