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> Maybe NFTs will not endure, which is a risk for anyone playing a pioneering role in a new genre. That is why the price was not $200 million or more. In any ca

> Maybe NFTs will not endure, which is a risk for anyone playing a pioneering role in a new genre. That is why the price was not $200 million or more. In any case, this is a world in which Marcel Duchamp’s urinal sculpture still is exhibited in major museums, regarded by many critics as a masterpiece of the 20th century, and it sold at auction for $1.6 million in 2002. Canvases painted a single color, and other forms of abstract and conceptual art, remain a major part of recent art history and can sell for tens of millions. > The point is not to argue over what qualifies as “art.” It is simply that it is a mistake to assume that NFTs will fail in the art world. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-03-17/the-nft-craze-actually-does-make-sense?sref=htOHjx5Y https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-03-17/the-nf...

xyzzy123 6y ago
People doubting that a thing is actually art at all seems to be a fairly consistent marker of something being good art. It's fresh, it's pushing boundaries, it's making people think and wonder, it's generating snark and discussion. If readymades are art, if a blank canvas is art, then art is just a scam! Not sure if it will stand the test of time though (I mean technically in terms of the artifacts persisting, and conceptually, aka whether it will still be interesting in 10 years or seen as a fad).
- Igelau 6y ago
  > People doubting that a thing is actually art at all seems to be a fairly consistent marker of something being good art. Survivorship bias. The successes are highly visible, and we never hear of the failures. > If readymades are art, if a blank canvas is art, then art is just a scam! Ceci n'est pas une pipe. All art is a kind of deception.
  - tinco 6y ago
    The success is part of the art. A highschool kid scribbling "this is not a pipe" next to a pipe in his notebook is not the same as an accomplished artist convincing a gallery to feature it in an exhibition.
    - Igelau 6y ago
      > The success is part of the art Not necessarily. Creators who toil in obscurity during life but receive posthumous recognition do happen.
      - tinco 6y ago
        Sure, but is still their accomplishment. The scribbling in the notebook would never receive eventual recognition unless something remarkable happened.
    - deleted 6y ago
      [deleted]
  - Jetrel 6y ago
    I'd point out that one thing about "con job" art like that is that, compared to craftsmanship art, where there's a steady paycheck for skilled work, "con art" is, well, the lottery. Tons of people try, and the vast majority make absolutely nothing. Meanwhile, in craftsman's art fields (all of the many ingredients that go into filmmaking, videogames, etc), if you're merely competent at what you do, it's like being a programmer - you learn the skills, and you get a job doing it, and my goodness - it pays a salary. There's no lottery involved. If you're a good matte painter, concept artist, 3d modeller, et cetera, illustrator, figure artist, etc, etc - people gladly pay money for it. -- Anecdotally, as someone in the games industry (and knowing some folks in film), the difference between these two fields (con art and skilled art) is pretty stark. Every person I've know who's tried to do con art has failed to make a career out of it, and every person who's gotten a degree-equivalent level of skill/effort into skilled art has earned a living doing it (in much the same way they would in programming).
    - 6gvONxR4sf7o 6y ago
      > every person who's gotten a degree-equivalent level of skill/effort into skilled art has earned a living doing it Not for the folks I know. I know plenty of authors, painters, photographers, and ex-film-students who need day jobs. It's practically a trope. These are people with degrees in the subject who have already made professional money at it, but can't make enough steady money with it. (guessing here) If you met these people on the job, you'd know a lot more gainfully employed folks simply by definition.
- mitchdoogle 6y ago
  This is like saying, "denial means someone is probably lying"
Igelau 6y ago
This is a misdirection. No one upthread was saying anything is or isn't art. This isn't about art. This about NFT.
- rorykoehler 6y ago
  Technically it's an artwork that is a commentary om NFTs.
sellyme 6y ago
> Canvases painted a single color, and other forms of abstract and conceptual art, remain a major part of recent art history and can sell for tens of millions. I don't think anyone's under the impression that people paying lots of money for extremely stupid things is a recent phenomenon. I deride those buying single-colour canvasses for 8 figure price tags just the same as I deride anyone buying into the litany of crypto pyramid schemes.
- WalterBright 6y ago
  I once wandered through a museum with a modern art collection. Several of the pieces looked like literal trash to me. I wasn't sure if the security guards were there to keep people from stealing the art or keep the janitors from taking the art out to the dumpster :-) I get it that some people buy it as investments, hoping to find a sucker to sell it to at a higher price. But that just sounds like pump-and-dump to me. Or maybe it's rich people who have run out of fun things to do with their money. Me, I'd rather do what Elon Musk does. I wanted to buy stock in SpaceX, but it is privately held, so I bought TSLA instead. Lucked out on that one.

