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Everyone has a credit score that can go down. (Is there a floor?) A record of a rent lawsuit is no good for anyone. I often wonder how people on the verge of ev

Everyone has a credit score that can go down. (Is there a floor?) A record of a rent lawsuit is no good for anyone. I often wonder how people on the verge of eviction think about this kind of thing — whether it is salient or even understandable.

klyrs 6y ago
I've lived most of my life without a credit card, never leased a car, never gave owning property much thought. Got some student loans when I was young, but that's about it for my credit history. This is all a result of me living responsibly within my means. Rental referrals are just about the only leverage that an ex-landlord would really have over me. You can duck collections pretty much forever if you don't need credit
- thephyber 6y ago
  Weird flex. People who aren’t paying rent after the pandemic started likely aren’t doing it for fun. Most likely they are underemployed, hence collections will stack up. “Living within your means” assumes it is even possible to find employment and a handful of life/medical/mental/family stability that not everyone has. You seem to underestimate how much of modern life in the USA depends on credit. Electric, water, telephone, internet service require credit or suffer the costs and inconveniences of prepayment. Rental housing almost always requires credit checks in any desirable market. You also seem to assume that collections can never be converted into a lean on your assets or garnishment of your wages. And that doesn’t even begin to crack the strange and painful tactics debt collectors use on your family, employment, friends, and other social pressures.
- ehavener 6y ago
  You're effectively paying a 1-5% tax on everything by not using a credit card.
- filoleg 6y ago
  > I've lived most of my life without a credit card > This is all a result of me living responsibly within my means. Implying that not using credit cards is how one lives responsibly within their means is kinda weird and wrong. Yes, you can live irresponsibly with a credit card. You can also live responsibly with it too. And it will give you extra consumer purchase protection (in case of a fraud or a bad fair vendor), as well as 1-5% return on purchases. Some would argue that missing out on that 1-5% return and extra consumer protections is the irresponsible move. But either way, the whole "using credit cards means living irresponsibly and outside of their means" is absolutely nothing but a complete lack of understanding of how credit works.
  - klyrs 6y ago
    Yep, children of poverty are less fiscally literate and exhibit different cost-benefit analysis than folks raised in relative privilege. In my brief experience with credit cards, whatever 1-5% opportunity cost you think I'm paying is overwhelmed by the 20% interest rate if I forget to pay the bill. The preceeding is a statement about most of my life. I've gotten better at such stuff and my lifestyle has changed after grad school -- and since I didn't have credit cards while living below the poverty line and generally being a schlub, I didn't fuck up my credit, so a few months of having a credit card as a de facto adult earned me a near-perfect credit score when I needed it.
    - filoleg 6y ago
      I get that financial literacy is an issue in underprivileged and low-income groups. But it doesn't take much brainpower or financial knowledge to treat your credit card like your debit card and not spend more than you have in your checking account. Functionally, a credit card would work exactly like your debit card or cash, except you would also be reaping all the benefits of credit cards and improved credit scores. But overall, I agree with your point about cost-benefit analysis and impulse control being difficult to overcome.
      - klyrs 6y ago
        Anyway, my original comment responded to > I often wonder how people on the verge of eviction think about this kind of thing — whether it is salient or even understandable My answer is that people in those situations think about these things very differently than people who have never encountered them. Or, flip it -- if dings on your credit score are the worst speedbump that society has thrown in your path, you probably don't have the skills necessary to live broke. I didn't come for financial advice, but thanks
deleted 6y ago
[deleted]
datavirtue 6y ago
They will just pass a law that allows it to be removed or excluded from credit reports. Or the banks+credit agencies will collude to do it when it starts dipping too hard into credit card applications. #medicalbills
blaser-waffle 6y ago
There is an entire segment of the population that will never have good credit and probably never will. Punishing them via credit score isn't going to do anything. It won't get you your money back, and it'll just ensure we have a perpetual underclass to keep this cycle going. > I often wonder how people on the verge of eviction think about this kind of thing — whether it is salient or even understandable. If they're on the verge of eviction they're probably more worried about keeping heat, water, or food going. Landlords are an abstraction if your kid hasn't eaten in 2 days.
filoleg 6y ago
>Everyone has a credit score that can go down Sure, but the issue is that the suing party isn't getting anything out of it. You sue for damages, the defendant has nothing, so their credit score goes down. That's fine, they get punished+the credit score decrease helps future landlords avoid the same situation with that tenant. But as a suing party, you get literally nothing out of it. The defendant's credit score going down doesn't help you personally one bit, you get no restitution or compensation.

