178 ms·

> I live in the Netherlands, a country that primarily uses debit cards I noticed that on my very first visit to the Netherlands. Many shops just don't accept c

by stunt 6y ago

> I live in the Netherlands, a country that primarily uses debit cards I noticed that on my very first visit to the Netherlands. Many shops just don't accept credit card and that was very strange to me on my first visit. My only use case for debit card was to get cash out of ATM until then. So, I was really surprised to see that everybody uses debit card everywhere. And I was told that credit card is mainly used for online booking and traveling.

tudelo 6y ago
It is very strange... I have some assumptions that it would be better for the general public to not have a credit card culture. Very rarely have I "required" the use of one, but when I was moving for my first real job out of school it was somewhat essential as a sort of buffer until the first paycheck kicked in. Not a comfortable place, but one I bet a lot of people could resonate with, and IMO a responsible use of credit.
- acka 6y ago
  I can confirm the strong deterrent towards having a credit card, any personal loans really, in the Netherlands. My bank, and I believe most banks in the Netherlands, requires proof of stable income well above minimum wage before even considering an application for a credit card. This puts credit cards out of reach of a sizable part of the population. Also, credit checks and reporting new lines of credit to the authorities by lenders are mandatory for all personal loans, be it for getting a mortgage, issuing a credit card, paying monthly installments for a smartphone bundled with a contract, or buying on credit from Dutch online stores or mail order catalogues.
- aequitas 6y ago
  To me (Dutch) the idea of using a personal credit card is very strange for anything other than because a website/shop doesn't accept any other form of payment. If you're a company, credit makes sense. You invest on a risk of getter a greater return in the future. But paying for your groceries or rent in advance should not be considered 'investing' in your personal life imho. You should just make due with what you have.
  - m_mueller 6y ago
    From what I understand about the US, it is mainly to get better credit rating. This is apparently the most important social score in American society... Note to Americans: In European countries this tends not to be a thing afaik. Privacy is taken more seriously, so there is no central & privatized system to query for credit. However, to rent an apartment, get a loan or get a new job here in Switzerland it's often required to provide something like a credit register extract from the local government office. That register will get notified when someone isn't paying bills, usually after the third notification ~2 months after a bill was issued (notifying the register is costing fees, so businesses try to avoid it as much as possible). After a couple of years, entries get deleted. This way there is an attempt of balancing privacy, social mobility and the interest of businesses to collect their revenue.
    - edwintorok 6y ago
      Not just the US, the UK has credit scoring too, there I think 3 credit scoring agencies. When I moved here from Europe the entire notion of credit card and credit scoring was new to me. I still use my debit card whenever possible though, just spending enough on the credit card to avoid getting it cancelled due to not using it.
    - aequitas 6y ago
      Similar to what we have here. Only I don't think it common they check your credit score for a job application. Only when you want a new loan (mortgage, credit card, buy on credit, etc). You can also query the information yourself and see who requested access to it in the past months.
      - m_mueller 6y ago
        where is here, the US you mean? but the way I understand it, those credit score agencies are private, and their info is much more granular. e.g. it would never matter in CH and pretty much all of Europe, how much you already spent and payed off on credit in the past.
  - 6y ago
amaccuish 6y ago
Same here in Germany. A normal credit card is a charge card, so billed every 30 days in full from the giro account. Credit cards that are rolling are rarer but slowly breaking their way through.
- trthomps 6y ago
  I mainly use an Amex charge card that functions like this, don't spend money I don't have, and only don't use a debit card for things because our financial system is very insecure and don't want to give the number out because getting my money back is a lot harder than just calling Amex and reporting the fraud.
hansoolo 6y ago
It's just a normal way of paying with money you actually HAVE, not money you "borrow" from a credit card company...
jacekm 6y ago
It's the same in Poland. I've never had a credit card in my life and honestly I don't feel any need for it. My debit cards work pretty much everywhere around the world, including internet payments (occasionally one card may have a hiccup so I always carry two cards from different banks)
C19is20 6y ago
€18 a year for just having a credit card? My bank can go f itself.
oakesm9 6y ago
Same in the UK. Both credit and debit cards tend to be MasterCard or Visa cards, so they can generally be used interchangeably. Personally, I only tend to use credit cards for larger purchases (flights, hotels, etc) because you get some better protections if things go wrong. Data: https://www.finder.com/uk/credit-card-statistics https://www.finder.com/uk/credit-card-statistics
eythian 6y ago
It costs the merchant more to process a credit card transaction, so they don't bother unless they're likely to get a lot of tourists. These days, more and more places are going cashless too, though those places generally always accept credit cards, otherwise it'd be really hard for overseas visitors to pay. I have a credit card here and only use it for international transactions[0], it has a fairly low limit to the point where if I'm, say, booking long-haul flights I need to pre-load it with money which fortunately only takes moments. This is partly by choice - as it's automatically paid off each month, I want to ensure I can never put more on it than will be in my bank account - but also that was the default limit when I got it. [0] local online transactions pretty much always use a system (iDeal) that goes via your bank website.

