5 ms·

IBM Is Destroying Red Hat and Red Hatters Are Leaving

58 points by URfejk 6y ago

Shared404 6y ago
IBM IBM's. It's has and will continue happening forever as far as I can tell.
corty 6y ago
Unsurprising, really. I wonder if they can ever pull a SuSE and get out of IBM again, just as SuSE got out of Novell.
- toomuchtodo 6y ago
  I don’t think there’s anything stopping Redhat folks from starting a new enterprise and building another commercial version off of CentOS. If successful, they could strip mine IBM for the useful Redhat talent and leave IBM with the cruft.
  - Shared404 6y ago
    That might be difficult though, with IBM retaining the brand that people aren't fired for purchasing. IT would know to go with the Redhat talent, but would management go with it?
    - goatinaboat 6y ago
      That might be difficult though, with IBM retaining the brand that people aren't fired for purchasing. The MariaDB guys pulled it off
    - dragonwriter 6y ago
      RedHat has good enterprise relations, but it doesn't seem to be a no-brainer brand the way old school IBM was or the way Microsoft more recently has been. If they can get some decent enterprise sales, support, and profesional services folks as well as developers, they’ll do fine.
      - corty 6y ago
        I'm not so sure there. RedHat is what you pick to check a box somewhere that says "OS supported with this software/hardware/whatever". There isn't really a technical argument to pay for RedHat over CentOS, beyond box-ticking. Now a RedHat-replacement would first have to get all software and hardware vendors to support their new no-name distro. And given that this has even been hard on Oracle, I'm sceptical in general...
goatinaboat 6y ago
If only there was some way this could have been predicted. Perhaps using Watson? Meanwhile https://www.theregister.com/2021/03/17/ibm_exec_payouts/ https://www.theregister.com/2021/03/17/ibm_exec_payouts/ “IBM CEO Arvind Krishna and ex-exec-chairwoman Ginny Rometty were collectively awarded more than $38m in compensation for their services in fiscal 2020, a year in which Big Blue's revenues shrank and operating profit more than halved.”
penguin_linux 6y ago
>AWS is about learning and memorising GUIs, not real skills, and those ‘skills’ become useless anyway as soon as you move to a customer/server that doesn’t have AWS This is not my experience with AWS or Red Hat whatsoever. Most, if not all AWS users I've worked with use languages like terraform and emphasize importance of Infrastructure as Code, _not_using the GUI. Cloud concepts are more important than the GUI. The same goes for the core concepts behind Ansible/Openshift. Both are not only available free, but they emphasize IaC over GUI.
- JoyrexJ9 6y ago
  Yeah I was following along with the article up until that point. Pretty dumb thing to say by someone that probably has never run production workloads on a public cloud
- prepend 6y ago
  This was confusing to me. I’ve never met anyone who uses the GUI for anyone substantial. And know quite a few folks who never use the GUI and either solely use the API or use some framework that uses the API. If anything AWS skills are more portable because of all the reverse engineered APIs and whatnot.
marcodiego 6y ago
This is very very sad and may jeopardize the future of linux. IBM produces POWER processors, they could buy or mimic Raptor Computing Systems and offer an entirely IBM-designed system from processor to OS; something that today only apple can offer. It is very sad to see such great potential wasted. When IBM bought Red Hat, many people were waiting an inverse buy out, something like when apple bought NeXT. It looks like that is not what is happening.
- onli 6y ago
  No, this would be likely positive for Linux. The centralization of decision power about the linux ecosystem via Redhat lead to net negative developments like systemd adoption, X11 being left to rot under Redhat leadership in favour of a Wayland solution that still does not work properly, and Gnome 3 being pushed as the mainstream linux solution. If Redhat really would implode the natural, likely more decentralized development efforts would gain weight and prevent errors like those. The article even mentions that with the abstraction as sale argument remarks.
  - eldelshell 6y ago
    Are you still salty about systemd? Let it go, let it go.
    - onli 6y ago
      Does systemd still have binary logs? There is your answer.
dralley 6y ago
I work for Red Hat. This article doesn't match (my) reality. I can speak only for myself, but very little has changed, and what changes there have been, are more easily attributable to the leadership shuffles after Jim moved up, than anything else. Two thing that they are absolutely wrong about, is the claim that there were layoffs last year which included Red Hat, which didn't happen... and the truly lol-worthy claim that (quote) "the Fedora project is being outsourced to Microsoft and AWS", because many repositories are on Github and some of the build infrastructure is hosted on Amazon. "tech rights" has a bit of a ... reputation. I would perhaps take their claims with a shaker full of salt. https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4541p6/can_we_not_post_links_to_techrights_please/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4541p6/can_we_not_po...
