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I think this report is where the information comes from (specifically the mouse over on the second graph): https://comptroller.nyc.gov/reports/nyc-department-o

I think this report is where the information comes from (specifically the mouse over on the second graph): https://comptroller.nyc.gov/reports/nyc-department-of-correction/ https://comptroller.nyc.gov/reports/nyc-department-of-correc... It paints a very different picture than the headline as we have all read it. One might interpret the headline as out of control spending. The break down of cost per inmate seems outrageous and supports that idea... but what really seems to have happened is a reduction of inmate population without a corresponding reduction in employees. I would guess things are most explained by not wanting to take away people's livelihoods and increase unemployment. Is "prison population reduced by 50% while employees remain constant" anywhere near as outrageous of an interpretation?" Should we fire 10% of the DOC workforce every year?

function_seven 6y ago
> Should we fire 10% of the DOC workforce every year? If the inmate population is declining by that amount, then absolutely yes we should. We didn't hire them in the first place to "give jobs" or "reduce unemployment". We (ostensibly!) hired them to guard prisoners. When there are fewer prisoners to guard, you need fewer guards. It would be much cheaper to cover their education costs for a different line of work if you're worried about taking people's livelihoods away. (Which is a totally reasonable concern) It reminds me of the quote about giving ditch diggers spoons instead of shovels to create more jobs: https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/10/10/spoons-shovels/ https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/10/10/spoons-shovels/
- hayst4ck 6y ago
  For what it's worth I agree, but I would personally have a hard time firing 1000 people, throwing a wrench in their lives. Especially during a pandemic and especially with poor social programs. When I look at this I am not outraged by the spending. I am outraged by the lack of federal social programs that directly burden the department of corrections with things like health care and retirement. The federal government should be handling these and reaping the economies of scale benefits of doing so.
  - function_seven 6y ago
    I read that graph as tracking the ratio over a decade. Yeah, during the pandemic, by all means freeze normal labor calculations and whatnot. But in the period from 2010 to 2019, as the population was slowly declining, there should have been layoffs (or, at least no new recruitment?). Somehow the staffing levels need to be grounded in reality. And I'm with you. I could never be the axe man. But then again I could also never be a prison guard, so there's that :)
zamadatix 6y ago
250k/inmate/year still seems high and that would be worst case putting 100% of expense to there wages so yes it'd still be outrageous (outside of the outrage of a constant level of workforce for that long).

function_seven 6y ago

> Should we fire 10% of the DOC workforce every year? If the inmate population is declining by that amount, then absolutely yes we should. We didn't hire them in the first place to "give jobs" or "reduce unemployment". We (ostensibly!) hired them to guard prisoners. When there are fewer prisoners to guard, you need fewer guards. It would be much cheaper to cover their education costs for a different line of work if you're worried about taking people's livelihoods away. (Which is a totally reasonable concern) It reminds me of the quote about giving ditch diggers spoons instead of shovels to create more jobs: https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/10/10/spoons-shovels/ https://quoteinvestigator.com/2011/10/10/spoons-shovels/

hayst4ck 6y ago
For what it's worth I agree, but I would personally have a hard time firing 1000 people, throwing a wrench in their lives. Especially during a pandemic and especially with poor social programs. When I look at this I am not outraged by the spending. I am outraged by the lack of federal social programs that directly burden the department of corrections with things like health care and retirement. The federal government should be handling these and reaping the economies of scale benefits of doing so.
- function_seven 6y ago
  I read that graph as tracking the ratio over a decade. Yeah, during the pandemic, by all means freeze normal labor calculations and whatnot. But in the period from 2010 to 2019, as the population was slowly declining, there should have been layoffs (or, at least no new recruitment?). Somehow the staffing levels need to be grounded in reality. And I'm with you. I could never be the axe man. But then again I could also never be a prison guard, so there's that :)

zamadatix 6y ago

250k/inmate/year still seems high and that would be worst case putting 100% of expense to there wages so yes it'd still be outrageous (outside of the outrage of a constant level of workforce for that long).