by stunt 6y ago

tudelo 6y ago

It is very strange... I have some assumptions that it would be better for the general public to not have a credit card culture. Very rarely have I "required" the use of one, but when I was moving for my first real job out of school it was somewhat essential as a sort of buffer until the first paycheck kicked in. Not a comfortable place, but one I bet a lot of people could resonate with, and IMO a responsible use of credit.

acka 6y ago
I can confirm the strong deterrent towards having a credit card, any personal loans really, in the Netherlands. My bank, and I believe most banks in the Netherlands, requires proof of stable income well above minimum wage before even considering an application for a credit card. This puts credit cards out of reach of a sizable part of the population. Also, credit checks and reporting new lines of credit to the authorities by lenders are mandatory for all personal loans, be it for getting a mortgage, issuing a credit card, paying monthly installments for a smartphone bundled with a contract, or buying on credit from Dutch online stores or mail order catalogues.
aequitas 6y ago
To me (Dutch) the idea of using a personal credit card is very strange for anything other than because a website/shop doesn't accept any other form of payment. If you're a company, credit makes sense. You invest on a risk of getter a greater return in the future. But paying for your groceries or rent in advance should not be considered 'investing' in your personal life imho. You should just make due with what you have.
- m_mueller 6y ago
  From what I understand about the US, it is mainly to get better credit rating. This is apparently the most important social score in American society... Note to Americans: In European countries this tends not to be a thing afaik. Privacy is taken more seriously, so there is no central & privatized system to query for credit. However, to rent an apartment, get a loan or get a new job here in Switzerland it's often required to provide something like a credit register extract from the local government office. That register will get notified when someone isn't paying bills, usually after the third notification ~2 months after a bill was issued (notifying the register is costing fees, so businesses try to avoid it as much as possible). After a couple of years, entries get deleted. This way there is an attempt of balancing privacy, social mobility and the interest of businesses to collect their revenue.
  - edwintorok 6y ago
    Not just the US, the UK has credit scoring too, there I think 3 credit scoring agencies. When I moved here from Europe the entire notion of credit card and credit scoring was new to me. I still use my debit card whenever possible though, just spending enough on the credit card to avoid getting it cancelled due to not using it.
  - aequitas 6y ago
    Similar to what we have here. Only I don't think it common they check your credit score for a job application. Only when you want a new loan (mortgage, credit card, buy on credit, etc). You can also query the information yourself and see who requested access to it in the past months.
    - m_mueller 6y ago
      where is here, the US you mean? but the way I understand it, those credit score agencies are private, and their info is much more granular. e.g. it would never matter in CH and pretty much all of Europe, how much you already spent and payed off on credit in the past.
- 6y ago

amaccuish 6y ago

Same here in Germany. A normal credit card is a charge card, so billed every 30 days in full from the giro account. Credit cards that are rolling are rarer but slowly breaking their way through.

trthomps 6y ago
I mainly use an Amex charge card that functions like this, don't spend money I don't have, and only don't use a debit card for things because our financial system is very insecure and don't want to give the number out because getting my money back is a lot harder than just calling Amex and reporting the fraud.

hansoolo 6y ago

It's just a normal way of paying with money you actually HAVE, not money you "borrow" from a credit card company...

jacekm 6y ago

It's the same in Poland. I've never had a credit card in my life and honestly I don't feel any need for it. My debit cards work pretty much everywhere around the world, including internet payments (occasionally one card may have a hiccup so I always carry two cards from different banks)

C19is20 6y ago

€18 a year for just having a credit card? My bank can go f itself.

oakesm9 6y ago

Same in the UK. Both credit and debit cards tend to be MasterCard or Visa cards, so they can generally be used interchangeably. Personally, I only tend to use credit cards for larger purchases (flights, hotels, etc) because you get some better protections if things go wrong. Data: https://www.finder.com/uk/credit-card-statistics https://www.finder.com/uk/credit-card-statistics

eythian 6y ago

It costs the merchant more to process a credit card transaction, so they don't bother unless they're likely to get a lot of tourists. These days, more and more places are going cashless too, though those places generally always accept credit cards, otherwise it'd be really hard for overseas visitors to pay. I have a credit card here and only use it for international transactions[0], it has a fairly low limit to the point where if I'm, say, booking long-haul flights I need to pre-load it with money which fortunately only takes moments. This is partly by choice - as it's automatically paid off each month, I want to ensure I can never put more on it than will be in my bank account - but also that was the default limit when I got it. [0] local online transactions pretty much always use a system (iDeal) that goes via your bank website.