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> We should be pushing everyone toward efficient online self-service first I was with you until that statement. If we push online, self-service first, then th

by mankyd 6y ago

> We should be pushing everyone toward efficient online self-service first I was with you until that statement. If we push online, self-service first, then the offline, in person services will languish. This is what OP was driving at. Establish effective offline services _first_, with the intention of online, self-service, and you will end up in a place that better serves everyone.

alpaca128 6y ago
A few months ago I had to go fetch a simple registration form. Usually a matter of like 15 minutes at rush hour. Due to the pandemic, they had strict rules and required me to first book an appointment one week later for a specific time slot. Reserving that time slot was only possible via phone call. So I basically had to wait a full week for a one-page printout with a stamp on it. Should this be possible offline? Yes, but why not save most people the drive and waiting times if this could also be done instantly via a simple digital signature?
- mankyd 6y ago
  I am not suggesting that online, self-serve shouldn't exist. I am not even suggesting that we shouldn't encourage them. I am merely pointing out that we can't implement those _first_ at what will inevitably be the expense of in-person services where needed. Develop the paper forms. Figure out what needs an gov't employee or other official to help with the necessary steps. _Then_ offer complementary self-serve options that can streamline the process.
  - QuercusMax 6y ago
    In-person doesn't mean that paper forms are required. Self-service kiosks are a perfectly reasonable way to support in-person needs, and that way all the information will flow into the system the same way: digitally. It's 2021. Why are we still talking about paper forms for government functions?
    - mankyd 6y ago
      >In-person doesn't mean that paper forms are required. Agreed. All I am really advocating for is that we don't expect people to have sign into a website from a computer/phone at home. Some people don't have that luxury. > Self-service kiosks are a perfectly reasonable way to support in-person needs That isn't true. A very significant portion of the population needs help with these systems. Hell, I had to order a hamburger from a fast food restaurant one time, and I was intimidated and confused, (I at least got my food eventually). Most the customers who came in tried to avoid the system and went straight to the cashier.
      - nicoburns 6y ago
        > Agreed. All I am really advocating for is that we don't expect people to have sign into a website from a computer/phone at home. Some people don't have that luxury. We could set it up so that everybody does. Public libraries have traditionally been great at this, although they could certainly do with more funding.

by mankyd 6y ago

alpaca128 6y ago

A few months ago I had to go fetch a simple registration form. Usually a matter of like 15 minutes at rush hour. Due to the pandemic, they had strict rules and required me to first book an appointment one week later for a specific time slot. Reserving that time slot was only possible via phone call. So I basically had to wait a full week for a one-page printout with a stamp on it. Should this be possible offline? Yes, but why not save most people the drive and waiting times if this could also be done instantly via a simple digital signature?

mankyd 6y ago
I am not suggesting that online, self-serve shouldn't exist. I am not even suggesting that we shouldn't encourage them. I am merely pointing out that we can't implement those _first_ at what will inevitably be the expense of in-person services where needed. Develop the paper forms. Figure out what needs an gov't employee or other official to help with the necessary steps. _Then_ offer complementary self-serve options that can streamline the process.
- QuercusMax 6y ago
  In-person doesn't mean that paper forms are required. Self-service kiosks are a perfectly reasonable way to support in-person needs, and that way all the information will flow into the system the same way: digitally. It's 2021. Why are we still talking about paper forms for government functions?
  - mankyd 6y ago
    >In-person doesn't mean that paper forms are required. Agreed. All I am really advocating for is that we don't expect people to have sign into a website from a computer/phone at home. Some people don't have that luxury. > Self-service kiosks are a perfectly reasonable way to support in-person needs That isn't true. A very significant portion of the population needs help with these systems. Hell, I had to order a hamburger from a fast food restaurant one time, and I was intimidated and confused, (I at least got my food eventually). Most the customers who came in tried to avoid the system and went straight to the cashier.
    - nicoburns 6y ago
      > Agreed. All I am really advocating for is that we don't expect people to have sign into a website from a computer/phone at home. Some people don't have that luxury. We could set it up so that everybody does. Public libraries have traditionally been great at this, although they could certainly do with more funding.