3 ms·

I live in a city with high rents. What would it look like if everybody had a shot at fulfilling their economic dreams? Let's say their dream is to live in the c

by pgsimp 6y ago

I live in a city with high rents. What would it look like if everybody had a shot at fulfilling their economic dreams? Let's say their dream is to live in the center of the city, in one of those flats that now cost 2 million dollars. So society is obliged to give everybody a shot at that 2 million dollar flat, no matter what their line of work or their qualifications are. How is that supposed to work? Some things still are limited and will probably always be limited, unless everybody can live in virtual reality in their ideal world.

BirdieNZ 6y ago
I don't know if this completely answers your question, but it won't be high rent if a land value tax is implemented correctly.
- pgsimp 6y ago
  How is that supposed to work? I would expect the tax to be factored into the rent?
neilparikh 6y ago
A land value tax doesn't really change the market dynamics of housing. That is to say, living in desirable locations will still cost more, and will still be allocated via a market to those who can pay the most. The key thing is that the rent you pay for locations will go to the commons, rather than private landowners, which makes sense, since locations are valuable because of all of society. So some people will still be unable to afford to live in desirable locations, just as they can't afford to live there right now. The key difference is that even if they can't afford to live there, they will still share in some of the wealth created there, through the land value tax. Effectively, those who can afford to live in the desirable locations will pay some of their rent to those who can't (indirectly).
- pgsimp 6y ago
  "living in desirable locations will still cost more, and will still be allocated via a market to those who can pay the most." But then the demand of "giving everybody a shot at what they want" is not fulfilled. The people with not a lot of money don't have a shot. "since locations are valuable because of all of society." I saw that argument in the article, but I don't really think it holds up. I would say the people making a place high value already benefit from that place, they don't need extra taxes to benefit (for example if a place is great because of nice neighbors, those neighbors already live there and therefore already benefit from the place. If shops make a place great, those shops already benefit from the people shopping there. And so on). And sometimes people make a place worse, should the tax then punish them somehow? "Effectively, those who can afford to live in the desirable locations will pay some of their rent to those who can't (indirectly)." But then not because those "others" make the place so great, so in the end, what is the rationale? Also, isn't there a ground tax already? There is in my country? I can agree that since property is a product of guns and more specifically police, and the government provides the police, some money can be asked for the service.
wait_a_minute 6y ago
Build more 2 million dollar flats. How high can we build these days? 2 million dollar flats are nice flats. Have robots and AI build as many nice flats as people want.
- pgsimp 6y ago
  The thing is that many places that are nice stop being nice when they are filled with lots of people. I like to talk about living by the sea, near a nice beach. That's a limited resource. Of course you can build skyscapers by the beach, like in this photo: https://f.vividscreen.info/soft/9eba11ee5bc029cbef496435a40f686c/Beach-With-Skyscrapers-1920x1080.jpg https://f.vividscreen.info/soft/9eba11ee5bc029cbef496435a40f... It's just not the type of beach everybody wants.

by pgsimp 6y ago

BirdieNZ 6y ago

I don't know if this completely answers your question, but it won't be high rent if a land value tax is implemented correctly.

pgsimp 6y ago
How is that supposed to work? I would expect the tax to be factored into the rent?

neilparikh 6y ago

A land value tax doesn't really change the market dynamics of housing. That is to say, living in desirable locations will still cost more, and will still be allocated via a market to those who can pay the most. The key thing is that the rent you pay for locations will go to the commons, rather than private landowners, which makes sense, since locations are valuable because of all of society. So some people will still be unable to afford to live in desirable locations, just as they can't afford to live there right now. The key difference is that even if they can't afford to live there, they will still share in some of the wealth created there, through the land value tax. Effectively, those who can afford to live in the desirable locations will pay some of their rent to those who can't (indirectly).

pgsimp 6y ago
"living in desirable locations will still cost more, and will still be allocated via a market to those who can pay the most." But then the demand of "giving everybody a shot at what they want" is not fulfilled. The people with not a lot of money don't have a shot. "since locations are valuable because of all of society." I saw that argument in the article, but I don't really think it holds up. I would say the people making a place high value already benefit from that place, they don't need extra taxes to benefit (for example if a place is great because of nice neighbors, those neighbors already live there and therefore already benefit from the place. If shops make a place great, those shops already benefit from the people shopping there. And so on). And sometimes people make a place worse, should the tax then punish them somehow? "Effectively, those who can afford to live in the desirable locations will pay some of their rent to those who can't (indirectly)." But then not because those "others" make the place so great, so in the end, what is the rationale? Also, isn't there a ground tax already? There is in my country? I can agree that since property is a product of guns and more specifically police, and the government provides the police, some money can be asked for the service.

wait_a_minute 6y ago

Build more 2 million dollar flats. How high can we build these days? 2 million dollar flats are nice flats. Have robots and AI build as many nice flats as people want.

pgsimp 6y ago
The thing is that many places that are nice stop being nice when they are filled with lots of people. I like to talk about living by the sea, near a nice beach. That's a limited resource. Of course you can build skyscapers by the beach, like in this photo: https://f.vividscreen.info/soft/9eba11ee5bc029cbef496435a40f686c/Beach-With-Skyscrapers-1920x1080.jpg https://f.vividscreen.info/soft/9eba11ee5bc029cbef496435a40f... It's just not the type of beach everybody wants.