xyzzy123 6y ago

People doubting that a thing is actually art at all seems to be a fairly consistent marker of something being good art. It's fresh, it's pushing boundaries, it's making people think and wonder, it's generating snark and discussion. If readymades are art, if a blank canvas is art, then art is just a scam! Not sure if it will stand the test of time though (I mean technically in terms of the artifacts persisting, and conceptually, aka whether it will still be interesting in 10 years or seen as a fad).

Igelau 6y ago
> People doubting that a thing is actually art at all seems to be a fairly consistent marker of something being good art. Survivorship bias. The successes are highly visible, and we never hear of the failures. > If readymades are art, if a blank canvas is art, then art is just a scam! Ceci n'est pas une pipe. All art is a kind of deception.
- tinco 6y ago
  The success is part of the art. A highschool kid scribbling "this is not a pipe" next to a pipe in his notebook is not the same as an accomplished artist convincing a gallery to feature it in an exhibition.
  - Igelau 6y ago
    > The success is part of the art Not necessarily. Creators who toil in obscurity during life but receive posthumous recognition do happen.
    - tinco 6y ago
      Sure, but is still their accomplishment. The scribbling in the notebook would never receive eventual recognition unless something remarkable happened.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
- Jetrel 6y ago
  I'd point out that one thing about "con job" art like that is that, compared to craftsmanship art, where there's a steady paycheck for skilled work, "con art" is, well, the lottery. Tons of people try, and the vast majority make absolutely nothing. Meanwhile, in craftsman's art fields (all of the many ingredients that go into filmmaking, videogames, etc), if you're merely competent at what you do, it's like being a programmer - you learn the skills, and you get a job doing it, and my goodness - it pays a salary. There's no lottery involved. If you're a good matte painter, concept artist, 3d modeller, et cetera, illustrator, figure artist, etc, etc - people gladly pay money for it. -- Anecdotally, as someone in the games industry (and knowing some folks in film), the difference between these two fields (con art and skilled art) is pretty stark. Every person I've know who's tried to do con art has failed to make a career out of it, and every person who's gotten a degree-equivalent level of skill/effort into skilled art has earned a living doing it (in much the same way they would in programming).
  - 6gvONxR4sf7o 6y ago
    > every person who's gotten a degree-equivalent level of skill/effort into skilled art has earned a living doing it Not for the folks I know. I know plenty of authors, painters, photographers, and ex-film-students who need day jobs. It's practically a trope. These are people with degrees in the subject who have already made professional money at it, but can't make enough steady money with it. (guessing here) If you met these people on the job, you'd know a lot more gainfully employed folks simply by definition.
mitchdoogle 6y ago
This is like saying, "denial means someone is probably lying"

Igelau 6y ago

This is a misdirection. No one upthread was saying anything is or isn't art. This isn't about art. This about NFT.

rorykoehler 6y ago
Technically it's an artwork that is a commentary om NFTs.

sellyme 6y ago

> Canvases painted a single color, and other forms of abstract and conceptual art, remain a major part of recent art history and can sell for tens of millions. I don't think anyone's under the impression that people paying lots of money for extremely stupid things is a recent phenomenon. I deride those buying single-colour canvasses for 8 figure price tags just the same as I deride anyone buying into the litany of crypto pyramid schemes.

WalterBright 6y ago
I once wandered through a museum with a modern art collection. Several of the pieces looked like literal trash to me. I wasn't sure if the security guards were there to keep people from stealing the art or keep the janitors from taking the art out to the dumpster :-) I get it that some people buy it as investments, hoping to find a sucker to sell it to at a higher price. But that just sounds like pump-and-dump to me. Or maybe it's rich people who have run out of fun things to do with their money. Me, I'd rather do what Elon Musk does. I wanted to buy stock in SpaceX, but it is privately held, so I bought TSLA instead. Lucked out on that one.