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No mentions of the carbon footprint reduction these LED allow: https://www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/research/impact-bartlett/impact-our-research/reduction-uk-carbon

No mentions of the carbon footprint reduction these LED allow: https://www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/research/impact-bartlett/impact-our-research/reduction-uk-carbon-emissions-through-use-white-light https://www.ucl.ac.uk/bartlett/research/impact-bartlett/impa... In the UK in 2005, there were 8.12 million lighting points on the country’s streets using approximately 3.14 TWh of electricity, meaning CO2 emissions of 1.32 megatons. 6.31 million of these lighting points were streetlights. Bartlett research found that lower levels of brightness are required for white streetlights than for yellow sodium vapour lights. Switching led to energy savings of 30–40%.

mattmanser 6y ago
They're not pleasant to live around. They switched ours over a few years ago. Couple of things that bug me, they break your body out of it's natural rhythms, I find they really wake me up when I'm out late. They also mean everyone living near one has to go out and buy blackout curtains.
- londons_explore 6y ago
  Agreed - the white streetlights are worse overall. They're substantially dimmer, making safe driving more difficult and dark streets more scary. They are actually far less efficient than the classic orange sodium vapor lights when measured in terms of lumens/watt. I would guess they're white just because white LED's are now the cheapest colour, and whichever company was paid to do a study was given criteria to ensure they came out looking best. The study probably also took manufacturers claims of "100,000 hours lifespan" at face value, despite the fact half of them in my street have failed in under 2 years, which should have been detected in a small scale trial first... At least they don't PWM flash...
- Angostura 6y ago
  I've had them in our place in the UK for a few years. A bit weird for the first few months, but soon got used to them. The benefits far outweigh the problems and it's one the of the more minor changes we are going to have to make to the way we live if we re going to have any hope of curtailing climate change.
  - waterheater 6y ago
    >The benefits far outweigh the problems and it's one the of the more minor changes we are going to have to make to the way we live if we re going to have any hope of curtailing climate change. Surely this position is not absolute? Indeed, the most effective way to eliminate human-induced climate change is to, well, eliminate those causing it. In your view, can any attempt to curtail climate change be justified? I'm genuinely curious and mean no disrespect, should you feel such.
    - Angostura 6y ago
      > In your view, can any attempt to curtail climate change be justified? I'm genuinely curious and mean no disrespect, should you feel such. That'a actually a really interesting question. Clearly there are quite a few "finally solutions" I would put entirely off-limits - mass slaughter, compulsory sterilisation or contraceptives. Outlawing meat? Nope. But I think there's quite a few possibilities between 'lets kill people' at the one end of the spectrum and 'lets change the light bulbs in public street lighting, even if it's a bit harsh' at the other.
  - mattmanser 6y ago
    The irony of this comment is that they're very bad for local wildlife, so ecologically damaging in another way. Now we get birds doing their morning call at 2/3/4am.
evanlivingston 6y ago
I'm sure there's something out there, but something I haven't seen is a breakdown of the environmental impact for _producing_ the LED lighting versus the alternatives. I'd be interested to see that.
spoonjim 6y ago
You can have yellow LEDs as a middle ground.

mattmanser 6y ago

They're not pleasant to live around. They switched ours over a few years ago. Couple of things that bug me, they break your body out of it's natural rhythms, I find they really wake me up when I'm out late. They also mean everyone living near one has to go out and buy blackout curtains.

londons_explore 6y ago
Agreed - the white streetlights are worse overall. They're substantially dimmer, making safe driving more difficult and dark streets more scary. They are actually far less efficient than the classic orange sodium vapor lights when measured in terms of lumens/watt. I would guess they're white just because white LED's are now the cheapest colour, and whichever company was paid to do a study was given criteria to ensure they came out looking best. The study probably also took manufacturers claims of "100,000 hours lifespan" at face value, despite the fact half of them in my street have failed in under 2 years, which should have been detected in a small scale trial first... At least they don't PWM flash...
Angostura 6y ago
I've had them in our place in the UK for a few years. A bit weird for the first few months, but soon got used to them. The benefits far outweigh the problems and it's one the of the more minor changes we are going to have to make to the way we live if we re going to have any hope of curtailing climate change.
- waterheater 6y ago
  >The benefits far outweigh the problems and it's one the of the more minor changes we are going to have to make to the way we live if we re going to have any hope of curtailing climate change. Surely this position is not absolute? Indeed, the most effective way to eliminate human-induced climate change is to, well, eliminate those causing it. In your view, can any attempt to curtail climate change be justified? I'm genuinely curious and mean no disrespect, should you feel such.
  - Angostura 6y ago
    > In your view, can any attempt to curtail climate change be justified? I'm genuinely curious and mean no disrespect, should you feel such. That'a actually a really interesting question. Clearly there are quite a few "finally solutions" I would put entirely off-limits - mass slaughter, compulsory sterilisation or contraceptives. Outlawing meat? Nope. But I think there's quite a few possibilities between 'lets kill people' at the one end of the spectrum and 'lets change the light bulbs in public street lighting, even if it's a bit harsh' at the other.
- mattmanser 6y ago
  The irony of this comment is that they're very bad for local wildlife, so ecologically damaging in another way. Now we get birds doing their morning call at 2/3/4am.

evanlivingston 6y ago

I'm sure there's something out there, but something I haven't seen is a breakdown of the environmental impact for _producing_ the LED lighting versus the alternatives. I'd be interested to see that.

spoonjim 6y ago

You can have yellow LEDs as a middle ground.