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> because of the predominant "fuck it" attitude: don't learn the customs, don't speak the language, don't put down roots, and don't interact with locals [...] w

> because of the predominant "fuck it" attitude: don't learn the customs, don't speak the language, don't put down roots, and don't interact with locals [...] when you bring in a junior software engineer's extended family, you're getting a swath of average people too There isn't a huge amount of difference between what you're saying and what the previous president had to say on immigrants coming to the US - "when Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best". Which a lot of people find an extremely problematic perspective. You're entitled to your opinion, but I find it a little ironic when your HN profile says you have: > Love for all: LGBTQ+, BLM, poly, AGR, and misfits of the world unite.

majjgepolja 6y ago
Most of BLM/LGBTQLMONOP hipsters are still racist towards Indians and Asians because that's not even criticized.
- amznthrowaway5 6y ago
  Exactly, these comments would result in bans if they were about black people instead of south asians.
  - deleted 6y ago
    [deleted]
twaybtclong 6y ago
Wonder how he got that idea: > “Chiva,” his uncle said. Goat, the Mexican slang term for black tar heroin. “This is how we make our money.” Cora Indian campesinos grew the poppies in the mountains above Xalisco. They harvested the opium goo from the flowers and sold it to cookers whom Enrique’s uncles knew. A newly cooked kilo of vinegary, sticky chiva would head north in a boom box or a backpack within a couple days, virtually uncut, and often hit L.A. streets only a week after the goo was drawn from the poppy. As Enrique’s uncle spoke, he rolled little pieces of the gunk into balls the size of BBs. "Dreamland" https://www.amazon.com/Dreamland-True-Americas-Opiate-Epidemic/dp/1511336404 https://www.amazon.com/Dreamland-True-Americas-Opiate-Epidem...
- blueline 6y ago
  so mexican people are bad because some guy wrote a book about a town where some mexican people sell drugs? very scientific, thank you Hacker News
  - twaybtclong 6y ago
    They setup an entire heroin network of Domino's like franchises spanning the US. Starting in LA, ultimately spreading all over the country by the early 2000s. The heroin resurgence came on the back of enterprising Mexicans who took advantage of loose sentencing of small amounts and rampant Oxy addicts looking for alternatives. > In two years, from 1995 to 1997, Boise’s minor market had a half-dozen crews selling heroin like pizza. But that wasn’t all. From the wiretaps, Ruplinger heard Polla call Phoenix, Ontario, El Monte, Salt Lake, Portland, Billings, Las Vegas, Honolulu. If Boise had a half dozen, how many crews must Denver have? What about Portland? Las Vegas? The heroin cells were like ants in a garden: You didn’t see them unless you got close enough and knew what to look for. Then, even when you stamped them out, more came to take their place.
    - lotsofpulp 6y ago
      > The heroin resurgence came on the back of enterprising Mexicans who took advantage of loose sentencing of small amounts and rampant Oxy addicts looking for alternatives. Did anything bad ever come on the backs of enterprising Americans? Is there any purpose of your comment other than to indict an entire country of people for the actions of a few?
      - mc32 6y ago
        Did Americans ever conduct a gun running operation into Mexico, is that a bad thing? Yeah it’s bad and we should punish them.
      - twaybtclong 6y ago
        That wasn't the argument. My mom died, I know others that died and I know the history behind it. It used to be truth seeking was important. There is truth to what Trump was saying. At the time he made that statement the opiate epidemic was still in full swing. You can take the media narrative that it was racism, but 70k dead a year for the last decade requires a more nuanced look.
dantillberg 6y ago
What do you mean by "problematic" here? Is it like "sin?" Or maybe "shameful?" How should I read that?
- swa45 6y ago
  Not acceptable within that person’s value system and virtues, which they’re signaling by calling it problematic. It’s an appeal to an imaginary Problematic Idea Authority that maintains a list of what people aren’t allowed to believe. When the commentary you dislike isn’t an exact fit for something readily indictable on the list, find something close that is on the list (bonus points if it involves a controversial figure), reduce and compare what’s said to that, then proceed with shooting down the proxy opinion regardless of whether your read of what the person was saying is accurate. It doesn’t matter. Read it again. That’s precisely what happened, followed by clicking the person’s profile to move on to fundamentally shaming the person rather than the problematic idea. That’s a standard playbook in 2021 and it is absolutely not at all about what was actually said. It’s a mating dance for those with similar belief structures and the person being disagreed with is a passenger; the response is only marginally addressing the speaker. This community can’t get enough of that conflict because the microcosm of people it represents themselves cannot. So it does well here. Other people peacock it, and before you know it, it’s our defining culture. It’s how talking about culture without disparaging other cultures gets risky, because of the pattern matching mechanic against a black and white list with no acknowledgment of grays. “You talked about race, therefore you’re racist” is increasingly logical to folks, and once that chum is in the water whatever point you may have had no longer matters.
  - amznthrowaway5 6y ago
    > Read it again. That’s precisely what happened, followed by clicking the person’s profile to move on to fundamentally shaming the person rather than the problematic idea. If this was about the groups in his profile, it wouldn't be acceptable. The only reason his comment is acceptable is because he is picking on an easy target.
- munchbunny 6y ago
  It's the diplomatic synonym for "racist"/"classist"/"sexist"/etc. but it allows you to try to make the claim without having to do the work to specify the claim. In this case, I think the commenter meant "xenophobic", based on the parallels to Trump's rhetoric.

