5 ms·

You seem to equate hard work ethic with sustainability, this is false. You obviously have never experienced the joys of winters with nothing todo except read, l

by xipho 6y ago

You seem to equate hard work ethic with sustainability, this is false. You obviously have never experienced the joys of winters with nothing todo except read, learn, cook and play, because you worked insanely hard on the farm for 6-8 months of the growing season (being your own boss, but who cares about that).

nineplay 6y ago
At risk of stating the obvious, dairy cows do not have a growing season. Cows are a 365 days-a-year commitment.
- xipho 6y ago
  My grandfather had a dairy barn, I'm aware of this. The community around it rebuilt it when it was burned, looked after it when he travelled across the country etc. Was it hard? Certainly. To suggest his (and his families) life was somehow less joyous than a 9-5 hacking l33t code all year is insanity.
  - nineplay 6y ago
    The writer of the articles was very clear that _he_ found farming less joyous than "9-5 hacking l33t code". Your argument is more with him than with me. The writer's other two siblings also found more "joyous" things to do. It isn't for everyone, and that is going to continue to be the reason that they can't survive against Big Ag.
    - xipho 6y ago
      Right. I don't have an argument with the writer, its a wonderful article, spot on. Yes my families work was largely pre-big ag. Nothing is for everyone. The trigger that looped me in here was the "not sustainable because hard work", I drifted to tangents too quickly.
      - nineplay 6y ago
        > I drifted to tangents too quickly My too my friend, me too.
- phillc73 6y ago
  This is not always the case. I recall learning during my youth that in Victoria, Australia, the heat cycles and pregnancies of the entire herd were synchronised to that it lead to a period of 6 to 8 weeks where no milking occurred at all. That's not to say that there was nothing to do on the farm, or it was time to take a holiday, just that the cows did not need milking during that time period, so perhaps it was easier to relax a little. There are also "contract milkers" who can be brought in for short stints of time, allowing the owners to take time off. Of course there is a cost to this, but I guess that just needs to be budgeted into the overall cost of the "holiday."
  - nineplay 6y ago
    The poster upstream suggested there were 6-8 months of downtime with nothing to do. We've gone down to 6-8 weeks with no milking. There's still feeding and watering and of course monitoring a herd of now-pregnant cows with all the possible health complications that come from that. I'm also relaying my friend's experience, not just speculating. In her circumstances, there was daily maintenance and no vacations. Perhaps her family didn't budget well enough.
analog31 6y ago
A friend of mine is a farmer -- typical Wisconsin corn & beans. Those winters are spent finding other income sources. Some of his activities: Driving the big snow plows. Short haul truck driving on country roads in the dark. Repairing his ancient equipment. Being a local dealer for something or other. Same with any time slot that he can fill during the growing season. An issue he faces is that he pays more for seeds and fertilizer than the big farms, and gets paid less for his crop. Many of the "obvious" ideas to produce specialized crops (organic, popcorn, soybeans for tofu) turn out to be boondoggles that lose money. I'm not too sad for him -- his land is worth millions, he'll do OK. But the other thing is, he and I are the same age, and he looks about 20 years older. Part of it is that he's driven to do this. It's in his blood. He talks about "feeding the world" and so forth. Being your own boss, yes. Turns out being a "farmer" looks a lot different if you own the farm, than if you don't.
- rootusrootus 6y ago
  > he looks about 20 years older OTOH, my grandfather, who worked his own farm until he was deep into his 80s, is just about to celebrate 102. Up until a couple years ago he was still taking stairs two at a time, and winning corn shucking contests. Would he have made it so far, or in such good shape, if he had spent his life at a desk?
  - hshshs2 6y ago
    he might have - health is important but once you pass a general fitness baseline living past 100 is just a crapshoot if it were simply a matter of exercise we’d have a lot more people living past 100
- WalterBright 6y ago
  > he looks about 20 years older On the other hand, he might live longer as a result of the hard work.
- devoutsalsa 6y ago
  Does he look older just because he’s spent so much time in the sun? The sun will make you look like a raisin with excessive exposure.
oh_sigh 6y ago
I can't speak categorically, but I grew up around farmers (dairy, pigs, & crops) I've never known a farmer who took the winter off. Winters would be spent repairing and upgrading equipment, and prepping for the upcoming season, not just lazing around.
- jhawk28 6y ago
  Winter is when my father only works 40 hours/week on the farm.

