4 ms·

Obviously VR is miles away from mainstream adoption–it’s the fusion power of computer science–but FB are mad keen on not having gatekeepers like Apple moderate

by hyko 6y ago

Obviously VR is miles away from mainstream adoption–it’s the fusion power of computer science–but FB are mad keen on not having gatekeepers like Apple moderate their power. Btw, anyone who lets FB that close to their eyeballs is a stone cold moron at this point. They couldn’t be trusted to run an online photo album, giving them the ability to actually control your sense of reality is nightmarishly awful.

m12k 6y ago
Yeah, the Quest 2 looks like a great piece of hardware, but I'm getting one if and only if a jailbreak comes out.
- pantalaimon 6y ago
  Why do you need a jailbreak? You can already install third party APKs and there is a huge SideQuest community.
  - herbst 6y ago
    Some of us avoid devices that depend on (forever changing) hacks for normal usage.
    - nomel 6y ago
      I don't think I would consider side loading with a developer account as a hack, and I don't think there's much evidence that this will change.
  - ngokevin 6y ago
    I think they're looking to kill it in favor of a sideloading channel they can control. They announced it but I forgot its name.
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  Yup. They knee-capped Quest in a really dumb way. I'm not upgrading my Quest 1 until I can buy something equivalent without forced cloud login bullshit. If I can't, I guess I'll just stay out of VR. From what I see, this is not just nerds being nerds, a lot of Quest's current user base feels the same. I'm also hoping general population is slowly discovering the flip side of shared cloud logins for unrelated services. Connecting Facebook to your Quest doesn't just mean you can VR-chat with your Facebook friends now. It also means that if Facebook automoderator doesn't like you, your Quest will turn into an expensive paperweight. Or if you break Quest ToS, you may lose your whole Facebook account with it. (What is sometimes called "digital feudalism" really does start feeling like one.)
baby 6y ago
I recommend the Oculus Quest, it’s really the best VR experience out there. If that’s not a consumer product I don’t what is...
- michaelt 6y ago
  Presumably what hyko means is: VR is much more accessible than it was 15 years ago; but VR isn't exactly common, even among the sort of dedicated PC gamers who take part in the Steam hardware survey, and it's doubtful Facebook's average user has a beefier PC than Steam's average user. So it's difficult to imagine a future where VR becomes a bigger part of Facebook's business than Facebook/IG/Whatsapp. I don't imagine I'm going to be visiting grandpa in the metaverse to look at family photos any time soon.
  - neartheplain 6y ago
    Facebook has sold multiple millions of Quests, and are on track to sell a lot more. Anecdotally, lots of non-technical people in my life have jumped on it. Even my older, non-technical parents have enjoyed repeated games of VR mini-golf. https://www.roadtovr.com/facebook-rec-room-2-3m-oculus-quest-2-sold/ https://www.roadtovr.com/facebook-rec-room-2-3m-oculus-quest...
    - JKCalhoun 6y ago
      Link "‘Rec Room’ Studio Estimates Facebook Sold 2-3M..." Estimates.
      - neartheplain 6y ago
        The estimate is based on Rec Room’s metric of unique Quest user downloads, and as such is likely very accurate. Based on their data, the absolute floor of Quest units sold is well over 1M. https://mobile.twitter.com/ShawnRecRoom/status/1357839404459556865 https://mobile.twitter.com/ShawnRecRoom/status/1357839404459...
    - flukus 6y ago
chipsambos 6y ago
> Btw, anyone who lets FB that close to their eyeballs is a stone cold moron at this point. They couldn’t be trusted to run an online photo album, giving them the ability to actually control your sense of reality is nightmarishly awful. This is a bizarre couple of sentences. I don't think you understand the technology _at all_. Firstly, it doesn't really matter how close the screen is to your eyes. Try moving your phone closer to your face or do you trust the app that you're about to let your eyes get closer to? Secondly, it doesn't have the ability to control your sense of reality. At least, not any more than seeing a movie in a cinema does. The thing is, I actually agree with your second sentence but only in the context of their social media platforms i.e. silently building echo chambers around users, experiments with shaping of user's emotional state and political opinions, etc.
- goatinaboat 6y ago
  This is a bizarre couple of sentences. I don't think you understand the technology _at all_. I'm taking the "close to your eyeballs" as a metaphor, but with AR you literally are trusting Facebook to mediate between you and the world. The ads you see, or don't see, on every flat surface, potentially. And that's just the start.
- hyko 6y ago
  it doesn't really matter how close the screen is to your eyes Yeah, I didn't mean to suggest there is a continuous relationship between trust and distance from the eyeballs :) The promise of AR and VR is that there is a quantum leap when your entire field of vision (or a very large fraction of it) is enveloped by the display though. it doesn't have the ability to control your sense of reality That's the entire premise of the products – the "R" in AR and VR is about inserting a shim between you and reality. That requires a level of trust I wouldn't be fully comfortable giving to myself, let alone other people, and never FB.

