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Hello again HN! 12 months ago I told you LitiHolo (I’m the founder) was working to create a 3D Hologram Printer, and asked for your input. Well, we built it! I

Hello again HN! 12 months ago I told you LitiHolo (I’m the founder) was working to create a 3D Hologram Printer, and asked for your input. Well, we built it! I've been involved with hologram printers all the way back to my grad school days (MIT Media Lab), and have built custom industrial versions for in-house commercial hologram work. But more recently LitiHolo has been focused on simple educational holograms kits. With this 3D Hologram Printer, we are kind of bringing the two together -- a simple hologram printer that makes the technology more affordable and accessible. These are true laser-recorded holograms, and we are starting small and simple to get things off the ground (think Makerbot for holograms). Would love your feedback on how we can continue to make hologram technology like this more accessible, as well as ideas for possible killer apps and use cases. Here's our previous HN post from 12 months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22616010 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22616010 And full disclosure: we have launched a Kickstarter project for this, but would appreciate your input whether you back the project or not.

ACAVJW4H 6y ago
Good luck on your kickstarter. Hope you guys achieve your goals and ship this amazing tech! I tried searching for the term "hogel size" I assume it is somewhat equivalent to resolution. Can you expand on it and tell us what are the limiting factors around resolution and how it can be improved in the future? I am now curious how commercial sticker size holograms are printed.
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  Thanks! The hogel size is physically determined by things like the aperture size (in our case 1x1mm to start, with a stretch goal for 0.5x0.5mm), but also laser power, and just how long it takes to print each hogel and as a result the full hologram. Double the resolution is 4X the number of hogels.
detritus 6y ago
Two suggestions for your site: • Knock off the first 30 seconds of your 'interior shots' video where the machine is presumably registering itself. I don't much care about that :) • Show the resultant printed film from the side on somewhere, so we can see how thin it is. From first glance, I got the impression the output was quite thick, whereas apparently it's only 16 microns (taken from your spec sheet). It might seem obvious to you, but it wasn't here and I think would be much more impressive. Neat tech, I've forwarded it to someone who might have use for it. Good luck!
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  Thanks! The film plates are on 2mm thick glass, and the actual holographic recording layer is 16 microns, with a coversheet material over that.
  - detritus 6y ago
    Can the layers be side-illuminated? If so, could these be layered, with some compensation for angle employed to account for depth, allowing you do fake RGB? ed - eg. each 16 micron sheet is side-illuminated with a specific colour, and then three or more holographic sheets are embedded in between the glass plate and cover?
    - hologram-paul 6y ago
      Our LitiHolo hologram film is full-color sensitive, and the finished holograms are transparent, so layer is possible. We've started with a printer that is single-color initially to get this off the ground, but eventually we would like to have a full-color version of the printer in the future with RGB recording directly in one layer.
  - ALittleLight 6y ago
    I agree with the feedback of having a picture better capture the thickness of the holograph plate (or whole assembly, whatever that's called). From the Buzz Lightyear picture I got the impression that it would be something like a thick picture frame, but that doesn't match the 2mm description. Would it be possible to use these as badge photos? I feel like it would be pretty cool to have a hologram picture on your badge.
    - hologram-paul 6y ago
      The glass film plates keep the film stabilized for the hologram exposures, but it is possible to peel the film off after recording the holograms. Will work on seeing if we can get better imagery of the hologram thickness.
    - 6y ago
