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When people are chronically malnourished and undernourished, they succumb to one of the many diseases swirling around. Infectious diseases or deficiency disease

When people are chronically malnourished and undernourished, they succumb to one of the many diseases swirling around. Infectious diseases or deficiency diseases or parasites. Periods labelled "famines" were not all that common, but much of the population was living in a sub-acute famine much the time, primarily for political reasons (power imbalances, unelightened decision-makers). > how does that model explains why eastern Asian [rice-growing areas] ... where able to achieve and sustain far higher population density [than the Eurocentric examples in OP]. The average densities were higher, but until the 20th century, with Beijing* as the primary exception, big cities were in Western Asia, North Africa, and Europe.[1] Many infectious diseases probably need "point" (small area) population sizes greater than those of the villages prevalent in rice-growing areas to take hold. Rice rulers could afford to burn a village to the ground if there were reports of spreading sickness in it. They'd only lose a small fraction of their tax base, which would soon be replaced. Rulers of large cities, not so much. Why did rice-growing areas have villages while wheat areas developed cities? I don't know. Possibly something to do with wheat being being grown in drier areas so it could be stored for years without rotting, making large centralised granaries possible. * And a few other North China cities. I know very little about Beijing, but I don't think the climate there is suitable for rice. 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_throughout_history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_cities_through...

Keysh 6y ago
> until the 20th century, with Beijing* as the primary exception, big cities were in Western Asia, North Africa, and Europe > Why did rice-growing areas have villages while wheat areas developed cities? I'm sorry but that's simply untrue. There were lots of cities in premodern China. Urbanization probably got started earlier in the Near East, which is why you get early large cities there, but even in the list you link to, from ca. 1000 BC on there are basically always one or more Chinese cities in the list: Haojing, Luoyan, Xiadu, Chang'an/Xian, Nanjing, Kaifeng, Hangzou, .... (And this is ignoring other large cities that were never the largest like Guangzhou.) (Beijing doesn't become really significant until the Mongol Yuan dynasty makes it their capital in the 13th Century.)

Keysh 6y ago

> until the 20th century, with Beijing* as the primary exception, big cities were in Western Asia, North Africa, and Europe > Why did rice-growing areas have villages while wheat areas developed cities? I'm sorry but that's simply untrue. There were lots of cities in premodern China. Urbanization probably got started earlier in the Near East, which is why you get early large cities there, but even in the list you link to, from ca. 1000 BC on there are basically always one or more Chinese cities in the list: Haojing, Luoyan, Xiadu, Chang'an/Xian, Nanjing, Kaifeng, Hangzou, .... (And this is ignoring other large cities that were never the largest like Guangzhou.) (Beijing doesn't become really significant until the Mongol Yuan dynasty makes it their capital in the 13th Century.)