- marcodiego 6y ago
  You work for Red Hat, nice! Would you give us any hint or bit of information if IBM has any plans to release an affordable POWER system similar to BlackBird entirely designed by IBM from processor to OS?
  - dralley 6y ago
    I have no idea what IBM is up to, honestly. It doesn't impact me. It's not something I would be in any position to talk about even if I did, though.
  - wmf 6y ago
    Former IBMer here. It would be impossible for IBM to release an affordable Power system for many reasons including culture and margins. If you want Blackbird go ahead and buy it.
  - als0 6y ago
    IBM doesn't make workstations or PCs anymore. They gave that business (along with expertise) to Lenovo.
- choeger 6y ago
  Thank you very much for this clarification.
thrower123 6y ago
IBM and Oracle are going neck and neck for the crown of most self-destructive technology company. My brother-in-law in consulting has told me several stories of people getting fired for buying IBM in recent years.
bob33212 6y ago
This was the plan all along. Because IBM is a services company they actually make more money when they have lower quality employees. It is better to bill people out at 300/hour who are going to screw things up and make the project twice as long rather than bill people out at 500/hour when they are going to be able to finish early or scrap the project entirely because it was vaporware to begin with.
- dralley 6y ago
  IBM is in the process of spinning off the entire consulting / services side of the company so that IBM proper can focus on "hybrid cloud", so this theory makes zero sense. https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2020/10/ibm-to-split-into-two-companies-by-the-end-of-2021/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2020/10/ibm-t...
rstat1 6y ago
Not sure I really believe anything in this article. Especially given this site's reputation for Fox News style "reporting"(meaning made up BS).
- eldelshell 6y ago
  It's all bullshit.
eldelshell 6y ago
What a bunch of crap.
jhrozek 6y ago
(Disclaimer: I work for Red Hat) Please pay attention to the previous submission about RH from this platform. The author seems to have an agenda and likes to stir controversy. Nothing in his post matches my experience.
prepend 6y ago
This article says “AWS is... an exploiter of Free software” and I think this is a misleading choice of words because exploit has a connotation that someone is being taken advantage of. Using free software as it was designed and explicitly allowed isn’t “exploiting.” I know there’s a discussion and debate and all that, but using this kind of non-settled language casually in a sentence makes me less likely to find an article genuine and accurate.
tyingq 6y ago
The article talks quite a lot about comments here: https://www.thelayoff.com/t/17y7dQRz#replies https://www.thelayoff.com/t/17y7dQRz#replies But I don't see much of anything there. One negative comment from "anonymous".
nottorp 6y ago
The article may or may not be accurate, but it's my personal opinion that I'm to small to go anywhere near IBM or Oracle. So RedHat may still be a paradise for employees, I still can't afford it.
- vinay_ys 6y ago
  I've been at 3 startups so far that couldn't afford Redhat when we were small and so we hand rolled everything ourselves in house. By the time we could, it didn't matter anymore. IBM/Redhat is relevant only to old-school banks and such. Not really relevant for YC/HN crowd.
chr15p 6y ago
I enjoyed the "Fedora is being outsourced to Microsoft and AWS" line, turns out they mean Fedora uses github and aws. The "layoffs" link implies layoffs at Red Hat but the linked story talks about layoffs at microsoft(!) and IBM (ok at least thats closer but "IBM is gutting Red Hat by maybe possibly could-be laying off IBM staff" is a weird logical leap) So just another attempt to drive clicks via a shock headline and a nothing story. (Edit: my spelling is terrible)
flyinghamster 6y ago
My first hint that things were starting to go sideways was the extended delay in bringing out CentOS 7, followed by a kernel bug that affected my CPU, where a fix was quickly available to RHEL users, and slow in coming to CentOS users. The final straw was trying to keep ZFS built; after one last time where the next kernel's ZFS module failed to build, it was out with CentOS on my home file server, and in with Ubuntu Server. I haven't looked back. I have one last CentOS box, running Asterisk, that I'm about to switch to Debian. Then, it seemed like, all too often, I'd look up a question about CentOS, and get a link to a paywalled page on access.redhat.com for my trouble. Thanks, guys... CentOS 8 came after even worse delays than 7, and, when I spun it up in a VM for a test drive, none of my preferred desktops were available. I said NOPE and moved on. And now, we have this mess. What a shame it had to end this way.