by hyko 6y ago

m12k 6y ago

Yeah, the Quest 2 looks like a great piece of hardware, but I'm getting one if and only if a jailbreak comes out.

pantalaimon 6y ago
Why do you need a jailbreak? You can already install third party APKs and there is a huge SideQuest community.
- herbst 6y ago
  Some of us avoid devices that depend on (forever changing) hacks for normal usage.
  - nomel 6y ago
    I don't think I would consider side loading with a developer account as a hack, and I don't think there's much evidence that this will change.
- ngokevin 6y ago
  I think they're looking to kill it in favor of a sideloading channel they can control. They announced it but I forgot its name.
TeMPOraL 6y ago
Yup. They knee-capped Quest in a really dumb way. I'm not upgrading my Quest 1 until I can buy something equivalent without forced cloud login bullshit. If I can't, I guess I'll just stay out of VR. From what I see, this is not just nerds being nerds, a lot of Quest's current user base feels the same. I'm also hoping general population is slowly discovering the flip side of shared cloud logins for unrelated services. Connecting Facebook to your Quest doesn't just mean you can VR-chat with your Facebook friends now. It also means that if Facebook automoderator doesn't like you, your Quest will turn into an expensive paperweight. Or if you break Quest ToS, you may lose your whole Facebook account with it. (What is sometimes called "digital feudalism" really does start feeling like one.)

baby 6y ago

I recommend the Oculus Quest, it’s really the best VR experience out there. If that’s not a consumer product I don’t what is...

michaelt 6y ago
Presumably what hyko means is: VR is much more accessible than it was 15 years ago; but VR isn't exactly common, even among the sort of dedicated PC gamers who take part in the Steam hardware survey, and it's doubtful Facebook's average user has a beefier PC than Steam's average user. So it's difficult to imagine a future where VR becomes a bigger part of Facebook's business than Facebook/IG/Whatsapp. I don't imagine I'm going to be visiting grandpa in the metaverse to look at family photos any time soon.
- neartheplain 6y ago
  Facebook has sold multiple millions of Quests, and are on track to sell a lot more. Anecdotally, lots of non-technical people in my life have jumped on it. Even my older, non-technical parents have enjoyed repeated games of VR mini-golf. https://www.roadtovr.com/facebook-rec-room-2-3m-oculus-quest-2-sold/ https://www.roadtovr.com/facebook-rec-room-2-3m-oculus-quest...
  - JKCalhoun 6y ago
    Link "‘Rec Room’ Studio Estimates Facebook Sold 2-3M..." Estimates.
    - neartheplain 6y ago
      The estimate is based on Rec Room’s metric of unique Quest user downloads, and as such is likely very accurate. Based on their data, the absolute floor of Quest units sold is well over 1M. https://mobile.twitter.com/ShawnRecRoom/status/1357839404459556865 https://mobile.twitter.com/ShawnRecRoom/status/1357839404459...
  - flukus 6y ago

chipsambos 6y ago

> Btw, anyone who lets FB that close to their eyeballs is a stone cold moron at this point. They couldn’t be trusted to run an online photo album, giving them the ability to actually control your sense of reality is nightmarishly awful. This is a bizarre couple of sentences. I don't think you understand the technology _at all_. Firstly, it doesn't really matter how close the screen is to your eyes. Try moving your phone closer to your face or do you trust the app that you're about to let your eyes get closer to? Secondly, it doesn't have the ability to control your sense of reality. At least, not any more than seeing a movie in a cinema does. The thing is, I actually agree with your second sentence but only in the context of their social media platforms i.e. silently building echo chambers around users, experiments with shaping of user's emotional state and political opinions, etc.

goatinaboat 6y ago
This is a bizarre couple of sentences. I don't think you understand the technology _at all_. I'm taking the "close to your eyeballs" as a metaphor, but with AR you literally are trusting Facebook to mediate between you and the world. The ads you see, or don't see, on every flat surface, potentially. And that's just the start.
hyko 6y ago
it doesn't really matter how close the screen is to your eyes Yeah, I didn't mean to suggest there is a continuous relationship between trust and distance from the eyeballs :) The promise of AR and VR is that there is a quantum leap when your entire field of vision (or a very large fraction of it) is enveloped by the display though. it doesn't have the ability to control your sense of reality That's the entire premise of the products – the "R" in AR and VR is about inserting a shim between you and reality. That requires a level of trust I wouldn't be fully comfortable giving to myself, let alone other people, and never FB.