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Perhaps I'm not being direct enough. In the past, through various practices and substances I experienced what felt like a complete erasure of all rules - if so

Perhaps I'm not being direct enough. In the past, through various practices and substances I experienced what felt like a complete erasure of all rules - if something could be thought, it could be made real. This spun out of control and felt extremely dangerous to me, and scared me to the point of emotional paralysis and near psychosis for months. It was not past trauma that frightened me but a complete unveiling of what seemed like infinite possibilty that my weak mind was not ready for. I hear a lot about waking up trauma and past experiences and what not and I feel I could handle these sorts of awakenings - I'm more curious about meditation opening doors to new realities that I may not be prepared for, unveiling of normally hidden layers our world, tests of death and dissolution, etc. Maybe this is the "woo" side you and the OP are talking about.

xz0r 6y ago
> In the past, through various practices and substances If you don't mind, could you mention what practices and substances are you referring to?
- colordrops 6y ago
  Mindfulness meditation as taught by Thich Nhat Hanh; pieced together practices from dozens of other meditation books. Lots of reading in philosophy. Some limited study of the occult and magick. Ritualistic psytrance parties; LSD and mushrooms.
  - bayindirh 6y ago
    Mixing practices considered harmful even if practices itself are not. Every practice regimen has a bigger system in work so, mixing and matching can create havoc on your body. Adding LSD and mushrooms on top of it is just lighting a big fire and calling storm on you. I'm not against LSD, mushrooms or other practice systems, but never seen any positive outcome from these kinds of experiments. Please, don't do it.
    - colordrops 6y ago
      Understood. This was over 20 years ago. I've been recently picking up meditation practices again and approaching them unadulterated. Focusing on a particular type of buddhist meditation at the moment.
      - bayindirh 6y ago
        Wish your practices bring you the peace and happiness you're looking for. Good luck. :)
    - kritiko 6y ago
      That seems to put a lot of faith in the claims of these systems. I get the sense that now that you can learn this stuff from the internet vs. going to live in a monastery, you get a lot more mix-n-match, even from teachers who are credentialed in a specific tradition. Michael Pollan’s How to Change Your Mind has lots of stories of people having positive psychedelic therapy, which does require essentially a spiritual guide.
      - bayindirh 6y ago
        It depends. Some systems work, some don't. Some systems work for some people, some work for others. I personally changed a lot with the help of the practice I do. I've faced my phobias, solved a lot of self-confidence issues, found out what's wrong with me. I've also got therapy before starting Zen. While it helped me somehow, it failed to solve the underlying issue. Zen helped me to tackle the underlying issue and move forward. To work with a good master, you don't need to always go to a monastery and, change your life temporarily. I left nothing behind. Still live in the city. Just go to see my master from time to time. Will continue when the pandemic ends. I had an instructor in the city, who's also a student of the same master, but he passed away due to COVID-19. Every tradition and way contains elements from each other, but these ways find the compatible combinations and way to build upon them. Also a master/student relationship helps to guide the student in the harder times. Internet doesn't provide the guidance and safeguards, unfortunately. As an instructor, I keep track of my every student independently. Otherwise, there's no meaning doing what I do. They also call me when things go awry and we work through it together, and we both learn in the process. Zen, Buddhism or anything is not the only way. There are many ways to do it.
  - Bumkatio 6y ago
    Somehow this comes across to me like you tried to fuck your reality up. I'm very curious on what was your main goal to achive?
    - colordrops 6y ago
      Good question - I didn't have a very clear goal other than to know/experience the ultimate "truth" or "nature", whatever it is, assuming it even exists. I was a very undisciplined young adult at the time.
bayindirh 6y ago
In Zen, meditation under influence is a big no so, I never had experiences like you mentioned. Interacting with hidden layers are considered advanced practice and I'm just entering these levels. To be able to cope with it you both have to be very experienced and very powerful. I still practice with my masters if I'm going to go that deep. Also, tests of death and dissolution is not something you should experience alone. It can be because of many different reasons. Everybody's experiences are different, even when faced with the same thing. So you need to get familiar with yourself first, under supervision of a more experienced instructor. My advice is not to mix meditation with substances and not try deeper practices without someone more experienced on the subject matter.
- temp0826 6y ago
  I work at an ayahuasca retreat center and personally think your practice would be a sort of super weapon when combined with the right medicine. Fully agree with you otherwise- we all carry an incredible amount of hidden traumas and they can very sneakily hold us back from our full potentials.
elbear 6y ago
If you're looking to put those experiences into a conceptual framework, I recommend Andrew Holecek's book Dreams of Light. Just be prepared to entertain the possibility that the "woo" is an accurate view of reality.