- geofft 6y ago
  You do remember that, a couple years ago, CentOS was a community project with no relation with Red Hat that went rather out of its way to avoid mentioning Red Hat and drawing trademark ire? Also it costs $40/year to get access to the paywalled docs. Anyway, what a shame it is that Red Hat was acquired by IBM. With customers like you, it's baffling that Red Hat thought they couldn't stay profitable on their own....
  - sofixa 6y ago
    > Also it costs $40/year to get access to the paywalled docs Documentation should never be paywalled. It kills SEO and usability, and is very user hostile. Why are you under the impression that GP is or wants to be a customer? I'm not a customer of Google for writing Go code, or of Microsoft for using VS Code, or of Sentry for self-hosting their awesome product. Using FOSS CentOS doesn't make anyone a customer of RH, and that's why the latter screwed the former by abandoning CentOS8 and going back on the announced support lifecycle.
    - geofft 6y ago
      Well, if neither you nor the GP are willing to be customers of Red Hat, didn't you get exactly what you paid for? Of course putting docs behind a paywall is hostile to non-paying users! So am I! (it's also empirically untrue that it kills SEO, given how frequently the docs in question show up in search results.) Like there are two clear options. You can contribute your own labor to a community distro like pre-acquisition CentOS or to Debian, or you can pay for the software you use - and it costs very little money to pay for it. If you do neither, and you lament that things are going poorly for you, you might want to rethink your expectations. Things are going very well for others. An independent CentOS probably could have survived if people were willing to put in the work of release engineering. Unfortunately, there ended up just being one user of CentOS who cared enough to put in the work - and that customer ended up being Red Hat itself. That's why they acquired it. Scientific Linux is also dead. The RHEL SRPMs are still there, just as they have been for decades. Anyone can step up to the plate and make their own community-run rebuild of RHEL if they're unhappy with how things are going.
kbrwn 6y ago
I recently left Red Hat (Feb 2021). I joined from the CoreOS acquisition in 2018. For the most part I enjoyed working at Red Hat. Honestly the real reason I left because of GME but there where a few things that convinced me to move: 1) Killing CentOS/CoreOS. Replacing these two stable OSs with unstable upstreams in CentOS Stream/Fedora CoreOS. 2) So many container tools that have overlapping tasks yet perform in completely different manners (podman, buildah, cri-o, skopeo, tekton, openshift, quay, libpod). Interoperability between all these projects was a constant struggle. 3) Forced usage of IRC. I shouldn't have to run my own bouncer to get features like history, push notifications, identity services. I cannot comprehend how in 2021 at a major corporation I would receive irc messages from usernames like "cloudpizza9000" or "m0use" and be expected to know who these people are and take things seriously enough to work together. It seemed like I was in a 90s chat room with a bunch of strangers.
- anreadea 6y ago
  Where did you work in RHT? In the openshift org everyone is on slack, i haven't touched to my IRC client for a long time (for work stuff at least)
  - dralley 6y ago
    The older engineering orgs are on IRC, partially because many of the upstream communities were on IRC. It's slowly changing for the same reason (IRC falling out of favor in the broader community). There's a mix of IRC, Slack, RocketChat, and GChat.
- caskstrength 6y ago
  > Forced usage of IRC. I shouldn't have to run my own bouncer to get features like history, push notifications, identity services. I cannot comprehend how in 2021 at a major corporation I would receive irc messages from usernames like "cloudpizza9000" or "m0use" and be expected to know who these people are and take things seriously enough to work together. It seemed like I was in a 90s chat room with a bunch of strangers. That sounds great! Would love to work for company like that. Meanwhile in my company we are now migrating to Teams from Lync and Slack and general IT infrastructure is usual MS-shitshow...
anreadea 6y ago
My experience someone who work for Red Hat, I had only (engineering) good relationship with the IBM people, i never heard anything about lay off or projects that needs to be killed or other devil things IBM people may do because of IBM , they are rather nice most of them actually.....

