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A common retort would be "not my home/car" but societies march onwards to the majority of people renting everything, including cars. So maybe not your house or

by ehnto 6y ago

A common retort would be "not my home/car" but societies march onwards to the majority of people renting everything, including cars. So maybe not your house or your car, but most people's, which is a dangerous situation for many to be in. Imagine a slumlord raising rents on a whole building and the computer automatically locking out anyone who doesn't pay, or failing a payment on your car rental when you're away from home and it remotely locking in the middle of nowhere. These systems will be automated, taking any last shimmer of empathy away and abstracting the owners from the renters via a faceless software layer. If we are not careful we will end up with a software enabled split society of owners vs renters, where neither interacts with the other and the system is void of any humility or empathy. That isn't something "the market" can protect against in my opinion, the market will optimize toward monetary efficiency and renters hold no power to influence it. You can't just "find another house" when all properties are owned by the same class enacting the same will.

nicbou 6y ago
This reminds me of Grapes of Wrath. The banks are these distant things that aren't a single person you can reason or fight with. Their agents absolve themselves of any responsibility, and just fulfil the will of The Bank. It's pictured like a monster that everyone feeds but no one controls. It really stuck with me and resurfaces often. https://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/g/the-grapes-of-wrath/summary-and-analysis/chapter-5 https://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/g/the-grapes-of-wrath...
- ehnto 6y ago
  Reminds me of a past encounter at the bank. It felt like the agent had no agency over the "system". They didn't know what the outcome of the application would be, they barely had control over the interface and before I know it, by simply asking a question of the agent my credit rating had been demerited. As if I had angered the system for daring to ask. The agent was very apologetic but incapable of helping, as if apologizing for a beligerent master.
  - nicbou 6y ago
    I also get that a lot. When there's an invoicing issue with a partner, they won't fix it if their system won't allow them, and I'm expected to eat the cost for unpaid VAT. I have to not-so-subtly remind them that their inflexible software is not my problem, and that I won't bear the cost of its shortfalls.
- throwaway81523 6y ago
  > This reminds me of Grapes of Wrath. It reminds me of The Diamond Age ;-). "What's the, uh, strategy for making sure people actually, you know, show up when they're supposed to show up?" Bud said. At this point the banker lost interest in the proceedings, straightened up, strolled around his desk, and sat down, staring out the window across the water toward Pudong and Shanghai. "That detail is not covered in the brochure," he said, "as most of our prospective customers do not share your diligent attention to detail insofar as that aspect of the arrangement is concerned." He exhaled through his nose, like a man eager not to smell something, and adjusted his goatee one time. "The enforcement regime consists of three phases. We have pleasant names for them, of course, but you might think of them, respectively, as: one, a polite reminder; two, well in excess of your pain threshold; three, spectacularly fatal."
fy20 6y ago
> remotely locking in the middle of nowhere It doesn't even need to do that to cause problems. Most likely someone will decide that it should phone home to check the user is allowed access everytime you start the vehicle, and if it can't, well no driving for you today. https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/306338-phone-app-rental-car-stranded-california-boondocks https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/306338-phone-app-rental-...
masklinn 6y ago
> A common retort would be "not my home/car" but societies march onwards to the majority of people renting everything, including cars. Renting is not even a factor. Tesla can and will locate, unlock, and back out of parking (possibly out of your property) your car remotely for the convenience of the repo man they send if you’re behind on payments. If they achieve FSD the car will probably just drive away as soon as it’s able to.

by ehnto 6y ago

nicbou 6y ago

This reminds me of Grapes of Wrath. The banks are these distant things that aren't a single person you can reason or fight with. Their agents absolve themselves of any responsibility, and just fulfil the will of The Bank. It's pictured like a monster that everyone feeds but no one controls. It really stuck with me and resurfaces often. https://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/g/the-grapes-of-wrath/summary-and-analysis/chapter-5 https://www.cliffsnotes.com/literature/g/the-grapes-of-wrath...

ehnto 6y ago
Reminds me of a past encounter at the bank. It felt like the agent had no agency over the "system". They didn't know what the outcome of the application would be, they barely had control over the interface and before I know it, by simply asking a question of the agent my credit rating had been demerited. As if I had angered the system for daring to ask. The agent was very apologetic but incapable of helping, as if apologizing for a beligerent master.
- nicbou 6y ago
  I also get that a lot. When there's an invoicing issue with a partner, they won't fix it if their system won't allow them, and I'm expected to eat the cost for unpaid VAT. I have to not-so-subtly remind them that their inflexible software is not my problem, and that I won't bear the cost of its shortfalls.
throwaway81523 6y ago
> This reminds me of Grapes of Wrath. It reminds me of The Diamond Age ;-). "What's the, uh, strategy for making sure people actually, you know, show up when they're supposed to show up?" Bud said. At this point the banker lost interest in the proceedings, straightened up, strolled around his desk, and sat down, staring out the window across the water toward Pudong and Shanghai. "That detail is not covered in the brochure," he said, "as most of our prospective customers do not share your diligent attention to detail insofar as that aspect of the arrangement is concerned." He exhaled through his nose, like a man eager not to smell something, and adjusted his goatee one time. "The enforcement regime consists of three phases. We have pleasant names for them, of course, but you might think of them, respectively, as: one, a polite reminder; two, well in excess of your pain threshold; three, spectacularly fatal."

fy20 6y ago

> remotely locking in the middle of nowhere It doesn't even need to do that to cause problems. Most likely someone will decide that it should phone home to check the user is allowed access everytime you start the vehicle, and if it can't, well no driving for you today. https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/306338-phone-app-rental-car-stranded-california-boondocks https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/306338-phone-app-rental-...

masklinn 6y ago

> A common retort would be "not my home/car" but societies march onwards to the majority of people renting everything, including cars. Renting is not even a factor. Tesla can and will locate, unlock, and back out of parking (possibly out of your property) your car remotely for the convenience of the repo man they send if you’re behind on payments. If they achieve FSD the car will probably just drive away as soon as it’s able to.