29 ms·

What if some of the ideas that Chomsky "put out like a fire" were actually correct, and would have been discovered to be so if more time and (collaborative) eff

What if some of the ideas that Chomsky "put out like a fire" were actually correct, and would have been discovered to be so if more time and (collaborative) effort had gone into them?

DSingularity 6y ago
Are you accusing his sincerity? The correctness of the ideas which failed to gain traction is irrelevant. The burden is on the authors of those works to explain and decent the merit of their ideas. If they failed to convince their peer reviewers then that is on them. Unless you are accusing the peer-reviewers of acting in bad-faith.
- mistermann 6y ago
  > Are you accusing his sincerity? No, I am pointing out the shortcomings in this statement: >> He "systematically worked to block any researchers in the U.S. working on ideas that ran counter to his own"? > Yes, that's precisely what you do when you think the other approach is rubbish, you fight to put it out like a fire that threatens to burn down your beloved field. You only ever stop criticising others' work and promoting your own ideas when you are 100% convinced -no doubts at all- that it's your work that's flawed. - > The correctness of the ideas which failed to gain traction is irrelevant. Do you perceive yourself to have knowledge of what difference an alternative outcome would have made in the world? > The burden is on the authors of those works to explain and decent the merit of their ideas. If they failed to convince their peer reviewers then that is on them. It is also "on" anyone else who would have been affected by good ideas not being "put out like a fire". Things that do not happen are not stored in your mind, therefore it is quite natural for them to not exert much influence on your thinking. > Unless you are accusing the peer-reviewers of acting in bad-faith. I have no knowledge of their actions and therefore no opinion, I am simply pointing out shortcomings in thinking.
YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
Then everybody loses, of course. But we can't know that beforehand and our best chance to arrive at the truth is to let competing ideas actually compete- and hope that the ones that surive the ordeal are the ones closest to the truth.
- mistermann 6y ago
  There is a lot of variability available within the vague expression "let competing ideas actually compete".
  - YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
    I don't know what you mean by that. Could you please explain?
    - mistermann 6y ago
      Ideas can compete on a level playing field, purely on their merits, or they can be "put out like a fire" by someone with power and influence, and many variations in between.

What if some of the ideas that Chomsky "put out like a fire" were actually correct, and would have been discovered to be so if more time and (collaborative) effort had gone into them?

DSingularity 6y ago

Are you accusing his sincerity? The correctness of the ideas which failed to gain traction is irrelevant. The burden is on the authors of those works to explain and decent the merit of their ideas. If they failed to convince their peer reviewers then that is on them. Unless you are accusing the peer-reviewers of acting in bad-faith.

mistermann 6y ago
> Are you accusing his sincerity? No, I am pointing out the shortcomings in this statement: >> He "systematically worked to block any researchers in the U.S. working on ideas that ran counter to his own"? > Yes, that's precisely what you do when you think the other approach is rubbish, you fight to put it out like a fire that threatens to burn down your beloved field. You only ever stop criticising others' work and promoting your own ideas when you are 100% convinced -no doubts at all- that it's your work that's flawed. - > The correctness of the ideas which failed to gain traction is irrelevant. Do you perceive yourself to have knowledge of what difference an alternative outcome would have made in the world? > The burden is on the authors of those works to explain and decent the merit of their ideas. If they failed to convince their peer reviewers then that is on them. It is also "on" anyone else who would have been affected by good ideas not being "put out like a fire". Things that do not happen are not stored in your mind, therefore it is quite natural for them to not exert much influence on your thinking. > Unless you are accusing the peer-reviewers of acting in bad-faith. I have no knowledge of their actions and therefore no opinion, I am simply pointing out shortcomings in thinking.

YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago

Then everybody loses, of course. But we can't know that beforehand and our best chance to arrive at the truth is to let competing ideas actually compete- and hope that the ones that surive the ordeal are the ones closest to the truth.

mistermann 6y ago
There is a lot of variability available within the vague expression "let competing ideas actually compete".
- YeGoblynQueenne 6y ago
  I don't know what you mean by that. Could you please explain?
  - mistermann 6y ago
    Ideas can compete on a level playing field, purely on their merits, or they can be "put out like a fire" by someone with power and influence, and many variations in between.