58 points by URfejk 6y ago

Shared404 6y ago

IBM IBM's. It's has and will continue happening forever as far as I can tell.

corty 6y ago

Unsurprising, really. I wonder if they can ever pull a SuSE and get out of IBM again, just as SuSE got out of Novell.

toomuchtodo 6y ago
I don’t think there’s anything stopping Redhat folks from starting a new enterprise and building another commercial version off of CentOS. If successful, they could strip mine IBM for the useful Redhat talent and leave IBM with the cruft.
- Shared404 6y ago
  That might be difficult though, with IBM retaining the brand that people aren't fired for purchasing. IT would know to go with the Redhat talent, but would management go with it?
  - goatinaboat 6y ago
    That might be difficult though, with IBM retaining the brand that people aren't fired for purchasing. The MariaDB guys pulled it off
  - dragonwriter 6y ago
    RedHat has good enterprise relations, but it doesn't seem to be a no-brainer brand the way old school IBM was or the way Microsoft more recently has been. If they can get some decent enterprise sales, support, and profesional services folks as well as developers, they’ll do fine.
    - corty 6y ago
      I'm not so sure there. RedHat is what you pick to check a box somewhere that says "OS supported with this software/hardware/whatever". There isn't really a technical argument to pay for RedHat over CentOS, beyond box-ticking. Now a RedHat-replacement would first have to get all software and hardware vendors to support their new no-name distro. And given that this has even been hard on Oracle, I'm sceptical in general...

goatinaboat 6y ago

If only there was some way this could have been predicted. Perhaps using Watson? Meanwhile https://www.theregister.com/2021/03/17/ibm_exec_payouts/ https://www.theregister.com/2021/03/17/ibm_exec_payouts/ “IBM CEO Arvind Krishna and ex-exec-chairwoman Ginny Rometty were collectively awarded more than $38m in compensation for their services in fiscal 2020, a year in which Big Blue's revenues shrank and operating profit more than halved.”

penguin_linux 6y ago

>AWS is about learning and memorising GUIs, not real skills, and those ‘skills’ become useless anyway as soon as you move to a customer/server that doesn’t have AWS This is not my experience with AWS or Red Hat whatsoever. Most, if not all AWS users I've worked with use languages like terraform and emphasize importance of Infrastructure as Code, _not_using the GUI. Cloud concepts are more important than the GUI. The same goes for the core concepts behind Ansible/Openshift. Both are not only available free, but they emphasize IaC over GUI.

JoyrexJ9 6y ago
Yeah I was following along with the article up until that point. Pretty dumb thing to say by someone that probably has never run production workloads on a public cloud
prepend 6y ago
This was confusing to me. I’ve never met anyone who uses the GUI for anyone substantial. And know quite a few folks who never use the GUI and either solely use the API or use some framework that uses the API. If anything AWS skills are more portable because of all the reverse engineered APIs and whatnot.

marcodiego 6y ago

This is very very sad and may jeopardize the future of linux. IBM produces POWER processors, they could buy or mimic Raptor Computing Systems and offer an entirely IBM-designed system from processor to OS; something that today only apple can offer. It is very sad to see such great potential wasted. When IBM bought Red Hat, many people were waiting an inverse buy out, something like when apple bought NeXT. It looks like that is not what is happening.

onli 6y ago
No, this would be likely positive for Linux. The centralization of decision power about the linux ecosystem via Redhat lead to net negative developments like systemd adoption, X11 being left to rot under Redhat leadership in favour of a Wayland solution that still does not work properly, and Gnome 3 being pushed as the mainstream linux solution. If Redhat really would implode the natural, likely more decentralized development efforts would gain weight and prevent errors like those. The article even mentions that with the abstraction as sale argument remarks.
- eldelshell 6y ago
  Are you still salty about systemd? Let it go, let it go.
  - onli 6y ago
    Does systemd still have binary logs? There is your answer.

