4 ms·

Funny you say this is beyond your comprehension AND be so biased against Israel. Either you're incredibly naive about what an actual threat to a country and it

Funny you say this is beyond your comprehension AND be so biased against Israel. Either you're incredibly naive about what an actual threat to a country and its civilians means (oh no! they invest in Army and weapons), or you're just a little bit anti-semite.

Banana699 6y ago
Just an honest question: do you think Manifest Destiny and killing native Americans was justified or in any way legitimate ? If you answer with a no, how can you support a country that arose and expanded exactly the same way ? is it the "old homeland" bullshit Israeli propoganda loves to spew ? If so, why not be completely fair and give back the balkans to the turks or spain to the Greeks or the whole mediterranean coast to the Italians?, the last two in particular were a true homeland for their conquerors for at least a millennia. What's the difference ? Its ridiculous and pathetic you want to frame this as an attack against jews. I guess you took a page from ultra-islamists calling every criticism of islam "Islamophobia". But that's just you closing your ears and shouting "Blah Blah Blah I don't hear you.. Israel good, Israel good, Israel good", _Every_ Nation State in existence is an organized crime organization with a seat in the UN, Israel is just unlucky enough to have come late to the game, when Universal Human Rights were recognized as a good idea. You don't gain points for pointing out how this country or that killed n millions more than Israel, at least those other mobsters got a claim to the territory they rule that is more solid than "Well there is this book that a sky daddy wrote and it says right there that this piece of land belongs to us".
- skinkestek 6y ago
  > If so, why not be completely fair and give back the balkans to the turks or spain to the Greeks or the whole mediterranean coast to the Italians?, the last two in particular were a true homeland for their conquerors for at least a millennia. What's the difference ? If so, all the Jews that were chased from their homes in all the neighboring countries should also be given their homes back too, right? Because this is a lot more complex than the media typically give it credit for. Media conveniently forget that Jews were also driven from their homes and into Israel - only Israel integrated their refugees instead of putting them in refugee camps for use as a political pawn.
  - tomcooks 6y ago
    Media also tends to forget that Israel actively sends new settlers every year to invade Palestinian homes, burn centuries old olive tree fields, block access to water (while conveniently promoting retarded water purification trinkets).
    - skinkestek 6y ago
      Edit: firstly you are attaching to a tangent of my post. The point of my post above yours still stands uncontested. Secondly: Feel free to dig out your sources. It would not be the first time I changed or nuanced my position on a topic were I thought my mind was set in stone. Here's what needs to be proved for your claim to stand - as currently written: - Israel (officially by government or military leadership) - actively (as in: ordered it to happen) - sends (plural, recent) - invade Palestinian homes, burn centuries old olive tree fields, block access to water - bonus points for this: (while conveniently promoting retarded water purification trinkets). Prove it and I'll add it to my list somewhere near white phosphorus (because I'm fully aware Israelis mostly aren't saints).
      - tomcooks 6y ago
        Here are some sources, but any Amnesty International, United Nations or Israel boycott association will be happy to give you plenty more official data about this. https://www.timesofisrael.com/state-funding-settler-institute-squatting-illegally-in-palestinian-home/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/state-funding-settler-institut... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_settlement https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_settlement https://religionandpolitics.org/2017/05/30/how-american-jews-became-israeli-settlers/ https://religionandpolitics.org/2017/05/30/how-american-jews... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-olives-idUSKBN27E1Y6 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-olive... https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occupation-of-water/ https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occu... https://www.reuters.com/article/israel-palestinians-un-idUSL8N2151O7 https://www.reuters.com/article/israel-palestinians-un-idUSL... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SodaStream#Controversy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SodaStream#Controversy
- legolas2412 6y ago
  > is it the "old homeland" bullshit Israeli propoganda loves to spew ? How old does something needs to be for it to be bullshit. Because the land palestinians have lost is now pretty old too, and their claim is subsequently bullshit. They should just accept that Israel exists, it won various wars, and now owns a lot of land where palestinians used to live.
  - Banana699 6y ago
    Good strawman, I never meant that the claim is bullshit because it is old, I'm just describing it as such. And even conceding your faulty interpretation, Palestinians right to their land is documented by 80 years of audio-visual evidence, international and independent media reels, and UN resolutions. Israelis have a bunch of books most of them no longer believe. There isn't a fair and intelligent comparison to make here. And regarding the "ownership" Israel has over the land, well... when your 300-million-strong neighbors around you all hate the digestive bacteria in your guts and your army is the same thing as your people, I wouldn't exactly call that a stable or a secure way of living. In fact, that just sounds like a good old apartheid regime to me, not really surprising though given that Israel is just a European colony who powered through decolonization through sheer dumb luck and a powerful nanny/benefactor/ally state.
    - skinkestek 6y ago
      Blame it on UN. But when the world have thrown out the jews from their homes in all the neighboring countries and collected them in Israel at the same time Palestinian Arabs were thrown out from their homes in what is today Israel it becomes weird to talk about only one of those events in isolation, don't you think? Just because Israel integrated their people instead of putting them in camps waiting for the others to be "showeled out into the sea" doesn't mean they are worse? IIRC (I'm not that into India / Pakistan) this was about the same thing UN tried when they divided India / Pakistan aroubd the same time.
      - selimthegrim 6y ago
        The UN didn't divide India/Pakistan - you're probably thinking about the armistice in Kashmir
tomcooks 6y ago
There you go, now that you played the antisemite card and insulted a stranger let him know: how you can have hortodox Jews that are also antisionists? How would that work in that brilliant mind of yours? Stay special!
- amitport 6y ago
  He wondered why a country that is under threat invests in its army. This was not criticism. Either this person is naive, as I said (I mean this in a non-offensive way), or this person is fine with this a threat being materialized. In this option B, you can call such blind hatred against a country and its people whatever you prefer.