xz0r 6y ago

> In the past, through various practices and substances If you don't mind, could you mention what practices and substances are you referring to?

colordrops 6y ago
Mindfulness meditation as taught by Thich Nhat Hanh; pieced together practices from dozens of other meditation books. Lots of reading in philosophy. Some limited study of the occult and magick. Ritualistic psytrance parties; LSD and mushrooms.
- bayindirh 6y ago
  Mixing practices considered harmful even if practices itself are not. Every practice regimen has a bigger system in work so, mixing and matching can create havoc on your body. Adding LSD and mushrooms on top of it is just lighting a big fire and calling storm on you. I'm not against LSD, mushrooms or other practice systems, but never seen any positive outcome from these kinds of experiments. Please, don't do it.
  - colordrops 6y ago
    Understood. This was over 20 years ago. I've been recently picking up meditation practices again and approaching them unadulterated. Focusing on a particular type of buddhist meditation at the moment.
    - bayindirh 6y ago
      Wish your practices bring you the peace and happiness you're looking for. Good luck. :)
  - kritiko 6y ago
    That seems to put a lot of faith in the claims of these systems. I get the sense that now that you can learn this stuff from the internet vs. going to live in a monastery, you get a lot more mix-n-match, even from teachers who are credentialed in a specific tradition. Michael Pollan’s How to Change Your Mind has lots of stories of people having positive psychedelic therapy, which does require essentially a spiritual guide.
    - bayindirh 6y ago
      It depends. Some systems work, some don't. Some systems work for some people, some work for others. I personally changed a lot with the help of the practice I do. I've faced my phobias, solved a lot of self-confidence issues, found out what's wrong with me. I've also got therapy before starting Zen. While it helped me somehow, it failed to solve the underlying issue. Zen helped me to tackle the underlying issue and move forward. To work with a good master, you don't need to always go to a monastery and, change your life temporarily. I left nothing behind. Still live in the city. Just go to see my master from time to time. Will continue when the pandemic ends. I had an instructor in the city, who's also a student of the same master, but he passed away due to COVID-19. Every tradition and way contains elements from each other, but these ways find the compatible combinations and way to build upon them. Also a master/student relationship helps to guide the student in the harder times. Internet doesn't provide the guidance and safeguards, unfortunately. As an instructor, I keep track of my every student independently. Otherwise, there's no meaning doing what I do. They also call me when things go awry and we work through it together, and we both learn in the process. Zen, Buddhism or anything is not the only way. There are many ways to do it.
- Bumkatio 6y ago
  Somehow this comes across to me like you tried to fuck your reality up. I'm very curious on what was your main goal to achive?
  - colordrops 6y ago
    Good question - I didn't have a very clear goal other than to know/experience the ultimate "truth" or "nature", whatever it is, assuming it even exists. I was a very undisciplined young adult at the time.

bayindirh 6y ago

In Zen, meditation under influence is a big no so, I never had experiences like you mentioned. Interacting with hidden layers are considered advanced practice and I'm just entering these levels. To be able to cope with it you both have to be very experienced and very powerful. I still practice with my masters if I'm going to go that deep. Also, tests of death and dissolution is not something you should experience alone. It can be because of many different reasons. Everybody's experiences are different, even when faced with the same thing. So you need to get familiar with yourself first, under supervision of a more experienced instructor. My advice is not to mix meditation with substances and not try deeper practices without someone more experienced on the subject matter.

temp0826 6y ago
I work at an ayahuasca retreat center and personally think your practice would be a sort of super weapon when combined with the right medicine. Fully agree with you otherwise- we all carry an incredible amount of hidden traumas and they can very sneakily hold us back from our full potentials.

elbear 6y ago

If you're looking to put those experiences into a conceptual framework, I recommend Andrew Holecek's book Dreams of Light. Just be prepared to entertain the possibility that the "woo" is an accurate view of reality.