dralley 6y ago

I work for Red Hat. This article doesn't match (my) reality. I can speak only for myself, but very little has changed, and what changes there have been, are more easily attributable to the leadership shuffles after Jim moved up, than anything else. Two thing that they are absolutely wrong about, is the claim that there were layoffs last year which included Red Hat, which didn't happen... and the truly lol-worthy claim that (quote) "the Fedora project is being outsourced to Microsoft and AWS", because many repositories are on Github and some of the build infrastructure is hosted on Amazon. "tech rights" has a bit of a ... reputation. I would perhaps take their claims with a shaker full of salt. https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4541p6/can_we_not_post_links_to_techrights_please/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4541p6/can_we_not_po...

marcodiego 6y ago
You work for Red Hat, nice! Would you give us any hint or bit of information if IBM has any plans to release an affordable POWER system similar to BlackBird entirely designed by IBM from processor to OS?
- dralley 6y ago
  I have no idea what IBM is up to, honestly. It doesn't impact me. It's not something I would be in any position to talk about even if I did, though.
- wmf 6y ago
  Former IBMer here. It would be impossible for IBM to release an affordable Power system for many reasons including culture and margins. If you want Blackbird go ahead and buy it.
- als0 6y ago
  IBM doesn't make workstations or PCs anymore. They gave that business (along with expertise) to Lenovo.
choeger 6y ago
Thank you very much for this clarification.

thrower123 6y ago

IBM and Oracle are going neck and neck for the crown of most self-destructive technology company. My brother-in-law in consulting has told me several stories of people getting fired for buying IBM in recent years.

bob33212 6y ago

This was the plan all along. Because IBM is a services company they actually make more money when they have lower quality employees. It is better to bill people out at 300/hour who are going to screw things up and make the project twice as long rather than bill people out at 500/hour when they are going to be able to finish early or scrap the project entirely because it was vaporware to begin with.

dralley 6y ago
IBM is in the process of spinning off the entire consulting / services side of the company so that IBM proper can focus on "hybrid cloud", so this theory makes zero sense. https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2020/10/ibm-to-split-into-two-companies-by-the-end-of-2021/ https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2020/10/ibm-t...

rstat1 6y ago

Not sure I really believe anything in this article. Especially given this site's reputation for Fox News style "reporting"(meaning made up BS).

eldelshell 6y ago
It's all bullshit.

eldelshell 6y ago

What a bunch of crap.

jhrozek 6y ago

(Disclaimer: I work for Red Hat) Please pay attention to the previous submission about RH from this platform. The author seems to have an agenda and likes to stir controversy. Nothing in his post matches my experience.

prepend 6y ago

This article says “AWS is... an exploiter of Free software” and I think this is a misleading choice of words because exploit has a connotation that someone is being taken advantage of. Using free software as it was designed and explicitly allowed isn’t “exploiting.” I know there’s a discussion and debate and all that, but using this kind of non-settled language casually in a sentence makes me less likely to find an article genuine and accurate.

tyingq 6y ago

The article talks quite a lot about comments here: https://www.thelayoff.com/t/17y7dQRz#replies https://www.thelayoff.com/t/17y7dQRz#replies But I don't see much of anything there. One negative comment from "anonymous".

nottorp 6y ago

The article may or may not be accurate, but it's my personal opinion that I'm to small to go anywhere near IBM or Oracle. So RedHat may still be a paradise for employees, I still can't afford it.

vinay_ys 6y ago
I've been at 3 startups so far that couldn't afford Redhat when we were small and so we hand rolled everything ourselves in house. By the time we could, it didn't matter anymore. IBM/Redhat is relevant only to old-school banks and such. Not really relevant for YC/HN crowd.

chr15p 6y ago

I enjoyed the "Fedora is being outsourced to Microsoft and AWS" line, turns out they mean Fedora uses github and aws. The "layoffs" link implies layoffs at Red Hat but the linked story talks about layoffs at microsoft(!) and IBM (ok at least thats closer but "IBM is gutting Red Hat by maybe possibly could-be laying off IBM staff" is a weird logical leap) So just another attempt to drive clicks via a shock headline and a nothing story. (Edit: my spelling is terrible)

flyinghamster 6y ago

My first hint that things were starting to go sideways was the extended delay in bringing out CentOS 7, followed by a kernel bug that affected my CPU, where a fix was quickly available to RHEL users, and slow in coming to CentOS users. The final straw was trying to keep ZFS built; after one last time where the next kernel's ZFS module failed to build, it was out with CentOS on my home file server, and in with Ubuntu Server. I haven't looked back. I have one last CentOS box, running Asterisk, that I'm about to switch to Debian. Then, it seemed like, all too often, I'd look up a question about CentOS, and get a link to a paywalled page on access.redhat.com for my trouble. Thanks, guys... CentOS 8 came after even worse delays than 7, and, when I spun it up in a VM for a test drive, none of my preferred desktops were available. I said NOPE and moved on. And now, we have this mess. What a shame it had to end this way.

