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>>>and are lobbying to get the federal minimum wage raised to that level from $7.25. What you fell for the Con... Amazon wants $15 in order to put the final n

by syshum 6y ago

>>>and are lobbying to get the federal minimum wage raised to that level from $7.25. What you fell for the Con... Amazon wants $15 in order to put the final nail in the coffin of small business hiring that teen for their first job stocking the small local store... No they want those positions gone, they want those business shuttered. This idea that Amazon is "fighting for the worker" in their drive for $15/hr minimum wage is moronic. $15/hr min wage is also not based on any economic reality and as a basis for a "living wage" it would be far to low in some reasons, and far too high in many others. Minimum Wage should be a LOCAL, or state level policy not a national one.

astrange 6y ago
> Amazon wants $15 in order to put the final nail in the coffin of small business hiring that teen for their first job stocking the small local store... This is correct but it's a good thing because small businesses are unironically bad. Small business owners are the most reactionary demographic in the US, less productive than large businesses, the most abusive towards employees, and exempt from discrimination laws. They also don't have negotiation power and can't improve anything with their suppliers (e.g. Chinese restaurants may all be family-owned, but they're all buying ingredients from the same place).
- syshum 6y ago
  >> small businesses are unironically bad. I did not think I would see the day that HN was pro corporation and Big business. Aside from the fact your completely wrong, most people are employed by small or medium businessed, and SMB's are often more agile and able to respond faster to market demands than larger companies This is why you do not see large companies innovating, instead they buy out small companies that have innovated in an effort to grab and/or hold the market share they lose to upstarts. Also it is ironic that in a post dedicated to talking about how terrible Amazon treats its retail employee's and with provable evidence of employment abuse by other large companies on the world stage you stake a claim that small businesses are more abusive, that is laughably absurd Small and medium business are the backbone of the economy, and in large part treat their employee's better than large companies. Sure some very small micro business with less than 25 employee's might but SMB is generally companies 25 - 1000 employees and under 1 billion in revenue. Companies this bracket often have some of the highest employee satisfaction scores, and lowest turn over it is absurd to to think that SMB's are worse than the Large Global Corporations.
pnutjam 6y ago
Have you seen what $15 buys nowadays? Nobody is worth less then $15 an hour. Nobody.
- syshum 6y ago
  Yes, and a single person in may area can easily survive on that, a couple with no kids could likely afford to buy home with no problems. I have a feeling you live in one of deep blue cities where rent for a small apartment is $2,000 a month. That said however, you have made a common mistake the people advocating for artificial increased in minimum wage make. It is not about what the person is "worth", it is about how much revenue a business can make off that labor if a business has to pay $15 for labor, but can only resell that labor for $10, there is no job. hell even if a business can resell the labor for $15 there is no job. This is economic reality, I know using emotion to talk about a persons "worth" may seem like a valid argument but it is not. If the economic reality was just as simple as declearing labor is worth $15 by fiat, then why stop at $15, why not $20 or $50, hell let just demand everyone make $1,000,000 a year we will all be millionaries. You likely easily see why this reducto absurdum I am sure you will reject it as a fallacy but the economic reality does not change If you want to see wages increase you have to increase the value of labor, and government regulation can not simply demand the value of labor increase. Attempts to do so often have very bad unintended consequences
  - pnutjam 6y ago
    People love the stupid make it a million dollars argument, thanks for throwing that garbage in here. You can absolutely set a floor for labor. Go back and study some history, then maybe you'll be able to understand.
    - syshum 6y ago
      >>Go back and study some history, I know history rather well, this is why i am opposed to centrally planned economies, They always fail and always cause more suffering then they resolve

by syshum 6y ago

astrange 6y ago

> Amazon wants $15 in order to put the final nail in the coffin of small business hiring that teen for their first job stocking the small local store... This is correct but it's a good thing because small businesses are unironically bad. Small business owners are the most reactionary demographic in the US, less productive than large businesses, the most abusive towards employees, and exempt from discrimination laws. They also don't have negotiation power and can't improve anything with their suppliers (e.g. Chinese restaurants may all be family-owned, but they're all buying ingredients from the same place).

syshum 6y ago
>> small businesses are unironically bad. I did not think I would see the day that HN was pro corporation and Big business. Aside from the fact your completely wrong, most people are employed by small or medium businessed, and SMB's are often more agile and able to respond faster to market demands than larger companies This is why you do not see large companies innovating, instead they buy out small companies that have innovated in an effort to grab and/or hold the market share they lose to upstarts. Also it is ironic that in a post dedicated to talking about how terrible Amazon treats its retail employee's and with provable evidence of employment abuse by other large companies on the world stage you stake a claim that small businesses are more abusive, that is laughably absurd Small and medium business are the backbone of the economy, and in large part treat their employee's better than large companies. Sure some very small micro business with less than 25 employee's might but SMB is generally companies 25 - 1000 employees and under 1 billion in revenue. Companies this bracket often have some of the highest employee satisfaction scores, and lowest turn over it is absurd to to think that SMB's are worse than the Large Global Corporations.

pnutjam 6y ago

Have you seen what $15 buys nowadays? Nobody is worth less then $15 an hour. Nobody.

syshum 6y ago
Yes, and a single person in may area can easily survive on that, a couple with no kids could likely afford to buy home with no problems. I have a feeling you live in one of deep blue cities where rent for a small apartment is $2,000 a month. That said however, you have made a common mistake the people advocating for artificial increased in minimum wage make. It is not about what the person is "worth", it is about how much revenue a business can make off that labor if a business has to pay $15 for labor, but can only resell that labor for $10, there is no job. hell even if a business can resell the labor for $15 there is no job. This is economic reality, I know using emotion to talk about a persons "worth" may seem like a valid argument but it is not. If the economic reality was just as simple as declearing labor is worth $15 by fiat, then why stop at $15, why not $20 or $50, hell let just demand everyone make $1,000,000 a year we will all be millionaries. You likely easily see why this reducto absurdum I am sure you will reject it as a fallacy but the economic reality does not change If you want to see wages increase you have to increase the value of labor, and government regulation can not simply demand the value of labor increase. Attempts to do so often have very bad unintended consequences
- pnutjam 6y ago
  People love the stupid make it a million dollars argument, thanks for throwing that garbage in here. You can absolutely set a floor for labor. Go back and study some history, then maybe you'll be able to understand.
  - syshum 6y ago
    >>Go back and study some history, I know history rather well, this is why i am opposed to centrally planned economies, They always fail and always cause more suffering then they resolve