toast0 6y ago
I know I don't have the patience/dexterity/not knocking the table over to use the hologram kits, and the printer is not in my budget, but I would love to see some of the finished (developed?) holograms. You might consider selling some of those?
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  Good idea! And I'm also expecting that some of the people who do get the 3D Hologram Printer will be selling holograms of their 3D holograms as art, portraits, etc.
flir 6y ago
This is a transmission hologram, not a reflection hologram, right?
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  These are reflection holograms. Also sometimes called white-light holograms because they can be viewed with a regular spot light, sunlight, or even a smartphone flashlight.
  - flir 6y ago
    That's cool. You should make that clear on the website, I definitely got the impression from the photos that they were in a frame.
    - hologram-paul 6y ago
      Thanks! Will see how to highlight that better.
yummypaint 6y ago
I remember once seeing a hologram of a microscope where if you put your eye in the right spot you could see the item under magnification. Would something like that be possible with this system? Another thing that comes to mind is pairing this with some kind of computational holographic camera or something using those awesome new imaging TOF range sensors. Being able to make semi-instant holographic polaroids would probably capture people's imaginations.
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  The microscope hologram is a cool one! Could definitely do something like that with our 3D Hologram Printer. One of the other very memorable holograms out there is the Kiss, which is also possible (see our Kiss demo hologram). I think holographic cameras would certainly be something that would be in the future for us. Glad to see you are already looking there!
- EvanAnderson 6y ago
  The (sadly closed) Museum of Holography in Chicago had a similar hologram with a telescope you could "look through". I saw it once nearly 20 years ago, but the memory is burned into my brain. I would love to see it again, if only just to have that strange feeling of my perception being twisted again.
  - pontifier 6y ago
    Definitely a formational memory for me as well. There was a hologram gallery in a mall in Orem, Utah in the early 90's. I spent hours in there, but could never afford to buy one. I wish these were more available. I did manage to buy one about 10 years ago, but sadly it was lost in a move. I really need to acquire a bunch for the science museum I'm going to open. Will probably need a bunch of kits as well. This is the sort of thing that can change someone's life as a child. There's no replacement for that sense of wonder.
    - hologram-paul 6y ago
      I agree that holograms have a way of grabbing kids' imaginations! Perhaps you could get a 3D Hologram Printer as well and make your own hologram exhibit for the science museum. So the next generation of kids can get hooked.
primitivesuave 6y ago
This is a super cool project and I will definitely be buying one. However, I've been burned too many times on Kickstarter hardware projects (most spectacular loss was the Lily Camera) - nowadays I just pay the premium for a guaranteed shipping date. Some companies like Glowforge actually handled multiple delivery delays quite well, and raised venture capital so they wouldn't have to touch Kickstarter funds for overhead costs. Excited to follow your project and eventually have one sitting in my workshop!
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  Thanks! We really do want to do this the right way, and grow the hologram community long term. Let me know if you know anyone at Glowforge that could be a guide through the process. Always good to be able to bounce things off someone who's been there.
JohnHaugeland 6y ago
never got an answer back when i contacted you a year ago to see if this could be used for casting holograms into chocolate
- hologram-paul 6y ago
  Sorry about that, it has been a crazy year, and things have fallen through the cracks occasionally. The holograms with our film do not form surface relief patterns, and would not work for the "press the hologram into chocolate" idea. However, existing embossed holograms do have the surface relief and can be used for this.