geofft 6y ago
You do remember that, a couple years ago, CentOS was a community project with no relation with Red Hat that went rather out of its way to avoid mentioning Red Hat and drawing trademark ire? Also it costs $40/year to get access to the paywalled docs. Anyway, what a shame it is that Red Hat was acquired by IBM. With customers like you, it's baffling that Red Hat thought they couldn't stay profitable on their own....
- sofixa 6y ago
  > Also it costs $40/year to get access to the paywalled docs Documentation should never be paywalled. It kills SEO and usability, and is very user hostile. Why are you under the impression that GP is or wants to be a customer? I'm not a customer of Google for writing Go code, or of Microsoft for using VS Code, or of Sentry for self-hosting their awesome product. Using FOSS CentOS doesn't make anyone a customer of RH, and that's why the latter screwed the former by abandoning CentOS8 and going back on the announced support lifecycle.
  - geofft 6y ago
    Well, if neither you nor the GP are willing to be customers of Red Hat, didn't you get exactly what you paid for? Of course putting docs behind a paywall is hostile to non-paying users! So am I! (it's also empirically untrue that it kills SEO, given how frequently the docs in question show up in search results.) Like there are two clear options. You can contribute your own labor to a community distro like pre-acquisition CentOS or to Debian, or you can pay for the software you use - and it costs very little money to pay for it. If you do neither, and you lament that things are going poorly for you, you might want to rethink your expectations. Things are going very well for others. An independent CentOS probably could have survived if people were willing to put in the work of release engineering. Unfortunately, there ended up just being one user of CentOS who cared enough to put in the work - and that customer ended up being Red Hat itself. That's why they acquired it. Scientific Linux is also dead. The RHEL SRPMs are still there, just as they have been for decades. Anyone can step up to the plate and make their own community-run rebuild of RHEL if they're unhappy with how things are going.

kbrwn 6y ago

I recently left Red Hat (Feb 2021). I joined from the CoreOS acquisition in 2018. For the most part I enjoyed working at Red Hat. Honestly the real reason I left because of GME but there where a few things that convinced me to move: 1) Killing CentOS/CoreOS. Replacing these two stable OSs with unstable upstreams in CentOS Stream/Fedora CoreOS. 2) So many container tools that have overlapping tasks yet perform in completely different manners (podman, buildah, cri-o, skopeo, tekton, openshift, quay, libpod). Interoperability between all these projects was a constant struggle. 3) Forced usage of IRC. I shouldn't have to run my own bouncer to get features like history, push notifications, identity services. I cannot comprehend how in 2021 at a major corporation I would receive irc messages from usernames like "cloudpizza9000" or "m0use" and be expected to know who these people are and take things seriously enough to work together. It seemed like I was in a 90s chat room with a bunch of strangers.

anreadea 6y ago
Where did you work in RHT? In the openshift org everyone is on slack, i haven't touched to my IRC client for a long time (for work stuff at least)
- dralley 6y ago
  The older engineering orgs are on IRC, partially because many of the upstream communities were on IRC. It's slowly changing for the same reason (IRC falling out of favor in the broader community). There's a mix of IRC, Slack, RocketChat, and GChat.
caskstrength 6y ago
> Forced usage of IRC. I shouldn't have to run my own bouncer to get features like history, push notifications, identity services. I cannot comprehend how in 2021 at a major corporation I would receive irc messages from usernames like "cloudpizza9000" or "m0use" and be expected to know who these people are and take things seriously enough to work together. It seemed like I was in a 90s chat room with a bunch of strangers. That sounds great! Would love to work for company like that. Meanwhile in my company we are now migrating to Teams from Lync and Slack and general IT infrastructure is usual MS-shitshow...

anreadea 6y ago

My experience someone who work for Red Hat, I had only (engineering) good relationship with the IBM people, i never heard anything about lay off or projects that needs to be killed or other devil things IBM people may do because of IBM , they are rather nice most of them actually.....