klyrs 6y ago

I've lived most of my life without a credit card, never leased a car, never gave owning property much thought. Got some student loans when I was young, but that's about it for my credit history. This is all a result of me living responsibly within my means. Rental referrals are just about the only leverage that an ex-landlord would really have over me. You can duck collections pretty much forever if you don't need credit

thephyber 6y ago
Weird flex. People who aren’t paying rent after the pandemic started likely aren’t doing it for fun. Most likely they are underemployed, hence collections will stack up. “Living within your means” assumes it is even possible to find employment and a handful of life/medical/mental/family stability that not everyone has. You seem to underestimate how much of modern life in the USA depends on credit. Electric, water, telephone, internet service require credit or suffer the costs and inconveniences of prepayment. Rental housing almost always requires credit checks in any desirable market. You also seem to assume that collections can never be converted into a lean on your assets or garnishment of your wages. And that doesn’t even begin to crack the strange and painful tactics debt collectors use on your family, employment, friends, and other social pressures.
ehavener 6y ago
You're effectively paying a 1-5% tax on everything by not using a credit card.
filoleg 6y ago
> I've lived most of my life without a credit card > This is all a result of me living responsibly within my means. Implying that not using credit cards is how one lives responsibly within their means is kinda weird and wrong. Yes, you can live irresponsibly with a credit card. You can also live responsibly with it too. And it will give you extra consumer purchase protection (in case of a fraud or a bad fair vendor), as well as 1-5% return on purchases. Some would argue that missing out on that 1-5% return and extra consumer protections is the irresponsible move. But either way, the whole "using credit cards means living irresponsibly and outside of their means" is absolutely nothing but a complete lack of understanding of how credit works.
- klyrs 6y ago
  Yep, children of poverty are less fiscally literate and exhibit different cost-benefit analysis than folks raised in relative privilege. In my brief experience with credit cards, whatever 1-5% opportunity cost you think I'm paying is overwhelmed by the 20% interest rate if I forget to pay the bill. The preceeding is a statement about most of my life. I've gotten better at such stuff and my lifestyle has changed after grad school -- and since I didn't have credit cards while living below the poverty line and generally being a schlub, I didn't fuck up my credit, so a few months of having a credit card as a de facto adult earned me a near-perfect credit score when I needed it.
  - filoleg 6y ago
    I get that financial literacy is an issue in underprivileged and low-income groups. But it doesn't take much brainpower or financial knowledge to treat your credit card like your debit card and not spend more than you have in your checking account. Functionally, a credit card would work exactly like your debit card or cash, except you would also be reaping all the benefits of credit cards and improved credit scores. But overall, I agree with your point about cost-benefit analysis and impulse control being difficult to overcome.
    - klyrs 6y ago
      Anyway, my original comment responded to > I often wonder how people on the verge of eviction think about this kind of thing — whether it is salient or even understandable My answer is that people in those situations think about these things very differently than people who have never encountered them. Or, flip it -- if dings on your credit score are the worst speedbump that society has thrown in your path, you probably don't have the skills necessary to live broke. I didn't come for financial advice, but thanks

deleted 6y ago

[deleted]

datavirtue 6y ago

They will just pass a law that allows it to be removed or excluded from credit reports. Or the banks+credit agencies will collude to do it when it starts dipping too hard into credit card applications. #medicalbills

blaser-waffle 6y ago

There is an entire segment of the population that will never have good credit and probably never will. Punishing them via credit score isn't going to do anything. It won't get you your money back, and it'll just ensure we have a perpetual underclass to keep this cycle going. > I often wonder how people on the verge of eviction think about this kind of thing — whether it is salient or even understandable. If they're on the verge of eviction they're probably more worried about keeping heat, water, or food going. Landlords are an abstraction if your kid hasn't eaten in 2 days.

filoleg 6y ago

>Everyone has a credit score that can go down Sure, but the issue is that the suing party isn't getting anything out of it. You sue for damages, the defendant has nothing, so their credit score goes down. That's fine, they get punished+the credit score decrease helps future landlords avoid the same situation with that tenant. But as a suing party, you get literally nothing out of it. The defendant's credit score going down doesn't help you personally one bit, you get no restitution or compensation.