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Yeah, this title makes it sound like they are different entities. Audi is under the VW group, basically the same company, with different branding and product of

Yeah, this title makes it sound like they are different entities. Audi is under the VW group, basically the same company, with different branding and product offering. > Perhaps Porsche, Bugatti and Lamborghini will take longest to admit it? Porsche will be the first, as they have the Taycan, the platform is already being exported to Audi and (my guess) will be the basis of a next gen Lamborghini. Bugatti is in a completely different plane of existence though. I'm not sure what will happen with Bugatti but I'm almost certain they will be sold. As a small volume manufacturer they should still be able to keep producing ICE engines. Their 16.4L W16 is practically a work of art. And because they are that special, it will be easiest for Bugatti to divorce from VW Group.

r00t4ccess 6y ago
Porsche keeps saying the 911 will never be electric so they are just making new cars to be electric.
- firecall 6y ago
  It’s odd they say that. You’d think that at some point ICE will be no more, and then what? Porsche kill the 911 brand? Doesn’t seem likely. I’ve owned a couple of 911s and I’d happily own an electric one!
  - kwhitefoot 6y ago
    It already exists, though not from Porsche: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJLdzRJdKrs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJLdzRJdKrs
  - Zigurd 6y ago
    An electric 911 would not still be a 911. The 911 is defined by engine placement and configuration. I think they are acknowledging that their customers would regard an electric 911 as a travesty.
    - oblio 6y ago
      Their current customers. Customers change (both changing habits and younger customers).
    - mprovost 6y ago
      People said the same when they switched from air to water cooled engines.
      - rbanffy 6y ago
        I really loved the roar of the air cooled engines.
      - qzw 6y ago
        Exactly. And the great majority of their cars are now sold with automatic (PDK) transmissions. The manual isn’t even offered on the base 911 anymore. Sales have not suffered.
      - kipchak 6y ago
        It and the other changes made seems to have had an effect on resale values/interest though, 993's[1] catch a good bit more than 996s[2] looking at BAT auction results. Granted there's nowhere near enough enthusiast interest to justify making them, but I think there's something there. [1]https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/993/ https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/993/ [2]https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/996/ https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/996/
    - qzw 6y ago
      There are already threads on Porsche forums saying don’t drag race against Model 3s. When the 911 starts getting spanked by every other electric Honda off the line, you’ll hear their customers change the tune.
    - decafninja 6y ago
      It was considered heresy for AMG to be anything less than a big V8*. Then came the 4cyl 45s. Then came the non-hand-built 35/43/53 "notareal" AMGs. Now the next generation C63 is supposed to be a 4cylinder hybrid. The cries of heresy have already started. I imagine the generation after that might be fully electric. (* yes, I know there were early non-V8 AMGs, but AMG seems to have built their reputation on putting a massively powerful V8 into everything). The only options Porsche will eventually have for 911s will be to go electric, to kill the 911 brand entirely, or reserve it as non-roadlegal track toy. Might not happen in 5 years or 10 years or 20 years, but it will happen. Assuming humanity hasn't killed itself yet.
- theluketaylor 6y ago
  Porsche has not said never for the 911. They have said it will be the last of their vehicles to go fully electric. The new 992 platform for the 911 has been modified for electrification, so we'll be seeing a mild hybrid 911, likely for the 992.2 revision.
clouddrover 6y ago
> I'm not sure what will happen with Bugatti but I'm almost certain they will be sold. Volkswagen will retain ownership but move control of Bugatti to Porsche. Porsche will start a joint venture with Rimac to make Bugatti BEVs: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news-corporate/vw-group-confirms-talks-rimac-over-bugatti-joint-venture https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news-corporate/v...
agloeregrets 6y ago
Porsche wont drop the Motor for a while, Bugatti seems primed to be the first to actually drop it as they make one car and the Chiron's successor will absolutely be all electric. Lamborghini and Porsche will take a while, Lamborghini may re-spin the brand with an electric supercar of sorts that might be a massive hit but also Lamborghini sells its cars to people who want a 'Lambo' and want to be seen in it, they don't care too much about what is under the hood. Porsche may move 80% of their range to electric, but I think they will keep Gas around the longest of them all. People who buy porsches, many of them, drive them. They drive them hard and take them to the track. Rowing through the gears is part of the whole thing.
- arethuza 6y ago
  Interestingly, Lamborghini have used supercapacitor's rather than batteries for their 'hybrid': https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamborghini_Si%C3%A1n_FKP_37 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamborghini_Si%C3%A1n_FKP_37
Zhenya 6y ago
Bugatti is being moved under joint porsche - rimac control. Rimac is an electric supercar company. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a35865670/bugatti-porsche-rimac-tieups/ https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a35865670/bugatti-porsche-...

