4 ms·

Accessible and reasonably good NYT article: https://archive.md/5nWok https://archive.md/5nWok (https://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/10/health/a-breakthrough-against-

Accessible and reasonably good NYT article: https://archive.md/5nWok https://archive.md/5nWok (https://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/10/health/a-breakthrough-against-leukemia-using-altered-t-cells.html https://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/10/health/a-breakthrough-aga...) And as of 2019, the patient is still cancer free: https://emilywhiteheadfoundation.org/news/celebrating-7-years-cancer-free-2/ https://emilywhiteheadfoundation.org/news/celebrating-7-year...

dataflow 6y ago
A bit off-topic, but any idea how much it costs to get an experimental treatment like this?
- someperson 6y ago
  The NYT article I linked to actually has two pages. The second page goes into more details on cost. Here's a direct link to both pages of the article: https://archive.md/Fwyo0 https://archive.md/Fwyo0 Here's the relevant quote: > The Pennsylvania researchers said they were surprised to find any big drug company interested in their work, because a new batch of T-cells must be created for each patient — a far cry from the familiar commercial strategy of developing products like Viagra or cholesterol medicines, in which millions of people take the same drug. > But Mr. Hoppenot said Novartis was taking a different path with cancer drugs, looking for treatments that would have a big, unmistakable impact on a small number of patients. Such home-run drugs can be approved more quickly and efficiently, he said, with smaller studies than are needed for drugs with less obvious benefits. > “The economic model is totally acceptable,” Mr. Hoppenot said. > But such drugs tend to be extremely expensive. A prime example is the Novartis drug Gleevec, which won rapid approval in 2001 for use against certain types of leukemia and gastrointestinal tumors. It can cost more than $5,000 a month, depending on the dosage. > Dr. June said that producing engineered T-cells costs about $20,000 per patient — far less than the cost of a bone-marrow transplant. Scaling up the procedure should make it even less expensive, he said, but he added, “Our costs do not include any profit margin, facility depreciation costs or other clinical care costs, and other research costs.”
  - dataflow 6y ago
    Wow, thanks! $20k is lower than I expected! I guess when they add in the other costs it will be a fair bit higher, but still.
    - justinclift 6y ago
      Might still be reasonably priced if/when it's available in countries other than the US? Specifically, countries that don't have a broken extremely-overinflated-pricing model for health care.
    - someperson 6y ago
      Yeah $20,000 seems very cheap for such a treatment. Also there are biohackers who synthesize their own insulin and even COVID-19 vaccines and test it on themselves. Their work may cause them more harm than good, but it's their bodies and they're free to experiment on it however they choose. When somebody has a terminal illness and is facing imminent death the risk calculus is very different where even taking the bargain basement biohacker version of a medication may make sense. (Though obviously this particular treatment is a bit different because it uses a modified HIV virus)
      - tkinom 6y ago
        Software Define Drug? Similar to Software Define Radio. Not sure if it good or bad...
    - refurb 6y ago
      CAR-T (programmed t-cells for blood cancer) are around $400-500k not including the cost of harvesting and implanting them back into the patient.

dataflow 6y ago

A bit off-topic, but any idea how much it costs to get an experimental treatment like this?

someperson 6y ago
The NYT article I linked to actually has two pages. The second page goes into more details on cost. Here's a direct link to both pages of the article: https://archive.md/Fwyo0 https://archive.md/Fwyo0 Here's the relevant quote: > The Pennsylvania researchers said they were surprised to find any big drug company interested in their work, because a new batch of T-cells must be created for each patient — a far cry from the familiar commercial strategy of developing products like Viagra or cholesterol medicines, in which millions of people take the same drug. > But Mr. Hoppenot said Novartis was taking a different path with cancer drugs, looking for treatments that would have a big, unmistakable impact on a small number of patients. Such home-run drugs can be approved more quickly and efficiently, he said, with smaller studies than are needed for drugs with less obvious benefits. > “The economic model is totally acceptable,” Mr. Hoppenot said. > But such drugs tend to be extremely expensive. A prime example is the Novartis drug Gleevec, which won rapid approval in 2001 for use against certain types of leukemia and gastrointestinal tumors. It can cost more than $5,000 a month, depending on the dosage. > Dr. June said that producing engineered T-cells costs about $20,000 per patient — far less than the cost of a bone-marrow transplant. Scaling up the procedure should make it even less expensive, he said, but he added, “Our costs do not include any profit margin, facility depreciation costs or other clinical care costs, and other research costs.”
- dataflow 6y ago
  Wow, thanks! $20k is lower than I expected! I guess when they add in the other costs it will be a fair bit higher, but still.
  - justinclift 6y ago
    Might still be reasonably priced if/when it's available in countries other than the US? Specifically, countries that don't have a broken extremely-overinflated-pricing model for health care.
  - someperson 6y ago
    Yeah $20,000 seems very cheap for such a treatment. Also there are biohackers who synthesize their own insulin and even COVID-19 vaccines and test it on themselves. Their work may cause them more harm than good, but it's their bodies and they're free to experiment on it however they choose. When somebody has a terminal illness and is facing imminent death the risk calculus is very different where even taking the bargain basement biohacker version of a medication may make sense. (Though obviously this particular treatment is a bit different because it uses a modified HIV virus)
    - tkinom 6y ago
      Software Define Drug? Similar to Software Define Radio. Not sure if it good or bad...
  - refurb 6y ago
    CAR-T (programmed t-cells for blood cancer) are around $400-500k not including the cost of harvesting and implanting them back into the patient.