by xipho 6y ago

nineplay 6y ago

At risk of stating the obvious, dairy cows do not have a growing season. Cows are a 365 days-a-year commitment.

xipho 6y ago
My grandfather had a dairy barn, I'm aware of this. The community around it rebuilt it when it was burned, looked after it when he travelled across the country etc. Was it hard? Certainly. To suggest his (and his families) life was somehow less joyous than a 9-5 hacking l33t code all year is insanity.
- nineplay 6y ago
  The writer of the articles was very clear that _he_ found farming less joyous than "9-5 hacking l33t code". Your argument is more with him than with me. The writer's other two siblings also found more "joyous" things to do. It isn't for everyone, and that is going to continue to be the reason that they can't survive against Big Ag.
  - xipho 6y ago
    Right. I don't have an argument with the writer, its a wonderful article, spot on. Yes my families work was largely pre-big ag. Nothing is for everyone. The trigger that looped me in here was the "not sustainable because hard work", I drifted to tangents too quickly.
    - nineplay 6y ago
      > I drifted to tangents too quickly My too my friend, me too.
phillc73 6y ago
This is not always the case. I recall learning during my youth that in Victoria, Australia, the heat cycles and pregnancies of the entire herd were synchronised to that it lead to a period of 6 to 8 weeks where no milking occurred at all. That's not to say that there was nothing to do on the farm, or it was time to take a holiday, just that the cows did not need milking during that time period, so perhaps it was easier to relax a little. There are also "contract milkers" who can be brought in for short stints of time, allowing the owners to take time off. Of course there is a cost to this, but I guess that just needs to be budgeted into the overall cost of the "holiday."
- nineplay 6y ago
  The poster upstream suggested there were 6-8 months of downtime with nothing to do. We've gone down to 6-8 weeks with no milking. There's still feeding and watering and of course monitoring a herd of now-pregnant cows with all the possible health complications that come from that. I'm also relaying my friend's experience, not just speculating. In her circumstances, there was daily maintenance and no vacations. Perhaps her family didn't budget well enough.

analog31 6y ago

A friend of mine is a farmer -- typical Wisconsin corn & beans. Those winters are spent finding other income sources. Some of his activities: Driving the big snow plows. Short haul truck driving on country roads in the dark. Repairing his ancient equipment. Being a local dealer for something or other. Same with any time slot that he can fill during the growing season. An issue he faces is that he pays more for seeds and fertilizer than the big farms, and gets paid less for his crop. Many of the "obvious" ideas to produce specialized crops (organic, popcorn, soybeans for tofu) turn out to be boondoggles that lose money. I'm not too sad for him -- his land is worth millions, he'll do OK. But the other thing is, he and I are the same age, and he looks about 20 years older. Part of it is that he's driven to do this. It's in his blood. He talks about "feeding the world" and so forth. Being your own boss, yes. Turns out being a "farmer" looks a lot different if you own the farm, than if you don't.

rootusrootus 6y ago
> he looks about 20 years older OTOH, my grandfather, who worked his own farm until he was deep into his 80s, is just about to celebrate 102. Up until a couple years ago he was still taking stairs two at a time, and winning corn shucking contests. Would he have made it so far, or in such good shape, if he had spent his life at a desk?
- hshshs2 6y ago
  he might have - health is important but once you pass a general fitness baseline living past 100 is just a crapshoot if it were simply a matter of exercise we’d have a lot more people living past 100
WalterBright 6y ago
> he looks about 20 years older On the other hand, he might live longer as a result of the hard work.
devoutsalsa 6y ago
Does he look older just because he’s spent so much time in the sun? The sun will make you look like a raisin with excessive exposure.

oh_sigh 6y ago

I can't speak categorically, but I grew up around farmers (dairy, pigs, & crops) I've never known a farmer who took the winter off. Winters would be spent repairing and upgrading equipment, and prepping for the upcoming season, not just lazing around.

jhawk28 6y ago
Winter is when my father only works 40 hours/week on the farm.