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You might sound like someone who doesn't understand 'freedom of speech'. This does not allow you to do whatever you want. In germany for example it is written

You might sound like someone who doesn't understand 'freedom of speech'. This does not allow you to do whatever you want. In germany for example it is written like this: "These rights shall find their limits in the provisions of general laws, in provisions for the protection of young persons, and in the right to personal honour." And its not different in the USA, you have limitations as well as the general good is more important than your personal. "The world is all too fond of sexuality, and especially with controversial sexuality." And what distrubs me the most on your comment: Just because their are pedophiles, doesn't make pedophiles okay. Yes i used here the extrem form of 'controversial sexuality' but to be clear: you should know your boundaries in comparison to the normal society. Just because you are part of that sub group of people, in my circles 'controversial sexuality' is not typical at all. You have a responsibility and just because you can and some other are having the same moral compass as you have, doesn't make your niche okay on a moral/society point of view. And it could be that your 'controversial sexuality' is actually okay but how you express yourself, it feels already that you crossed a line i wouldn't.

throwaway4115 6y ago
> [Freedom of speech] rights shall find their limits in the provisions of general laws, in provisions for the protection of young persons, and in the right to personal honour. You seem to imply that controversial written erotica shouldn’t be covered by freedom of speech protections, as it would be in the name of protecting children. Do you think censoring it would reduce the incidence of child abuse? If so, would banning videogames like GTA reduce the incidence of shootings or traffic rule violations? > in my circles 'controversial sexuality' is not typical at all It seems like the author of the comment you’re replying to might be in a unique position to gauge what controversial sexuality might be of interest to your circles even if yourself aren’t privy to it due to its controversial nature.
- Duennepaper 6y ago
  No, my argument is, that 'freedom of speech' doesn't allow everything as the author indicates. Thats not even something i have an opinion on, the law already defines that and i highly suspect that it falls under usa laws as it does for germany. Like laws going in direction of 'proection of minors'. I'm not sure if you are allowed to just put a website online which is advocating for pedophility (lets keep the extreme to simplify). But here is where youth laws require you to make sure kids can't access it. Same goes for GTA, you also have youth laws protecting them. The author is probably part of a subcultural group of people in their own bubble. I highly doubt that his experience is in any way ever statistically relevant enough and reaches any majority at all. And just to clarify one thing: i don't care about known fetishes or weird erotica. Let people read and write what they want but its easy to cross lines in fiction you wouldn't dare in real life but starting to getting used to the thoughts, images and ideas. How do you think would freely advocate that kids should express their sexuality as it is just 'normal'? Kids which are just playing and learning and perhaps lern to touch themselves as a normal growing up process or adults sexualising those kids? No kid needs an adult supporter to learn how to masturbate and there are 1000x more important things for people to learn like taxes before they should learn how to have a very diverse sex live in their adult life. Don't get me wrong, we do put a lot of stigma on it as a society but its probably better to advocate to the adults and not to minors at all. Clear line.
devwastaken 6y ago
For something to be wrong you have to prove a harm. Limitations to speech are because the harm of that speech weighs more than the chilling effect of suppressing it. Fictional stories and images on the internet have no relationship with reality. There are no victims, there is no one harmed. You don't have to like the content, that is fine, but there is no good argument about bad morals or government intervention unless you're proving actual harm.
- buisi 6y ago
  I also have a dislike for punishing someone for the acts of someone else. If someone who commits a crime, just so happens to have a particular book, it doesn't mean all the owners of that particular book should be punished for their transgressions. It's an unpleasant form of collective punishment. And it means that all of them have to suffer for something which has nothing to do with them.
- Duennepaper 6y ago
  Sooo fictional child molesting images are okay? Rapefantasies written as books are also okay?

throwaway4115 6y ago

> [Freedom of speech] rights shall find their limits in the provisions of general laws, in provisions for the protection of young persons, and in the right to personal honour. You seem to imply that controversial written erotica shouldn’t be covered by freedom of speech protections, as it would be in the name of protecting children. Do you think censoring it would reduce the incidence of child abuse? If so, would banning videogames like GTA reduce the incidence of shootings or traffic rule violations? > in my circles 'controversial sexuality' is not typical at all It seems like the author of the comment you’re replying to might be in a unique position to gauge what controversial sexuality might be of interest to your circles even if yourself aren’t privy to it due to its controversial nature.

Duennepaper 6y ago
No, my argument is, that 'freedom of speech' doesn't allow everything as the author indicates. Thats not even something i have an opinion on, the law already defines that and i highly suspect that it falls under usa laws as it does for germany. Like laws going in direction of 'proection of minors'. I'm not sure if you are allowed to just put a website online which is advocating for pedophility (lets keep the extreme to simplify). But here is where youth laws require you to make sure kids can't access it. Same goes for GTA, you also have youth laws protecting them. The author is probably part of a subcultural group of people in their own bubble. I highly doubt that his experience is in any way ever statistically relevant enough and reaches any majority at all. And just to clarify one thing: i don't care about known fetishes or weird erotica. Let people read and write what they want but its easy to cross lines in fiction you wouldn't dare in real life but starting to getting used to the thoughts, images and ideas. How do you think would freely advocate that kids should express their sexuality as it is just 'normal'? Kids which are just playing and learning and perhaps lern to touch themselves as a normal growing up process or adults sexualising those kids? No kid needs an adult supporter to learn how to masturbate and there are 1000x more important things for people to learn like taxes before they should learn how to have a very diverse sex live in their adult life. Don't get me wrong, we do put a lot of stigma on it as a society but its probably better to advocate to the adults and not to minors at all. Clear line.

devwastaken 6y ago

For something to be wrong you have to prove a harm. Limitations to speech are because the harm of that speech weighs more than the chilling effect of suppressing it. Fictional stories and images on the internet have no relationship with reality. There are no victims, there is no one harmed. You don't have to like the content, that is fine, but there is no good argument about bad morals or government intervention unless you're proving actual harm.

buisi 6y ago
I also have a dislike for punishing someone for the acts of someone else. If someone who commits a crime, just so happens to have a particular book, it doesn't mean all the owners of that particular book should be punished for their transgressions. It's an unpleasant form of collective punishment. And it means that all of them have to suffer for something which has nothing to do with them.
Duennepaper 6y ago
Sooo fictional child molesting images are okay? Rapefantasies written as books are also okay?