r00t4ccess 6y ago

Porsche keeps saying the 911 will never be electric so they are just making new cars to be electric.

firecall 6y ago
It’s odd they say that. You’d think that at some point ICE will be no more, and then what? Porsche kill the 911 brand? Doesn’t seem likely. I’ve owned a couple of 911s and I’d happily own an electric one!
- kwhitefoot 6y ago
  It already exists, though not from Porsche: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJLdzRJdKrs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJLdzRJdKrs
- Zigurd 6y ago
  An electric 911 would not still be a 911. The 911 is defined by engine placement and configuration. I think they are acknowledging that their customers would regard an electric 911 as a travesty.
  - oblio 6y ago
    Their current customers. Customers change (both changing habits and younger customers).
  - mprovost 6y ago
    People said the same when they switched from air to water cooled engines.
    - rbanffy 6y ago
      I really loved the roar of the air cooled engines.
    - qzw 6y ago
      Exactly. And the great majority of their cars are now sold with automatic (PDK) transmissions. The manual isn’t even offered on the base 911 anymore. Sales have not suffered.
    - kipchak 6y ago
      It and the other changes made seems to have had an effect on resale values/interest though, 993's[1] catch a good bit more than 996s[2] looking at BAT auction results. Granted there's nowhere near enough enthusiast interest to justify making them, but I think there's something there. [1]https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/993/ https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/993/ [2]https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/996/ https://bringatrailer.com/porsche/996/
  - qzw 6y ago
    There are already threads on Porsche forums saying don’t drag race against Model 3s. When the 911 starts getting spanked by every other electric Honda off the line, you’ll hear their customers change the tune.
  - decafninja 6y ago
    It was considered heresy for AMG to be anything less than a big V8*. Then came the 4cyl 45s. Then came the non-hand-built 35/43/53 "notareal" AMGs. Now the next generation C63 is supposed to be a 4cylinder hybrid. The cries of heresy have already started. I imagine the generation after that might be fully electric. (* yes, I know there were early non-V8 AMGs, but AMG seems to have built their reputation on putting a massively powerful V8 into everything). The only options Porsche will eventually have for 911s will be to go electric, to kill the 911 brand entirely, or reserve it as non-roadlegal track toy. Might not happen in 5 years or 10 years or 20 years, but it will happen. Assuming humanity hasn't killed itself yet.
theluketaylor 6y ago
Porsche has not said never for the 911. They have said it will be the last of their vehicles to go fully electric. The new 992 platform for the 911 has been modified for electrification, so we'll be seeing a mild hybrid 911, likely for the 992.2 revision.

clouddrover 6y ago

> I'm not sure what will happen with Bugatti but I'm almost certain they will be sold. Volkswagen will retain ownership but move control of Bugatti to Porsche. Porsche will start a joint venture with Rimac to make Bugatti BEVs: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news-corporate/vw-group-confirms-talks-rimac-over-bugatti-joint-venture https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry-news-corporate/v...

agloeregrets 6y ago

Porsche wont drop the Motor for a while, Bugatti seems primed to be the first to actually drop it as they make one car and the Chiron's successor will absolutely be all electric. Lamborghini and Porsche will take a while, Lamborghini may re-spin the brand with an electric supercar of sorts that might be a massive hit but also Lamborghini sells its cars to people who want a 'Lambo' and want to be seen in it, they don't care too much about what is under the hood. Porsche may move 80% of their range to electric, but I think they will keep Gas around the longest of them all. People who buy porsches, many of them, drive them. They drive them hard and take them to the track. Rowing through the gears is part of the whole thing.

arethuza 6y ago
Interestingly, Lamborghini have used supercapacitor's rather than batteries for their 'hybrid': https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamborghini_Si%C3%A1n_FKP_37 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamborghini_Si%C3%A1n_FKP_37

Zhenya 6y ago

Bugatti is being moved under joint porsche - rimac control. Rimac is an electric supercar company. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a35865670/bugatti-porsche-rimac-tieups/ https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a35865670/bugatti-porsche-...