ACAVJW4H 6y ago

Good luck on your kickstarter. Hope you guys achieve your goals and ship this amazing tech! I tried searching for the term "hogel size" I assume it is somewhat equivalent to resolution. Can you expand on it and tell us what are the limiting factors around resolution and how it can be improved in the future? I am now curious how commercial sticker size holograms are printed.

hologram-paul 6y ago
Thanks! The hogel size is physically determined by things like the aperture size (in our case 1x1mm to start, with a stretch goal for 0.5x0.5mm), but also laser power, and just how long it takes to print each hogel and as a result the full hologram. Double the resolution is 4X the number of hogels.

detritus 6y ago

Two suggestions for your site: • Knock off the first 30 seconds of your 'interior shots' video where the machine is presumably registering itself. I don't much care about that :) • Show the resultant printed film from the side on somewhere, so we can see how thin it is. From first glance, I got the impression the output was quite thick, whereas apparently it's only 16 microns (taken from your spec sheet). It might seem obvious to you, but it wasn't here and I think would be much more impressive. Neat tech, I've forwarded it to someone who might have use for it. Good luck!

hologram-paul 6y ago
Thanks! The film plates are on 2mm thick glass, and the actual holographic recording layer is 16 microns, with a coversheet material over that.
- detritus 6y ago
  Can the layers be side-illuminated? If so, could these be layered, with some compensation for angle employed to account for depth, allowing you do fake RGB? ed - eg. each 16 micron sheet is side-illuminated with a specific colour, and then three or more holographic sheets are embedded in between the glass plate and cover?
  - hologram-paul 6y ago
    Our LitiHolo hologram film is full-color sensitive, and the finished holograms are transparent, so layer is possible. We've started with a printer that is single-color initially to get this off the ground, but eventually we would like to have a full-color version of the printer in the future with RGB recording directly in one layer.
- ALittleLight 6y ago
  I agree with the feedback of having a picture better capture the thickness of the holograph plate (or whole assembly, whatever that's called). From the Buzz Lightyear picture I got the impression that it would be something like a thick picture frame, but that doesn't match the 2mm description. Would it be possible to use these as badge photos? I feel like it would be pretty cool to have a hologram picture on your badge.
  - hologram-paul 6y ago
    The glass film plates keep the film stabilized for the hologram exposures, but it is possible to peel the film off after recording the holograms. Will work on seeing if we can get better imagery of the hologram thickness.
  - 6y ago

toast0 6y ago

I know I don't have the patience/dexterity/not knocking the table over to use the hologram kits, and the printer is not in my budget, but I would love to see some of the finished (developed?) holograms. You might consider selling some of those?

hologram-paul 6y ago
Good idea! And I'm also expecting that some of the people who do get the 3D Hologram Printer will be selling holograms of their 3D holograms as art, portraits, etc.

flir 6y ago

This is a transmission hologram, not a reflection hologram, right?

hologram-paul 6y ago
These are reflection holograms. Also sometimes called white-light holograms because they can be viewed with a regular spot light, sunlight, or even a smartphone flashlight.
- flir 6y ago
  That's cool. You should make that clear on the website, I definitely got the impression from the photos that they were in a frame.
  - hologram-paul 6y ago
    Thanks! Will see how to highlight that better.

yummypaint 6y ago

I remember once seeing a hologram of a microscope where if you put your eye in the right spot you could see the item under magnification. Would something like that be possible with this system? Another thing that comes to mind is pairing this with some kind of computational holographic camera or something using those awesome new imaging TOF range sensors. Being able to make semi-instant holographic polaroids would probably capture people's imaginations.

hologram-paul 6y ago
The microscope hologram is a cool one! Could definitely do something like that with our 3D Hologram Printer. One of the other very memorable holograms out there is the Kiss, which is also possible (see our Kiss demo hologram). I think holographic cameras would certainly be something that would be in the future for us. Glad to see you are already looking there!
EvanAnderson 6y ago
The (sadly closed) Museum of Holography in Chicago had a similar hologram with a telescope you could "look through". I saw it once nearly 20 years ago, but the memory is burned into my brain. I would love to see it again, if only just to have that strange feeling of my perception being twisted again.
- pontifier 6y ago
  Definitely a formational memory for me as well. There was a hologram gallery in a mall in Orem, Utah in the early 90's. I spent hours in there, but could never afford to buy one. I wish these were more available. I did manage to buy one about 10 years ago, but sadly it was lost in a move. I really need to acquire a bunch for the science museum I'm going to open. Will probably need a bunch of kits as well. This is the sort of thing that can change someone's life as a child. There's no replacement for that sense of wonder.
  - hologram-paul 6y ago
    I agree that holograms have a way of grabbing kids' imaginations! Perhaps you could get a 3D Hologram Printer as well and make your own hologram exhibit for the science museum. So the next generation of kids can get hooked.

primitivesuave 6y ago

This is a super cool project and I will definitely be buying one. However, I've been burned too many times on Kickstarter hardware projects (most spectacular loss was the Lily Camera) - nowadays I just pay the premium for a guaranteed shipping date. Some companies like Glowforge actually handled multiple delivery delays quite well, and raised venture capital so they wouldn't have to touch Kickstarter funds for overhead costs. Excited to follow your project and eventually have one sitting in my workshop!

hologram-paul 6y ago
Thanks! We really do want to do this the right way, and grow the hologram community long term. Let me know if you know anyone at Glowforge that could be a guide through the process. Always good to be able to bounce things off someone who's been there.

JohnHaugeland 6y ago

never got an answer back when i contacted you a year ago to see if this could be used for casting holograms into chocolate

hologram-paul 6y ago
Sorry about that, it has been a crazy year, and things have fallen through the cracks occasionally. The holograms with our film do not form surface relief patterns, and would not work for the "press the hologram into chocolate" idea. However, existing embossed holograms do have the surface relief and can be used for this.