5 ms·

Maybe a "Spaceforce" is actually a good idea?

by jtdev 6y ago

__john 6y ago
I think it will be the thing he is most remembered for.
yabones 6y ago
Nope, still not a good idea. The name alone suggests militarization of space which is a horrible idea. The only thing that kept us alive through the 20th century was mutually assured destruction, and more importantly, the capability to detect ICBM launches and retaliate within the 30 minutes before your continent is glassed. Space launched nukes don't give you any warning, you get at most 30 seconds to detect the shock heating in the high atmosphere before it's game over. It's an actual slippery slope, the very first payload containing weapons in orbit is a direct path towards space launched nuclear weapons.
- thevardanian 6y ago
  The militarization of space is unfortunately inevitable.
- drusepth 6y ago
  >Space launched nukes don't give you any warning Unless you have your own space-launched nukes and satellites?
- TeMPOraL 6y ago
  While dangerous, it's not necessarily MAD-breaking. MAD stands on nuclear-armed submarines these days. Now, if someone figured out how to reliably detect submerged submarines from orbit, that would be truly MAD-breaking.
  - selectodude 6y ago
    There's nothing I wouldn't be willing to believe when it comes to the NRO.
- simonh 6y ago
  Space to ground weapons are not really militarily practical. At any given moment only a tiny fraction of your weapons would be over a given target ready to strike. You have to wait for the other satellite to happen to over-fly the target area, which would generally only occur every few days at most due to orbital precession and earths rotation.
  - PeterisP 6y ago
    It's not like you drop nukes from above when you're above the target, like from an airplane, orbits don't work that way. You could fire the nukes on many missiles planned so that they would re-enter the atmosphere all at the same time for a surprise attack.
    - simonh 6y ago
      Sure, but you could only do so for a pre-planned attack at least several days in advance. That's not a very situationally flexible option, and if manoeuvring of the barrage to prepare the attack is detected, you're in big trouble. Their subs will pepper you with nukes long before your attack strikes home, and quite possibly well before you've completed the orbital adjustments of all your warheads. Another factor is that sub based missiles can launch from relatively close to their target and just skim out of the atmosphere, well below the orbits of even fairly short lifetime low orbiting satellites. That makes for quick trajectories. A satellite based weapon up there for extended periods would need to be in a relatively high altitude to avoid orbital decay. It turns out you don't actually get much advantage in terms of strike time even for a target that happens to be at an optimal position relative to your orbit. Finally, what do you do when the weapons reach the end of their service life? With terrestrial weapons they can be refurbished, upgraded or the expensive nuclear material recovered for remanufacturing. I know space weapons are sexy and cool, and I love me some Goldeneye style James Bond super-weapons, but they're not actually all that useful. It's one of the reasons the Star Wars missile defence project wasn't really viable as well. At any given time at least nine tenths of your defence satellites are over Australia, Africa, the Pacific, the Antarctic, or somewhere else peripheral rather than the Russia - USA theatre.
downrightmike 6y ago
lol, M4s won't do any good. Just let JPL solve this.
TeMPOraL 6y ago
Sure it is. I love the show, can't wait for the second season. Oh, you mean that other Space Force? That I'm not sure of, but I hear it was just a much-needed reorganization of who does what in the US military.
garmaine 6y ago
Pretty much everyone in the space industry is in agreement that Space Force is a good idea. We have been in agreement on this for decades, and it was a bipartisan project that started under Obama. Not our problem that Trump took the existing plan and lazily stamped his brand on it...

Maybe a "Spaceforce" is actually a good idea?

by jtdev 6y ago

Maybe a "Spaceforce" is actually a good idea?

__john 6y ago

I think it will be the thing he is most remembered for.

yabones 6y ago

Nope, still not a good idea. The name alone suggests militarization of space which is a horrible idea. The only thing that kept us alive through the 20th century was mutually assured destruction, and more importantly, the capability to detect ICBM launches and retaliate within the 30 minutes before your continent is glassed. Space launched nukes don't give you any warning, you get at most 30 seconds to detect the shock heating in the high atmosphere before it's game over. It's an actual slippery slope, the very first payload containing weapons in orbit is a direct path towards space launched nuclear weapons.

thevardanian 6y ago
The militarization of space is unfortunately inevitable.
drusepth 6y ago
>Space launched nukes don't give you any warning Unless you have your own space-launched nukes and satellites?
TeMPOraL 6y ago
While dangerous, it's not necessarily MAD-breaking. MAD stands on nuclear-armed submarines these days. Now, if someone figured out how to reliably detect submerged submarines from orbit, that would be truly MAD-breaking.
- selectodude 6y ago
  There's nothing I wouldn't be willing to believe when it comes to the NRO.
simonh 6y ago
Space to ground weapons are not really militarily practical. At any given moment only a tiny fraction of your weapons would be over a given target ready to strike. You have to wait for the other satellite to happen to over-fly the target area, which would generally only occur every few days at most due to orbital precession and earths rotation.
- PeterisP 6y ago
  It's not like you drop nukes from above when you're above the target, like from an airplane, orbits don't work that way. You could fire the nukes on many missiles planned so that they would re-enter the atmosphere all at the same time for a surprise attack.
  - simonh 6y ago
    Sure, but you could only do so for a pre-planned attack at least several days in advance. That's not a very situationally flexible option, and if manoeuvring of the barrage to prepare the attack is detected, you're in big trouble. Their subs will pepper you with nukes long before your attack strikes home, and quite possibly well before you've completed the orbital adjustments of all your warheads. Another factor is that sub based missiles can launch from relatively close to their target and just skim out of the atmosphere, well below the orbits of even fairly short lifetime low orbiting satellites. That makes for quick trajectories. A satellite based weapon up there for extended periods would need to be in a relatively high altitude to avoid orbital decay. It turns out you don't actually get much advantage in terms of strike time even for a target that happens to be at an optimal position relative to your orbit. Finally, what do you do when the weapons reach the end of their service life? With terrestrial weapons they can be refurbished, upgraded or the expensive nuclear material recovered for remanufacturing. I know space weapons are sexy and cool, and I love me some Goldeneye style James Bond super-weapons, but they're not actually all that useful. It's one of the reasons the Star Wars missile defence project wasn't really viable as well. At any given time at least nine tenths of your defence satellites are over Australia, Africa, the Pacific, the Antarctic, or somewhere else peripheral rather than the Russia - USA theatre.

downrightmike 6y ago

lol, M4s won't do any good. Just let JPL solve this.

TeMPOraL 6y ago

Sure it is. I love the show, can't wait for the second season. Oh, you mean that other Space Force? That I'm not sure of, but I hear it was just a much-needed reorganization of who does what in the US military.

garmaine 6y ago

Pretty much everyone in the space industry is in agreement that Space Force is a good idea. We have been in agreement on this for decades, and it was a bipartisan project that started under Obama. Not our problem that Trump took the existing plan and lazily stamped his brand on it...