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Posted it because it reminds me of an hypothesis I once saw, that we might be able to detect alien civilizations based on blank spots in the sky where they've m
by generalizations 6y ago
Posted it because it reminds me of an hypothesis I once saw, that we might be able to detect alien civilizations based on blank spots in the sky where they've managed to divert all the energy from their environment.
- agentwiggles 6y agoI'm reminded of the Three Body Problem series, where there's this concept of a Black Domain - an area of space in which the speed of light has been reduced drastically. Some civilizations in the setting have reason to deliberately construct these areas of space. (The reasoning behind this might be considered a spoiler, so I'll leave it off.)
- ethbr0 6y agoYou mean like in Vernor Vinge's 1992 A Fire Upon the Deep?
- harshreality 6y agoSounds similar (I still need to read Liu), but in Vinge, it wasn't light speed being reduced, it was a variety of limitations on superluminal physics, computation/intelligence, and maybe even physical properties. (variations in quantum physics, perhaps)
- elihu 6y agoSort of. In Vinge's world, the slow zone is just a natural phenomenon, not something artificially created. And in the slow zone you're basically limited to nearly-speed-of-light travel consistent with our contemporary understanding of relativistic physics (which is unbearably slow to anyone who can travel much faster than that outside the slow zone). Whereas in Liu Cixin's books, if I remember correctly, they actually change the speed of light itself to be even slower.
- dnhz 6y agoIf I remember correctly, there's some ambiguity whether the slow zone was created by some power or naturally occurring (or a bit of both) although a bit of both is perhaps the natural answer.
- elihu 6y agoYou may be right; it's been a long time since I read A Fire upon the Deep or A Deepness in the Sky.
- ethbr0 6y agoI remember some insinuations to that effect, but from an unreliable narrator given Vinge's penchant for strictly in-character exposition, and what would child races know of progenitor's motives? As a universe arrangement scheme (both narratively and literally), it is a clean solution to providing a new race incubator and preventing "Why don't the First Ones rule everyone?" endgames.
- klingon78 6y agoIt might not be as empty as it looks. Maybe it’s just got a really big dark sheet over it. Astronomers don’t consider the possibility of ginormous dark sheets in space.
- wideareanetwork 6y agoProbably more in the domain of god - if you believe in that sort of thing - than aliens.
- edgyquant 6y agoAt that level what’s the difference?
- nynx 6y agoI've heard this idea in the context of Dyson spheres/swarms. The issue is that, while they'd be invisible or dim to the eye, the areas would be very bright in infrared.
- Retric 6y agoDepends on how large the swarm is. Using our sun as the example a 1AU swarm would be very warm, but at 100 AU it would be extremely cold and much harder to detect. Really though, a Dyson’s swarm isn’t that efficient long term. It’s likely better to dismantle large stars and use fusion reactors with heat sinks at close to 2.73 Kelvin as possible.
- vermilingua 6y agoFossil fuels vs solar, it’s a sustainability question. Plus, dismantling a sun isn’t much help to the planets orbiting it, and then you need to find a way to efficiently get that energy to another system to be used.
- m4rtink 6y agoPlanets ? Who cares about planets when building a Dyson swarm - other the possibly as a bootstrap cache of materials to get thing going. Yeah, you might occasionally leave one in place for historical reasons, but otherwise they are just too useless not to make use of their mass for something better. Not to mention traffic management headaches given that normal planets usually stubbornly refuse to do any orbit corrections when needed.
- Retric 6y agoThe amount of fuel is fixed either way so it’s an efficiency question. Normal stars only burn a small percentage of their fuel. Maximum energy is captured by turning hydrogen into lead. After that, dumping lead into a deep gravity well is the final option.
- Konohamaru 6y ago> Really though, a Dyson’s swarm isn’t that efficient long term. It’s likely better to dismantle large stars and use fusion reactors with heat sinks at close to 2.73 Kelvin as possible. Would like a referral to science fiction that talks about this.
- suifbwish 6y agoWhy would we presume they would not think to generate a cloaked for this if they had the ability to divert all energy from their environment? Seems an obvious first order of business to avoid looking like an anomaly if you are not actively trying to be found.
- edgyquant 6y agoHow would you cloak waste heat?
- suifbwish 6y agoWhat makes us so sure waste heat is something that is absolutely unavoidable. It’s possible heat maybe be disposable through some quantum means we have not uncovered yet. Ultimately everything in existence has heat potential so theoretically heat is able to covert back to everything else . Using no heat as proof the room is empty is equivalent of a person who cannot avoid making a mess when they enter a house concluding that no one else has been there because there is no mess (except the one they made) all they can conclude is that no one who makes a mess has been there.