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I recall LINE having indicators similar to WhatsApp for conversations stating that they were end-to-end encrypted - was that all a complete lie? Or are there si

I recall LINE having indicators similar to WhatsApp for conversations stating that they were end-to-end encrypted - was that all a complete lie? Or are there side-channels enough that it's technically true but practically meaningless? Also, for anyone who doesn't know, LINE is ubiquitous in East Asia and parts of South East Asia. In Japan and Korea, everyone and their grandmother are there. Not being on LINE here is "worse" than not being on FB in the west.

deepstack 6y ago
icons!
wodenokoto 6y ago
According to the other story on the front page earlier today about this, the messages are encrypted but the firm had access to user information - name, email phone number. That kind of stuff. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26488445 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26488445 On a different note: Has KakaoTalk gone out of fashion in korea? I thought line was mostly Japan and Taiwan and korea was KakaoTalk, China WeChat and everywhere else WhatsApp. But I have noticed line appearing in some never kdramas.
- terrorOf 6y ago
  Japanese indeed are very (or overly) cautious anything related to their personal information. They'd react overly especially when it comes to anything related to South Korea for certain obvious reasons. Their media depicts anything about Korea very bad (or the worst thing ever). So nothing to see here, move along.
- Legogris 6y ago
  It's a couple of years since I spent extended time there, but if there's anything I know it's that Koreans move fast, so I wouldn't be surprised if I'm slightly off there. It's absolutely the case in Japan, though. LINE is bigger than WhatsApp in Taiwan and I think Thailand, though.
  - philliphaydon 6y ago
    I’ve never met anyone in Thailand or Taiwan who don’t use LINE. It’s also my primary messaging app. What’s App is only used for business stuff in Singapore.
- viceroyalbean 6y ago
  LINE has never had any significant market share in Korea, it's 100% Kakaotalk. LINE does have a large amount of development going on in Korea, however.
  - Agentlien 6y ago
    That's interesting. I recently noticed LINE showing up in a number of Korean shows on Netflix and I wondered how popular it was over there.
    - terrorOf 6y ago
      That isn't popular in South Korea. It is pretty much that there are people who don't use Line but there is no one who doesn't use KakaoTalk.
    - viceroyalbean 6y ago
      I wonder if it's actually an indication of how unknown it is. Korean media is usually very precise with showing brands - if you can see a logo it's almost definitely product placement. Using a relatively unknown app allows them to avoid showing something recognizable. This is just an idea though, I have no real basis for the claim. I have noticed the same thing, though.
      - wodenokoto 6y ago
        They prominently displayed the line characters, Brown and Cony in a message chat between the two main characters in 2015s "Hyde Jekyll Me" on Netflix. I doubt you'd do that as a mean to show a generic chat. I think that is more of an attempt to make inroads in Korea (or perhaps pandering to viewers outside Korea)
goatinaboat 6y ago
I recall LINE having indicators similar to WhatsApp for conversations stating that they were end-to-end encrypted - was that all a complete lie? Or are there side-channels enough that it's technically true but practically meaningless? The metadata - who talks to who and when - in many cases is more valuable to an adversary than the actual content of the messages. All the crypto in the world doesn't help once the identity of one person you associate with becomes "of interest" you are of interest too and old-fashioned methods can be used.
shantara 6y ago
End-to-end encryption doesn't matter, if the app itself is backdoored.
terrorOf 6y ago
Not Korea. KakaoTalk is told what contributed to high smartphone penetration rate among elders in Korea, because pretty much everyone in Korea uses KakaoTalk to communicate. The users of LINE are minority in Korea, mainly who have friends in other parts of Asia or so.
fomine3 6y ago
Messages are E2E encrypted by default. When a user reported abuse, messages are sent to LINE corp without E2E encryption so their employee or contracted company can read only reported message

deepstack 6y ago

icons!

wodenokoto 6y ago

According to the other story on the front page earlier today about this, the messages are encrypted but the firm had access to user information - name, email phone number. That kind of stuff. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26488445 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26488445 On a different note: Has KakaoTalk gone out of fashion in korea? I thought line was mostly Japan and Taiwan and korea was KakaoTalk, China WeChat and everywhere else WhatsApp. But I have noticed line appearing in some never kdramas.

terrorOf 6y ago
Japanese indeed are very (or overly) cautious anything related to their personal information. They'd react overly especially when it comes to anything related to South Korea for certain obvious reasons. Their media depicts anything about Korea very bad (or the worst thing ever). So nothing to see here, move along.
Legogris 6y ago
It's a couple of years since I spent extended time there, but if there's anything I know it's that Koreans move fast, so I wouldn't be surprised if I'm slightly off there. It's absolutely the case in Japan, though. LINE is bigger than WhatsApp in Taiwan and I think Thailand, though.
- philliphaydon 6y ago
  I’ve never met anyone in Thailand or Taiwan who don’t use LINE. It’s also my primary messaging app. What’s App is only used for business stuff in Singapore.
viceroyalbean 6y ago
LINE has never had any significant market share in Korea, it's 100% Kakaotalk. LINE does have a large amount of development going on in Korea, however.
- Agentlien 6y ago
  That's interesting. I recently noticed LINE showing up in a number of Korean shows on Netflix and I wondered how popular it was over there.
  - terrorOf 6y ago
    That isn't popular in South Korea. It is pretty much that there are people who don't use Line but there is no one who doesn't use KakaoTalk.
  - viceroyalbean 6y ago
    I wonder if it's actually an indication of how unknown it is. Korean media is usually very precise with showing brands - if you can see a logo it's almost definitely product placement. Using a relatively unknown app allows them to avoid showing something recognizable. This is just an idea though, I have no real basis for the claim. I have noticed the same thing, though.
    - wodenokoto 6y ago
      They prominently displayed the line characters, Brown and Cony in a message chat between the two main characters in 2015s "Hyde Jekyll Me" on Netflix. I doubt you'd do that as a mean to show a generic chat. I think that is more of an attempt to make inroads in Korea (or perhaps pandering to viewers outside Korea)

goatinaboat 6y ago

I recall LINE having indicators similar to WhatsApp for conversations stating that they were end-to-end encrypted - was that all a complete lie? Or are there side-channels enough that it's technically true but practically meaningless? The metadata - who talks to who and when - in many cases is more valuable to an adversary than the actual content of the messages. All the crypto in the world doesn't help once the identity of one person you associate with becomes "of interest" you are of interest too and old-fashioned methods can be used.

shantara 6y ago

End-to-end encryption doesn't matter, if the app itself is backdoored.

terrorOf 6y ago

Not Korea. KakaoTalk is told what contributed to high smartphone penetration rate among elders in Korea, because pretty much everyone in Korea uses KakaoTalk to communicate. The users of LINE are minority in Korea, mainly who have friends in other parts of Asia or so.

fomine3 6y ago

Messages are E2E encrypted by default. When a user reported abuse, messages are sent to LINE corp without E2E encryption so their employee or contracted company can read only reported message