majjgepolja 6y ago

Most of BLM/LGBTQLMONOP hipsters are still racist towards Indians and Asians because that's not even criticized.

amznthrowaway5 6y ago
Exactly, these comments would result in bans if they were about black people instead of south asians.
- deleted 6y ago
  [deleted]

twaybtclong 6y ago

Wonder how he got that idea: > “Chiva,” his uncle said. Goat, the Mexican slang term for black tar heroin. “This is how we make our money.” Cora Indian campesinos grew the poppies in the mountains above Xalisco. They harvested the opium goo from the flowers and sold it to cookers whom Enrique’s uncles knew. A newly cooked kilo of vinegary, sticky chiva would head north in a boom box or a backpack within a couple days, virtually uncut, and often hit L.A. streets only a week after the goo was drawn from the poppy. As Enrique’s uncle spoke, he rolled little pieces of the gunk into balls the size of BBs. "Dreamland" https://www.amazon.com/Dreamland-True-Americas-Opiate-Epidemic/dp/1511336404 https://www.amazon.com/Dreamland-True-Americas-Opiate-Epidem...

blueline 6y ago
so mexican people are bad because some guy wrote a book about a town where some mexican people sell drugs? very scientific, thank you Hacker News
- twaybtclong 6y ago
  They setup an entire heroin network of Domino's like franchises spanning the US. Starting in LA, ultimately spreading all over the country by the early 2000s. The heroin resurgence came on the back of enterprising Mexicans who took advantage of loose sentencing of small amounts and rampant Oxy addicts looking for alternatives. > In two years, from 1995 to 1997, Boise’s minor market had a half-dozen crews selling heroin like pizza. But that wasn’t all. From the wiretaps, Ruplinger heard Polla call Phoenix, Ontario, El Monte, Salt Lake, Portland, Billings, Las Vegas, Honolulu. If Boise had a half dozen, how many crews must Denver have? What about Portland? Las Vegas? The heroin cells were like ants in a garden: You didn’t see them unless you got close enough and knew what to look for. Then, even when you stamped them out, more came to take their place.
  - lotsofpulp 6y ago
    > The heroin resurgence came on the back of enterprising Mexicans who took advantage of loose sentencing of small amounts and rampant Oxy addicts looking for alternatives. Did anything bad ever come on the backs of enterprising Americans? Is there any purpose of your comment other than to indict an entire country of people for the actions of a few?
    - mc32 6y ago
      Did Americans ever conduct a gun running operation into Mexico, is that a bad thing? Yeah it’s bad and we should punish them.
    - twaybtclong 6y ago
      That wasn't the argument. My mom died, I know others that died and I know the history behind it. It used to be truth seeking was important. There is truth to what Trump was saying. At the time he made that statement the opiate epidemic was still in full swing. You can take the media narrative that it was racism, but 70k dead a year for the last decade requires a more nuanced look.

dantillberg 6y ago

What do you mean by "problematic" here? Is it like "sin?" Or maybe "shameful?" How should I read that?

swa45 6y ago
Not acceptable within that person’s value system and virtues, which they’re signaling by calling it problematic. It’s an appeal to an imaginary Problematic Idea Authority that maintains a list of what people aren’t allowed to believe. When the commentary you dislike isn’t an exact fit for something readily indictable on the list, find something close that is on the list (bonus points if it involves a controversial figure), reduce and compare what’s said to that, then proceed with shooting down the proxy opinion regardless of whether your read of what the person was saying is accurate. It doesn’t matter. Read it again. That’s precisely what happened, followed by clicking the person’s profile to move on to fundamentally shaming the person rather than the problematic idea. That’s a standard playbook in 2021 and it is absolutely not at all about what was actually said. It’s a mating dance for those with similar belief structures and the person being disagreed with is a passenger; the response is only marginally addressing the speaker. This community can’t get enough of that conflict because the microcosm of people it represents themselves cannot. So it does well here. Other people peacock it, and before you know it, it’s our defining culture. It’s how talking about culture without disparaging other cultures gets risky, because of the pattern matching mechanic against a black and white list with no acknowledgment of grays. “You talked about race, therefore you’re racist” is increasingly logical to folks, and once that chum is in the water whatever point you may have had no longer matters.
- amznthrowaway5 6y ago
  > Read it again. That’s precisely what happened, followed by clicking the person’s profile to move on to fundamentally shaming the person rather than the problematic idea. If this was about the groups in his profile, it wouldn't be acceptable. The only reason his comment is acceptable is because he is picking on an easy target.
munchbunny 6y ago
It's the diplomatic synonym for "racist"/"classist"/"sexist"/etc. but it allows you to try to make the claim without having to do the work to specify the claim. In this case, I think the commenter meant "xenophobic", based on the parallels to Trump's rhetoric.