Banana699 6y ago

Just an honest question: do you think Manifest Destiny and killing native Americans was justified or in any way legitimate ? If you answer with a no, how can you support a country that arose and expanded exactly the same way ? is it the "old homeland" bullshit Israeli propoganda loves to spew ? If so, why not be completely fair and give back the balkans to the turks or spain to the Greeks or the whole mediterranean coast to the Italians?, the last two in particular were a true homeland for their conquerors for at least a millennia. What's the difference ? Its ridiculous and pathetic you want to frame this as an attack against jews. I guess you took a page from ultra-islamists calling every criticism of islam "Islamophobia". But that's just you closing your ears and shouting "Blah Blah Blah I don't hear you.. Israel good, Israel good, Israel good", _Every_ Nation State in existence is an organized crime organization with a seat in the UN, Israel is just unlucky enough to have come late to the game, when Universal Human Rights were recognized as a good idea. You don't gain points for pointing out how this country or that killed n millions more than Israel, at least those other mobsters got a claim to the territory they rule that is more solid than "Well there is this book that a sky daddy wrote and it says right there that this piece of land belongs to us".

skinkestek 6y ago
> If so, why not be completely fair and give back the balkans to the turks or spain to the Greeks or the whole mediterranean coast to the Italians?, the last two in particular were a true homeland for their conquerors for at least a millennia. What's the difference ? If so, all the Jews that were chased from their homes in all the neighboring countries should also be given their homes back too, right? Because this is a lot more complex than the media typically give it credit for. Media conveniently forget that Jews were also driven from their homes and into Israel - only Israel integrated their refugees instead of putting them in refugee camps for use as a political pawn.
- tomcooks 6y ago
  Media also tends to forget that Israel actively sends new settlers every year to invade Palestinian homes, burn centuries old olive tree fields, block access to water (while conveniently promoting retarded water purification trinkets).
  - skinkestek 6y ago
    Edit: firstly you are attaching to a tangent of my post. The point of my post above yours still stands uncontested. Secondly: Feel free to dig out your sources. It would not be the first time I changed or nuanced my position on a topic were I thought my mind was set in stone. Here's what needs to be proved for your claim to stand - as currently written: - Israel (officially by government or military leadership) - actively (as in: ordered it to happen) - sends (plural, recent) - invade Palestinian homes, burn centuries old olive tree fields, block access to water - bonus points for this: (while conveniently promoting retarded water purification trinkets). Prove it and I'll add it to my list somewhere near white phosphorus (because I'm fully aware Israelis mostly aren't saints).
    - tomcooks 6y ago
      Here are some sources, but any Amnesty International, United Nations or Israel boycott association will be happy to give you plenty more official data about this. https://www.timesofisrael.com/state-funding-settler-institute-squatting-illegally-in-palestinian-home/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/state-funding-settler-institut... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_settlement https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_settlement https://religionandpolitics.org/2017/05/30/how-american-jews-became-israeli-settlers/ https://religionandpolitics.org/2017/05/30/how-american-jews... https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-olives-idUSKBN27E1Y6 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-olive... https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occupation-of-water/ https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/campaigns/2017/11/the-occu... https://www.reuters.com/article/israel-palestinians-un-idUSL8N2151O7 https://www.reuters.com/article/israel-palestinians-un-idUSL... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SodaStream#Controversy https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/SodaStream#Controversy
legolas2412 6y ago
> is it the "old homeland" bullshit Israeli propoganda loves to spew ? How old does something needs to be for it to be bullshit. Because the land palestinians have lost is now pretty old too, and their claim is subsequently bullshit. They should just accept that Israel exists, it won various wars, and now owns a lot of land where palestinians used to live.
- Banana699 6y ago
  Good strawman, I never meant that the claim is bullshit because it is old, I'm just describing it as such. And even conceding your faulty interpretation, Palestinians right to their land is documented by 80 years of audio-visual evidence, international and independent media reels, and UN resolutions. Israelis have a bunch of books most of them no longer believe. There isn't a fair and intelligent comparison to make here. And regarding the "ownership" Israel has over the land, well... when your 300-million-strong neighbors around you all hate the digestive bacteria in your guts and your army is the same thing as your people, I wouldn't exactly call that a stable or a secure way of living. In fact, that just sounds like a good old apartheid regime to me, not really surprising though given that Israel is just a European colony who powered through decolonization through sheer dumb luck and a powerful nanny/benefactor/ally state.
  - skinkestek 6y ago
    Blame it on UN. But when the world have thrown out the jews from their homes in all the neighboring countries and collected them in Israel at the same time Palestinian Arabs were thrown out from their homes in what is today Israel it becomes weird to talk about only one of those events in isolation, don't you think? Just because Israel integrated their people instead of putting them in camps waiting for the others to be "showeled out into the sea" doesn't mean they are worse? IIRC (I'm not that into India / Pakistan) this was about the same thing UN tried when they divided India / Pakistan aroubd the same time.
    - selimthegrim 6y ago
      The UN didn't divide India/Pakistan - you're probably thinking about the armistice in Kashmir

tomcooks 6y ago

There you go, now that you played the antisemite card and insulted a stranger let him know: how you can have hortodox Jews that are also antisionists? How would that work in that brilliant mind of yours? Stay special!

amitport 6y ago
He wondered why a country that is under threat invests in its army. This was not criticism. Either this person is naive, as I said (I mean this in a non-offensive way), or this person is fine with this a threat being materialized. In this option B, you can call such blind hatred against a country and its people whatever you prefer.